Capitals Fire Bruce Boudreau
by J.P. on Nov 28, 2011 8:18 AM EST
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Per the team, the Washington Capitals have fired head coach Bruce Boudreau and replaced him with Dale Hunter.
In four-plus seasons behind the Caps' bench, Boudreau amassed an impressive 201-88-40 regular season record and led the team to four-consecutive Southeast Division titles.
But his 2-4 playoff series record - losing all four to lower-seeded teams, culminating with a sweep at the hands of the Tampa Bay Lightning last spring - and the team's recent slide after a perfect 7-0-0 start, doomed Boudreau in D.C. What we noted in May (while advocating a change) seems even more true today:
[E]ither Bruce Boudreau had the wrong message, or he had the right one and was incapable of getting his players to execute it. Whichever it was, it's ultimately a poor reflection upon the coach - being an effective communicator and motivator is every bit as important as being an effective tactician and strategist here.
Actually, there's a third possible explanation, and it's potentially the most troubling of all. Perhaps it's the players - specifically the core players, in whom so many years and dollars are invested - who are simply incapable of receiving the message, insistent on freelancing and system-allergic. Bruce Boudreau could be the most brilliant hockey general to stand behind an NHL bench since Scotty Bowman, but if his charges are unable to process and execute his orders, the results won't reflect that acumen. But there's no way of knowing if that's the case without seeing how these players - most of whom have only played for Boudreau at the NHL level, at least since there were expectations heaped upon the team - respond to another voice, and the sooner the organization finds out what it has in the way-more-than-$100 million it has invested, the better.
Further to that last point, Boudreau's performance has been inextricably linked with that of his superstar, and as Alex Ovechkin has struggled over the past 18 months or so, Boudreau's inability to help him out of those struggles have come to the forefront:
"For as long as the league has been around there are a handful of guys who can make a difference and you really have to learn how to coach them," McPhee said on the morning of the Caps’ regular season opener.
"The rest, you open the door and they just go. It’s about teaching and coaching and showing the guys who can make a difference how to make a difference."
And while no single quote sealed his fate, this one from Boudreau's post-game presser last night encapsulates why his time was up:
"[Mental fortitude has] got to come from within, I’ve got to believe. I’m hoping that’s got to come from within because if I’ve got to teach them how to be tough, then I don’t know quite how to do that."
"Hoping" and "I don't know how" don't inspire a lot of confidence, and sure do sound eerily similar to some of Glen Hanlon's last words as Capitals bench boss nearly four years ago to the day (in fact, so do a lot of quotes). As George McPhee said then, "For the most part this year, I thought we were a team that played hard but wasn't getting rewarded. But the last few games, it looked like we had lost the team, and you can't ignore that." Don't be surprised to see a similar quote today.
Ultimately, it comes down to what we'd written in May:
To be sure, Bruce Boudreau isn't "The Problem" with the Washington Capitals. When a franchise suffers soul-crushing defeats in three-consecutive springs (or four, depending upon how easily one's soul is crushed), there's plenty of blame to go around. But, as the old sports cliché goes, you can't fire all the players, so it's usually the guy calling the shots who takes the fall. And in this case, that would probably be fair. Bruce Boudreau is a good coach and a great guy. But, for whatever reason, he's never been able to consistently extract from this Caps team a whole which is greater than the sum of its parts when it's mattered most. It's time to find someone who can.
There'll be plenty to discuss on this move - from the decision itself to the reasons behind it and what Hunter brings to the team - but for now we'd like to tip our cap to Coach Boudreau and thank him for all he's done for the team, its fans and the city. Bruce Boudreau may not have been the guy to take the Caps to the next level, but it's been a pleasure to watch and cover him over the past handful of years, and we wish him nothing but the best in whatever he does next.
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Hunter strikes me as a desperation move to placate the fans. To me that’s too big a risk for the team as currently built.
Then again, maybe the thinking is the team is good enough that a new voice, any new voice, can get them going again. Here’s hoping.
And agree, huge tip of the Cap to BB for his time here. He made this team relevant again, starting with his time in Hershey building the core, turning this into a team that was a joy to watch at the NHL level.
I sort of agree. Hunter seems an odd choice for a contender, but apparently GMGM and Ted have agreed that they need to find out if it’s Bruce that’s the problem or the players.
You tried your best and failed miserably. The lesson is "Never Try."
Hope this isn’t akin to bringing back Joe Gibbs for the fans. Time will tell I guess, but please, not too much time.
"One of the most difficult things everyone has to learn is that for your entire life you must keep fighting and adjusting if you hope to survive." -George Allen
to be fair, Joe Gibbs did remarkably well his second time around. 2 playoff berths and a playoff win for the first time in a decade is nothing to cough at.
Haha
Especially considering the franchise he was running, and the success of those that came before, AND after him.
Where do they teach you to talk like this? In some Panama City "Sailor wanna hump-hump" bar, or is it getaway day and your last shot at his whiskey? Sell crazy someplace else, we're all stocked up here.
And that win was with Mark “Suck” Brunell no less. Still think it’s the worst performance by a QB in a playoff win.
But yeah, to your comparison point, the 2nd coming of Joe Gibbs was the most success the Skins have seen in the last 12 years. Not sure how Hunter compares to Gibbs seeing as Gibbs had won 3 Super Bowls at the NFL level though.
Everything ends badly...otherwise it wouldn't end.
by Davethecapsfan on Nov 28, 2011 10:41 AM EST up reply actions
I wasn’t really making a comparison, mostly disputing the fact that Gibbs was primarily a fan hire and the implication that he was not a successful one.
Yeah that was directed at caps&skins he made the comparison. Was trying to continue your argument
Everything ends badly...otherwise it wouldn't end.
by Davethecapsfan on Nov 28, 2011 11:55 AM EST up reply actions
I think that’s more an indictment of the incredible level of suck the Redskins have displayed over the past 20 years.
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It’s true that ashburn/landover is the land of suck where good football goes to die and bad football thrives like a festering bed sore but retrospectively, Gibbs was able to find the wins where no other coach was with mostly the same group of guys (possibly with the best ratio of talent to achievement in the league (as in there was a lot of talent with little to no achievement), their record and performance on the field don’t really give a good indication of how talented the roster was, just that there was little chemistry).
To bring it back to the caps, hopefully hunter can bring out the achievement in the talent, particularly in the post season. I don’t know about his coaching style but his play was gritty and that’s something this team has lacked.
I don’t think they would fire him just because the fans are saying this or that. They made a decision, lets see what happens.
Well, I agree mostly. Until it starts affecting ticket sales. But Hunter rather than some of the other options strikes me as an emotional choice, that’s all. That might be what the guys need but it just seems like a big risk.
GMGM makes rational decisions. I doubt this is an emotional choice on his part.
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I’ve yet to see GMGM make an emotional choice off the ice, so I’ll trust him till he proves me wrong.
Note: Counting September 25, 1999 as an on ice incident.
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His loyal solider extensions don’t count? If those were rational, his decision-making process was flawed.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:49 AM EST up reply actions
I would say that would depend on his objective on the loyal soldier contracts.
by Gin and Tonic on Nov 28, 2011 9:59 AM EST up reply actions
Unless he has numbers showing that those extensions help attract talent for bargains down the road.
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I believe in next year.
by red army line on Nov 28, 2011 1:17 PM EST up reply actions
Hunter strikes me as a desperation move to placate the fans.
Spoken like a fan. For all of us, our most recent strong memories of Hunter are in the black and copper jersey.
But McPhee’s not a fan. McPhee and his scouts have watched the guy coach, have scouted his players, have even encouraged their own draft picks to go play in London. This isn’t a pick primarily because the guy’s a legend who the fans would like. This is a pick primarily made from familiarity with how the guy coaches.
I can’t wait for the early interviews with Wideman, with Carlson, and with Hunter himself to find out what his coaching style is really like.
"Fais gros comme moi!" - Alex Ovechkin
by Gould Old Days on Nov 28, 2011 9:39 AM EST up reply actions 7 recs
I really think Hunter is going to be a good coach…just think this was odd timing to bring him in. Then again, this team DOES have the firepower to outscore (yea, I said it) an opponent when they actually want to….so maybe even if they’re slow to pick up the system, they can still go at it for awhile and win games.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 9:41 AM EST up reply actions
It’s worth noting that 16-20 year olds are a different kettle of fish from adults with guaranteed multi-million dollar contracts. I don’t know how much applicability his motivational style will have to this new demographic.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:43 AM EST up reply actions
If Hunter’s title were “Interim Head Coach,” I would have fewer qualms. It’s kind of a sizeable leap.
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by CapitalCentre on Nov 28, 2011 10:11 AM EST up reply actions
You can’t bring a guy in from juniors and give him the “interim” tag, though
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by renstar on Nov 28, 2011 10:12 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
sure you can. Why not? Happens with AHL coaches.
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but that is usually at least within the organization.
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by renstar on Nov 28, 2011 10:16 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I’m just not entirely sure handing the keys to a guy with no NHL coaching experience for the rest of the season is the right move.
But by all means, Mr. Hunter, prove me wrong.
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Regardless of whether the tag is there or not, he’s interim. If the Caps continue to flounder, they’ll replace him (and a whole bunch of other people as well, I should add).
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Joe Paterno was interim. Every coach is interim.
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by Whiter Mage on Nov 28, 2011 12:02 PM EST up reply actions
Hunter strikes me as a desperation move to placate the fans.
If this were the Redskins I might agree with you. I’m willing to five GMGM the benefit of the doubt. His decision-making process has been shrewd and meticulous in the past.
Well then.
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Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
by Bald Pollack on Nov 28, 2011 8:22 AM EST reply actions 10 recs
This was me in my living room a few minutes ago when my buddy called me telling me he had been blowing up my cell phone which I had left upstairs.
Everything ends badly...otherwise it wouldn't end.
by Davethecapsfan on Nov 28, 2011 9:29 AM EST up reply actions
This is probably the only moment in my life where I had wished I had seen that movie so I knew what they were saying
Someone correct me if I’m wrong, but I believe the phrase is, “Shit just got real.”
by BradleyFightingVehicle on Nov 28, 2011 9:46 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
It is, and I only know this because of watching Hot Fuzz, not Bad Boys.
There's always more to learn about Hockey.
by WordsOnIce on Nov 28, 2011 9:47 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I wasn’t around this board when Hanlon was fired. Was was the general consensus back then with replacing him with Bruce?
I imagine it was mostly .. “Meh!”
Mine was cautious optimism. I had never really heard of the guy, but he had success at the previous level. That year (coupled with teh trade deadline acquisitions that year) was just gravy. It was fun to watch hockey again.
I really hope it can be fun to watch hockey again this year. The complete bed shitting play drove so much of the joy out of the games for me. When the caps are playing well, I watch a ton of non-caps hockey. When they are bad, I look for anything but hockey. I can’t stand to see games where all I can think is “why can’t the caps do that? they are plenty talented…”
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by renstar on Nov 28, 2011 9:51 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
The Caps had a whooping 6 wins that season. SIX. Hanlon had to go. That didn’t surprise me. What shocked me was promoting, even on an interim basis, this career minor-leaguer.
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It actually made alot of sense. That team was terrible, and the teams before it were terrible too. GMGM must have expected BB to be competent and he must have hoped for the team to get to 500. There was no way he could have expected that BB would catch lightening in a bottle.
In that case, an interim minor league hire allows him to see who is available in the off season.
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it made sense looking back on it. Hung over on Thanksgiving morning?
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I hope I’m wrong, but I think this is a big mistake. A team expected to win big now should not hire a guy with ZERO AHL/NHL coaching experience. ZERO. This smacks of despiration and, nostalgia aside, I don’t see this working at all. Hope I’m wrong. This is not a good move, IMO. Particularly with coaches out there who have won Stanley Cups and other hardware. Bad move.
Just trying to capture the spirit of the thing...
by dcsportsfan1 on Nov 28, 2011 8:23 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
I agree, I think it’s a desperation move. Maybe they are hoping that the players respond to a hall of fame player
you’ve got to think, though, that GMGM has been talking to Hunter for some time and assessing his potential, right?
If you want to survive out here, you've got to know where your towel is.
by ns on Nov 28, 2011 8:26 AM EST up reply actions
Absolutely. I don’t believe GMGM or any smart executive makes quick decisions like this.
Nice guys finish first, but sometimes the season is awfully long.
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We don’t really know if it’s a “quick decision”
They could have been planning this for some time for all we know
Agreed. Presumably he was evaluating all along, especially after the end of last year. Not a shotgun decision here.
Boudreau’s comments after the Sabres’ game might have been the final straw.
Nice guys finish first, but sometimes the season is awfully long.
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Straws
Truly there have been numerous straws. Massive straws. A single one of them could have broken the back of a weaker GM. 4 shorties in one week? 2 in one game? how many times this season have we taken a one goal lead into overtime because of a desperation goal? How can a highly touted goalie like Vokoun come to the caps and suddenly look so pedestrian? Even Neuvirth looks like he’s taken a step back. This team hasn’t been focused since Edmonton. Even some of the early games were shaky even though we were winning them.
But yeah, “I don’t know what to do” sounds a lot more like: “kick me”.
I’m trying to remember what it was like with the seven game winning streak at the beginning of the season, and the thorough schooling of the champs.
I just don’t understand where all that positive mo went and why.
There's always more to learn about Hockey.
Green went
for one thing. It’s really sad when your most important player is a fragile little butterfly.
Vokoun has had some stellar games but when he’s off we might as well be playing with an open net…Shame that Varly was a fragile butterfly as well.
when not physically fragile, apparently Varly is mentally fragile. it’s not been pretty, from what I understand
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Meh, I give the guy the benefit of the doubt after what he went through with Lokomotiv. Also not having a full time goalie coach doesn’t help. He has been mentally fragile this season but he has rebounded some in the past two games, with .929 and .939 sv %. They even won the last game. He starts tonight.
by vtcapsfan99 on Nov 28, 2011 11:41 AM EST up reply actions
Maybe un-benched. He played well this weekend.
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Yea…he was improved this weekend, but JSG is getting a lot more time.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 10:55 AM EST up reply actions
Giggy has played 8 games. He played 3 in a row while Varly got back on track. I thought Giggy was exposed somewhat in his last game against San Jose, a better team than most other teams he played (.824 sv% in that game). Varly played the last two games, and he is starting tonight. He’s played 16 games so far.
by vtcapsfan99 on Nov 28, 2011 11:46 AM EST up reply actions
so long as they keep losing, though, that’s good for us. I had a horrible thought the other day that there is a chance that we could have the first two picks.
Boudreau’s comments after the Sabres’ game might have been the final straw.
You just can’t tell the media “I dont know how to motivate them.”
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by renstar on Nov 28, 2011 10:41 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Yes, to me it was BB plea to put him out of his missery.
What doesnt kill you makes you stronger.
by BetterOffWith28 on Nov 28, 2011 11:01 AM EST up reply actions
that’s how I read it. He knew he was done and that was his way of saying “do it now” without actually saying “fire me”
by Beakers Lab on Nov 28, 2011 11:02 AM EST up reply actions
I think Hunter has great potential, don’t get me wrong there, my concern is that he’s making a jump from the OHL to the NHL and there is going to be a significant learning curve. Are we wasting the 1 year of Vokoun while Hunter gets his legs under him at this level?
Were the Caps going to win a Stanley Cup with Bruce with the way the guys were playing right now? If not, then the year was wasted anyway. Vokoun’s one-year deal was a “Stanley Cup or bust” move. I don’t see him resigning here next year if he wants a salary more aligned with what he was making previously.
I'm not too concerned about goaltending.
Vokoun is good, but we still have neuvy, who is still young and battling a slump. There’s also braden holtby waiting in the wings.
Geting it done.
by Knowledge92 on Nov 28, 2011 12:00 PM EST up reply actions
But 11 seasons coaching counts for something, doesn’t it? I have no doubt that some people, somewhere, thought Alan May would have made a great coach (I said it as a joke).
Yes, I’m not saying Hunts is clueless about coaching hockey. But you can’t compare OHL to AHL or NHL. For starters, the OHL guys are not on long term, high $ contracts like NHL guys. They will work their butts off to try and get to the next level. Especially if the coach is also the GM and owner of the team.
I hope Hunts gives these guys the kick in the ass they need. I think he can properly motivate, but I question long term viability of this move.
Just trying to capture the spirit of the thing...
by dcsportsfan1 on Nov 28, 2011 8:43 AM EST up reply actions
eh. Just strictly from personal experience, I had tons and tons of success developing lower level gymnasts. The one kid I ever took to the very highest levels? A brain dead monkey could have done the same thing. I wish Dale the best success, but I’m wary.
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by RedBirdie on Nov 28, 2011 9:27 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Seems like the same could be said for Boudreau, though. At some point, playing above your level is going to catch up with you. Icaraus and what not. We’ll find out if that is the case with his next job.
(and just to be clear, I insinuate nothing about you or your experience, RB, I’m just extrapolating to BB)
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true true. I think Bruce is a great developmental coach and perhaps where he shines brightest. I think, perhaps, hw could have been incredibly successful as an NCAA coach.
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Probably so. I suspect Jerry York would eat his lunch, but that Boudreau would have his own share of victories there.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:44 AM EST up reply actions
On the experience issue —
Assuming Bruce had lost the room and was going to be fired no matter what, do folks think that since this is a mid-season change, the Caps should have hired someone the Caps think is a worse coach than Hunter (or who has worse potential) just because that guy has more NHL experience?
"Fais gros comme moi!" - Alex Ovechkin
by Gould Old Days on Nov 28, 2011 9:59 AM EST up reply actions
Your wording only allows a “no” answer.
The real question is whether they could have gotten someone better than Hunter if they ahd pulled the trigger last June.
We don’t have enough info on any of the guys that might be candidates to really answer that question. What are they really like, how to the interview, what does the team respond to, etc.
I would have liked to see Hartley or maybe MacT…but based only on the fact that the Caps probably needed some structure and Hartley’s teams always seemed to have it and MacT seemed like he could command the respect of guys like AO and Backstrom.
The other thing here is that the new guy generally seems to take a different tone from the old guy – if he was a bastard, then the new guy lightens things up, and vice versa. With BB having gone from player’s coach to disciplinarian, I’m not sure there’s an obvious new foot to start on, so to speak. Water under the bridge, of course.
But I’m skeptical that Hunter is the right guy.
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Wow. We’ve talked and talked about this, but now that it’s happened it’s kind of surreal.
Say no to Prince Fielder in 2012.
by Knubles and Bits on Nov 28, 2011 8:24 AM EST via mobile reply actions 1 recs
Yeah I feel the same way. “Holy cow” was my reaction.
by capsyoungguns on Nov 28, 2011 8:50 AM EST up reply actions
I knew it was coming, I wanted it, but I’m still sad.
by BJ Ghassemieh on Nov 28, 2011 8:24 AM EST reply actions 6 recs
same. best of luck to Bruce and his family, as they seem like exceptionally awesome and well-grounded people. Bruce will land on his feet elsewhere, I have no doubt.
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right on
"Fais gros comme moi!" - Alex Ovechkin
by Gould Old Days on Nov 28, 2011 10:40 AM EST up reply actions
Let me play both sides for sec.
If I stick to my guns, I think this says that GMGM and Ted finally concluded that Boudreau isn’t the long term solution, and that Hunter gives them a better chance to win in future years. I love the emotional part of the Boudreau hiring, but am hard pressed to see how this gives them a better chance to win this year.
On the other hand, I love the hiring from an emotional perspective and am willing to give Hunter some room to run. I loved his attitude as a player and there is great emotion to bring back a guy with his history with this team.
Oh – and thanks Caps for now finding a way to distract me for the entire day.
Nice guys finish first, but sometimes the season is awfully long.
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I think you’re right. It is a way to get them re-charged RIGHT NOW. An end to their funk. It will be exciting, if nothing else. Brings back a fan favorite, a respected player in the locker room to fire up the team, shows loyalty…
By keeping all the assistant coaches, it will make the transition easier for Hunter.
It could also be short term. GMGM could continue his long term search and Hunter could go back to the Knights at the end of the season.
Aye yaye yaye
He’s going to need Hadeed to clean those carpets after he’s done freaking out
by Brainumbc on Nov 28, 2011 8:27 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
Sorry to see BB go…and I’m sure he’ll land on his feet come April (at the latest). It’s bittersweet because BB brought hockey back to DC. As for Hunter, I’m thrilled he’s back with the organization but am nervous about bringing in a guy with zippy experience dealing with multi million dollar personalities.
/can’t believe this isn’t being talked about on CSN right now
So Question
Will any other team pick him up? Teams seem to freak out more and make moves with the coaches well before the trade deadline for players.
Are there any other teams that need a change of coach that would be happy to pick Bruce up?
Maybe not this year, but he’ll get another job. The list of coaches fired and rehired elsewhere is long and storied.
Nice guys finish first, but sometimes the season is awfully long.
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Yeah, if that happened today I’m going to immediately wonder “what if?”
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by Bald Pollack on Nov 28, 2011 8:51 AM EST up reply actions
That was my thought.
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Well, same here, just thinking about fit. Don’t know how much control GMGM will have over what he does next.
If he’s still under contract, any team has to get George’s permission to talk to him, don’t they?
by Murshawursha on Nov 28, 2011 9:16 AM EST up reply actions
unless is it for gross misconduct, nearly all fired coaches remain under contract and get paid. Other teams need the permission of the firing team to speak to the coach. As an example, Fridge was still under contract with Maryland and got paid.
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by RedBirdie on Nov 28, 2011 10:23 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Firing isn’t termination of the contract. Guy still gets paid, usually they have him scout for the team or something to earn it but at least some portion of it is guaranteed.
Am I the only one thinking he’d be perfect in Carolina
Heh. How about Winnipeg?
We wouldn’t have to see him 6 times a year after this year :P
Don’t do that to Fehr!
Are you not entertained?
by Seminrocks on Nov 28, 2011 8:57 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
“This just in, Jets pick up BB as head coach”
Fehr:: “F%#$#KG@@DMN&@$&^!”
by Brainumbc on Nov 28, 2011 8:58 AM EST up reply actions 11 recs
He’s still under contract to the Caps, right? Don’t the Caps have to give permission?
Nice guys finish first, but sometimes the season is awfully long.
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Usually, but it may depend on how the contract is worded. And I think there are limits to what they can allow/disallow (like they can allow him to seek another HC job but that can’t restrict him from going anywhere specific, I think. Not positive though).
I would think that because he’s fired, BB would be pretty much free to go anywhere. It would be different if he resigned.
You tried your best and failed miserably. The lesson is "Never Try."
Blues had to ask Columbus for permission to hire Hitchcock.
"The Caps fan doesn't say, 'is the glass half full' or 'is the glass half empty'. He wonders when the glass is going to spill."
He was still under contract with the Blue Jackets.
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That was my point. Bruce is still under contract with the Caps for as long as he draws a check.
"The Caps fan doesn't say, 'is the glass half full' or 'is the glass half empty'. He wonders when the glass is going to spill."
Unless they just pay him off right away and let him go on his way. Hitch was actually scouting for the BJ’s. The situation was odd as he was around the team at times still.
I’m trying to think back to a time where an NHL team would have ever stopped a coach they fired from taking another gig. Not smart to treat people that way. Gives an org a bad rep.
The Artist Formerly Known as CP2Devil.
Associate Editor at Five For Howling.
He’s still under contract, and more importantly, still getting paid. Here’s hoping he’ll land on his feet out west somewhere and end up losing to the Caps in the Finals in a couple of years. ;-)
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 9:25 AM EST up reply actions
It also seems like BB has hit about the average lifespan of a coach for his team. I can dig and get some stats, but just from memory it would seem like most coaches last with a team on average.. 4 years? OK guess or am I way off?
I don’t know about that, but Caps coaches tend to get as far in the playoffs as they can in their first couple of years. So… switch coaches every three years?
You tried your best and failed miserably. The lesson is "Never Try."
switch coaches every three years?
Or four :) I’m trying to find a comparable coach who did well at first and then changed teams and did better.
I want to say Scotty Bowman, but according to wiki, he made it to the finals and lost in his first 3 seasons in a row, then crapped out first round, THEN he switched teams and won the cup second year with his team.
Looks like even Scotty hit a brick wall with one team and did well at another (or OthErs).
Not saying BB = SB. But hey, maybe it takes a new cast of characters to get where you want to be. Good luck, bruce. May we meet in the finals one day for an epic showdown :)
he made it to the finals and lost in his first 3 seasons in a row
This was back when whichever expansion team “won” the expansion division made the Cup finals.
Unleash the Apathy.
From 1967 until some time in the early 70s, the NHL had two divisions, one consisting entirely of the Original 6, and the other consisting entirely of expansion teams. They each played intra-division playoffs, then met for the Cup finals.
Unleash the Apathy.
Interesting fact. The only times Scotty Bowman lost in the Finals, his team was swept. If his team won one game in the Finals, they won the Cup.
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 10:03 AM EST up reply actions
Boom goes the dynamite, am I worry? . I’m not worried. I don’t know , Dale Hunter? Wow
What doesnt kill you makes you stronger.
by BetterOffWith28 on Nov 28, 2011 8:31 AM EST via mobile reply actions
I’m sad to see Bruce go. I really wanted him to be THE coach that got the caps to the promised land. I can’t say I didn’t see this coming, and I can’t say I don’t think it necessary, but Bruce seemed like such a likable guy, I wanted him to succeed.
That being said, Dale has been a great coach in the Juniors for years. We’ve seen unproved NHL experience less coaches like Dan Bylsma and Guy Boucher come right in and help good teams win, I expect the same from Hunter.
I don’t think this smells like desperation. It smells like a team that MAY have been just a little too loyal, finally making the move they considered over the summer.
Because now I can justify browsing and commenting during the work day with the argument that I am promoting my business.
by Sombrero Guy on Nov 28, 2011 8:32 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Bylsma and Boucher had AHL experience. Hunts not so much.
Just trying to capture the spirit of the thing...
by dcsportsfan1 on Nov 28, 2011 8:38 AM EST up reply actions
54 games and one season respectively, right?
I don’t like this move for the timing, or for the selection available because of the timing, but I’m glad McPhee isn’t throwing good season after bad if he thinks that Boudreau’s lost the room.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:03 AM EST up reply actions
Boucher jumped from Juniors to NHL.
Because now I can justify browsing and commenting during the work day with the argument that I am promoting my business.
by Sombrero Guy on Nov 28, 2011 9:03 AM EST up reply actions
Ah my bad, he did have that partial season with Hamilton.
Because now I can justify browsing and commenting during the work day with the argument that I am promoting my business.
by Sombrero Guy on Nov 28, 2011 9:04 AM EST up reply actions
that’s who I was thinking of. Thanks!
Because now I can justify browsing and commenting during the work day with the argument that I am promoting my business.
by Sombrero Guy on Nov 28, 2011 9:05 AM EST up reply actions
No, he spent a year coaching Hamilton first.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:04 AM EST up reply actions
And had a bunch of experience with the U-20s (I think) in Canada.
"My favorite fan base in D.C. Is United's. Period. The end." - Steinberg
Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
by Bald Pollack on Nov 28, 2011 9:05 AM EST up reply actions
Hunter has also been running/owning what has been THE premier junior team/franchise of the last two decades. I think the dude knows a thing or two about hockey.
Unleash the Apathy.
by D'ohboy on Nov 28, 2011 9:19 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Yeah, they’re really hot shit up there. Windsor’s been better the last few years, but that team was crazy loaded.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:26 AM EST up reply actions
there’s a reason that the Caps pushed Carlson to go to London and not whichever US university he committed to.
Pledge Drive 2011-2012: CARSON KOLZIG FOUNDATION! Season Pledge total--$403.25!
Pledge Drive 2011-2012: CARSON KOLZIG FOUNDATION! Season Pledge total--$403.25!
UMass- It’s educational! (sorry Pixies OT)
by Rather Bengt on Nov 28, 2011 9:48 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Absolutely.
A danger to myself and others on the ice
by can't skate on Nov 28, 2011 10:01 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Agree. I hope to see BB hosting a Cup some day, but only after the Caps have won a few. Thanks for some great memories Bruce!
by capsrus on Nov 28, 2011 9:01 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Thank you Bruce for giving us some winning hockey
Hopefully the new regime means a positive change for results.
by thewiz06 on Nov 28, 2011 8:33 AM EST via mobile reply actions 28 recs
And I’ll add a bon voyage to Bruce and I wish him success wherever he ends up. He seems like a genuinely good guy who loves the game of hockey, it’s just too bad he couldn’t get over the hump here, for him and for us.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:04 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
He was a fantastic guy, sad to see him go, but not at all surprised. Felt like something had to give.
Check out a new social network, Hockey Connect, a place for coaches, players, family and fans to share strategies and experiences.
I miss his great commercials with the Arlington Mercedes dealership (American Service Center)
and with Hadeed carpeting.
That “really big cup holder” is just going to waste.
by JimCareyFanClub on Nov 28, 2011 9:51 AM EST up reply actions
That commercial sealed his fate.
↑ ↑ ↓ ↓ ← → ← → b a (select) start
by renstar on Nov 28, 2011 9:52 AM EST up reply actions 5 recs
my favorite was the bird calling actually
the close second was the one where he wanted to upgrade his lease but not the price, “but but but!”
dancing with Ryan Zimmerman!
Pledge Drive 2011-2012: CARSON KOLZIG FOUNDATION! Season Pledge total--$403.25!
My favorite line he ever had was saying he was going to have a garden salad. He said it with such glee.
There's always more to learn about Hockey.
ugh, i hated that “but but but” commercial
What doesnt kill you makes you stronger.
by BetterOffWith28 on Nov 28, 2011 10:20 AM EST up reply actions
Sometimes a team just tunes out the coach after a while … maybe that was the case here. We’ll see how it goes.
I think BB will be fine, and he’ll probably land another coaching job soon enough. I will be sad to see him go, but hopefully Hunter can get the team to where it needs to be.
Assumption is the mother of all @#%-ups.
Recommended reading: Death to the BCS
Not that I expected or even desired Hunter as a new HC, but I did just get a little excited for tomorrow’s game.
That'll make your weagle wink!
The pants that bind us should be left behind us.
Tweet me. If you dare. @nicraymond
by boutros23 on Nov 28, 2011 8:34 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
How many STHs are pulling their tickets off the Ticket Exchange right now? I know I’m looking for some tickets now.
Wow, that’s not even close to cost. Jump on those now.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:04 AM EST up reply actions
We were debating whether or not to go tomorrow (attempted to sell the tickets). Made our decision easy.
"The Caps fan doesn't say, 'is the glass half full' or 'is the glass half empty'. He wonders when the glass is going to spill."
Unfortunately, I will have to watch on FoxSports Midwest with Kelly and Panger. All else is blacked out here. I’ll have to get home early enough to catch the pregame on Comcast.
Nice guys finish first, but sometimes the season is awfully long.
Follow me on Twitter.
So, fake Kypreos twitter was right.
Comrades, leave me here a little, while as yet 't is early morn:
Leave me here, and when you want me, sound upon the bugle-horn
Blind squirrel and nuts.
Nice guys finish first, but sometimes the season is awfully long.
Follow me on Twitter.
Nah, Kypper and Hunts played together. Would not be surprised if Hunts gave him the heads up. Clearly this decision was made yesterday at the latest.
Just trying to capture the spirit of the thing...
by dcsportsfan1 on Nov 28, 2011 8:39 AM EST up reply actions
I’m guessing Woods and Evason will finish out the year, but I wonder who Dale has in mind for assistants.
You tried your best and failed miserably. The lesson is "Never Try."
Bondra and Pivonka because why not
Comrades, leave me here a little, while as yet 't is early morn:
Leave me here, and when you want me, sound upon the bugle-horn
“were putting the band back together”
by ididntdoit on Nov 28, 2011 8:49 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
I hope Caps fans don’t let Hunter off the hook too easily, just because he’s Dale Hunter.
a capital wasteland - art & hockey from washington, d.c.
Don’t see how Turgeon fits into his decision-making with personnel honestly.
"My favorite fan base in D.C. Is United's. Period. The end." - Steinberg
Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
by Bald Pollack on Nov 28, 2011 8:38 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Turgeon had it coming. Just like Draper.
Unleash the Apathy.
by D'ohboy on Nov 28, 2011 9:05 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
Rec’d for truth.
"My favorite fan base in D.C. Is United's. Period. The end." - Steinberg
Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
by Bald Pollack on Nov 28, 2011 9:06 AM EST up reply actions
Draper got his face messed up, and when they fixed it, they left it looking like it did… I’d sue for malpractice.
Of course, that incident led to one of the great quotes in sports from Dino Cicciarelli, “I can’t believe I shook they guy’s freaking hand.”
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 9:14 AM EST up reply actions
Claude Lemieux can’t hear all the criticism, what with the Stanley Cup rings plugging his ears and his arms covering his head while he’s curled up in the fetal position.
Unleash the Apathy.
by D'ohboy on Nov 28, 2011 9:21 AM EST up reply actions 8 recs
I hope Caps fans don’t let Hunter off the hook too easily
I don’t see that happening. Caps fans deservingly have high expectations and we expect winning. I don’t expect to see it overnight, but it could happen. Either way, something had to be done and should have earlier.
"Before you diagnose yourself with depression or low self-esteem, first make sure that you’re not, in fact, surrounded by assholes." - William Gibson
by Kevin Ewoldt on Nov 28, 2011 8:40 AM EST up reply actions
Interesting thought… Can he get Semin to take smarter penalties?
Geeks of All Nations, Compile!
by AMusingFool on Nov 28, 2011 12:41 PM EST up reply actions
Fuck no, he’s a Caps legend, but he’s also a dirty son-of-a-bitch. The Caps could use some of that mentality, but playing to injure people has never been okay.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:06 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
I don’t think it’s in dispute that what Bobby Clarke did was reprehensible. Canada and/or the US celebrated it because of the political climate, but Bobby Clarke is scumbag.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:23 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
I don’t think it’s in dispute that what Bobby Clarke did was reprehensible.
Maybe outside of Canada…
Release the Mackan!
by Killer_Carlson on Nov 28, 2011 12:34 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
As someone who always has criticized the team for clinging to the status quo, I have to be fair today and give GMGM and Leonsis credit for finally doing so. When we asked for the team to start changing the script, this is what we were asking for.
Thank you Coach Boudreau for everything you did for this team, especially early on in your tenure. Unfortunately, it did not end with a Stanley Cup, but it was successful nonetheless. Here’s to the Dale Hunter era having Boudreau’s success and more.
Does anybody have a take on Hunter’s coaching style/philosophy?
I'll never put on a life jacket again
Distract the refs, kick players while down :)
by Brainumbc on Nov 28, 2011 8:44 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
Seriously. Some people thrive on being first on everything in life:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dale_Hunter
Dale Robert Hunter (born July 31, 1960) is a Canadian former ice hockey player and current head coach of the Washington Capitals of the National Hockey League.
version history is always fun
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Dale_Hunter&action=history
(cur | prev) 13:33, 28 November 2011 Fool4jesus (talk | contribs) (20,608 bytes) (→Post-NHL: Head coach Capitals) (undo)
We will miss you Bruce! Thats for pulling this franchise out of the dumps!
Players win championships at the end of the day…lets see how much they want it.
by SA-Town on Nov 28, 2011 8:47 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
As many are noting, mid-season there are limited options. Not so easy to get a coach who is employed mid-season whether an Asst coach at NHL level or Asst coach or head coach at another level. Hunter’s situation in London offers him the option that other’s don’t have; of course this isn’t the first time Hunter has been linked (more than linked now) to a Caps coaching replacement either.
Thought it was telling that all 3 Hunter’s (Dale, Mark, Dylan) were behind the bench coaching London in yesterday’s game.
so what's on the checklist for Hunter to fix?
I’ll get us started:
1. Forward backchecking
2. Power play
3. Defensive zone breakout (still?)
4. Unneuter Ovie
If you want to survive out here, you've got to know where your towel is.
Hunter didn’t take very well to Dimitri Khristich when they overlapped tenures in DC. Unless he’s mellowed in his age, it’s hard to think he’d have much patience for Semin once the honeymoon period is over.
That depends entirely on the return the team can get for him, IMO.
If Hunter can turn him around, or if McPhee can get a bus-driver for him, then bully. But I don’t think the latter is going to happen and I don’t think less represents value against holding him and hoping he gets hot for the playoffs, unless you think that a guy that noticeably improves the team is available at the deadline and the team will need the space.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:08 AM EST up reply actions
I could see him getting good profits from Semin. He’s not getting that much money for his potential and I’m sure there are several teams out there who will think they can get that potential out of him.
I’m thinking a high round draft pick and/or a defensemen/center from a team that needs wingers and isn’t lacking in the other areas.
Can’t agree more. I like Semin, but I think his time his up as well =/
If you want to survive out here, you've got to know where your towel is.
by ns on Nov 28, 2011 9:08 AM EST up reply actions
I still think a Semin for Stastny swap makes too much sense. Colorado is fed up with Stastny and is deep at center. The salaries are a wash.
Unleash the Apathy.
I’d have a heart-attack. I would love the shit out of that move for the Caps, not so much if I were a COL fan.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:24 AM EST up reply actions
Would you give them one of their picks back?
"Fais gros comme moi!" - Alex Ovechkin
by Gould Old Days on Nov 28, 2011 9:29 AM EST up reply actions
I think I value 1sts more than other people because of the ELC and RFA implications, so I wouldn’t give that back. I’d sweeten it with the 2nd (maybe both teams’ 2nds).
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:30 AM EST up reply actions
The term isn’t, and Semin would likely have to be willing to sign more than a 1 year contract. Unless COL wants to shed long term dollars…
Do they have anyone they need to open up space for?
↑ ↑ ↓ ↓ ← → ← → b a (select) start
Duchene is an RFA after this season.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:27 AM EST up reply actions
Fed up with Stastny?
My understanding is there were some frustrations and he listened to them and worked on his skating, etc., this off-season.
He said he worked on it, but he’s been pretty mediocre this year. O’Reilly has essentially passed him on the depth chart.
Unleash the Apathy.
Dater just wrote an blog saying people in the Avs management were fed up with Stastny. The fans are definitely frustrated with him. I’ve watched almost every single Avs game this season and I haven’t been overly impressed by him but I wasn’t concentrating on watching his play either.
by vtcapsfan99 on Nov 28, 2011 11:58 AM EST up reply actions
If the Avs are fed up with Stastny and want to move him, they’ll have 29 teams calling to make a deal
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 10:06 AM EST up reply actions
Ehhh, I’m not so sure. He’s on the hook for $6.6m for the next several years and his play has declined over the last couple seasons.
Unleash the Apathy.
A change of scenery is what he needs, esp. since he knows that his team is going nowhere (and getting there very quickly!)
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 10:33 AM EST up reply actions
Right, but there aren’t many teams in the league that want to fork over $6.6m for a #2C. The only teams that would likely do that are Cup contenders, or teams that think they’re close to contending. Most of those teams already have a good #2C. I think Johansson has been good so far this year, but bringing in Stastny suddenly gives the Caps the kind of depth down the middle that only teams like Pittsburgh have.
Unleash the Apathy.
At this point, I don’t think anyone has patience for Semin. I’ve never seen much indication that Bruce has ever worked with Semin on the ice to teach him how to move his feet and not use his stick, which is how he commits penalties. I’ve read that Semin is the kind of player who needs discipline and a clear direction. Maybe Hunter can provide that.
5. Roll the same lines for like a week, just for kix
6. Heap responsibility on 28
....when the truth is if they knew anything about the game, they'd be in it.
--GMGM
Vokoun has been a rebound nightmare nearly all season. He can’t seem to secure the puck on most shots. Meh.
If you want to survive out here, you've got to know where your towel is.
by ns on Nov 28, 2011 9:07 AM EST up reply actions
1) Getting Ovechkin to play at Backstroms level
2) The Defense
3) The PP
4) Semin.
Are the major problems imo
Bruce Boudreau when asked about Brooks Laich's return to the lineup, he said: "He just adds another dimension to our team. If it was puzzle, he just fits that thing. He completes us."
Brooks Laich completing everything from teams to tires and everything in between.
1) Getting Ovechkin to play at Backstroms level
Then go back to the one really great thing that worked in the last few years: Knuble on top line. Let Nikkie and Ovi just go nuts and do what they do, and let Knuble either bury their botched attempts at juggling or clean up the mess they made by getting his ass back quick.
That’s why TB20 is here. Way quicker to get back.. now is he doing that? Not so much.
Look at me, Dustin! I'm a F%^king Icon!
He is potting some goals on that line though…and we have seen spurts of it being effective the pressure him and Ovie can put on opposing D men physically.
Everything ends badly...otherwise it wouldn't end.
by Davethecapsfan on Nov 28, 2011 9:36 AM EST up reply actions
If his job was more clear, I bet he’d be a killer, younger version of Knuble.
Troy, you’re good, but you’re there to clean up. Just sit back and watch the Ovi-Nikki circus.
But then there’s the double edged blade the third wheel on the top line. You’re going to get a ton of goals if you swoop in and just bury the puck that just undressed the entire opposing team.
But if you miss… you’re stuck with #8 and #19 and all your momentum is going the wrong way during the other team’s breakout.
I don’t think Brouwer has as much feel for the game, or the hands, that Knuble does. They play different roles – Brouwer is a hitter, a guy that can grind down other teams over the course of a playoff series. The Caps need that kind of guy, but he ain’t Knuble.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:38 AM EST up reply actions
Knuble’s speed seems to rise and dip at times when I watch him. Some nights I say to myself “Damn old man has some jump tonight”…others I notice how slow he is getting to a puck.
Everything ends badly...otherwise it wouldn't end.
by Davethecapsfan on Nov 28, 2011 9:47 AM EST up reply actions
For an old man, he’s still got legs.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 9:48 AM EST up reply actions
I’d love to see the return of Ovechkin and Backstrom as the top scoring threat in the NHL. Not sure if Knuble or Brouwer makes any difference though.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 9:38 AM EST up reply actions
I don’t think Ovechkin’s problem is his linemates. This is a man who got Zubrus and Clark large multi-year deals.
"Fais gros comme moi!" - Alex Ovechkin
by Gould Old Days on Nov 28, 2011 9:43 AM EST up reply actions
Hey…Zubrus is good!
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 9:44 AM EST up reply actions
When he looked like he still cared deeply for the game, yes. When he was 22 and had explosive skating ability and slightly better hand-eye coordination, yes. I don’t know if this is the same player.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:46 AM EST up reply actions
He’s still got all of that when he decides to use it.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 9:49 AM EST up reply actions
No, I don’t think he does, because of 1) simple aging and 2) I think he lives pretty hard. Even if he still had that fire, I don’t think he can get his body to do exactly what he used to do.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:53 AM EST up reply actions
He’s only 26. If he took care of himself better, he ought to be just as fast, if not faster, than he was at 22.
Unleash the Apathy.
I don’t think he takes very good care of his body though. That’s definitely an issue if he doesn’t.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 10:04 AM EST up reply actions
I don’t think fast is the key with him, I think it’s shiftiness and acceleration. Whether or not he’s got the same top-end speed, he can’t make turns as well or get there as quickly as he used to. That definitely declines from about the time you’re 20.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 10:08 AM EST up reply actions
The trick is to correct for that by developing old-man wile. If he had done that, we’d have hardly noticed, other than to say “I’m impressed with his hockey sense”
↑ ↑ ↓ ↓ ← → ← → b a (select) start
Also, guys, remember … how much muscle mass has he gained since his debut? It affected his game for sure.
There's always more to learn about Hockey.
and knee surgery. even if it was “minor” knee surgery….knee surgery isn’t something to screw around with when you’re a hockey player.
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That, I think, has been a major factor. Teams have figured out exactly how to stop him. Just hit him on the hand a dozen times a game.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 10:35 AM EST up reply actions
if the zebras aren’t gonna call it….
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true dat.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 10:38 AM EST up reply actions
I’m not sure where you’re getting your information from on this but, at least in track and field, elite-level sprinters are rarely that young.
Unleash the Apathy.
Runners don’t usually peak until mid-to-late 20s. Not sure about sprinters, but middle/long distance runners peak later.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 10:33 AM EST up reply actions
Same in cycling. In low levels a young fast guy will do fine. But once they get out of the U23s, it takes a while to get it up to the next level.
The common thread is that they have to keep relearning how to win. When youthful exuberance stops working, you gotta get smarter.
↑ ↑ ↓ ↓ ← → ← → b a (select) start
All I’m saying is, not Knuble and not any other right wing is the answer to get Ovechkin playing right.
"Fais gros comme moi!" - Alex Ovechkin
by Gould Old Days on Nov 28, 2011 9:51 AM EST up reply actions
1. Scoring game winning goals in Game 7’s
Just trying to capture the spirit of the thing...
by dcsportsfan1 on Nov 28, 2011 10:02 AM EST up reply actions
Move defensive zone breakout to #1 there. Single most important thing you can do, I think.
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I believe in next year.
by red army line on Nov 28, 2011 1:23 PM EST up reply actions
A brilliant hire. This is exactly what this team needs right now. This team has forgotten how to play hockey, they just didn’t want to play for BB. Of all the past Washington Capitals, there has been no one more respected than Dale Hunter IMO.
4th Floor, is next, swimvare, undervare, Eric Fehr...
there has been no one more respected than Dale Hunter IMO.
I don’t think “respect” is the word that many hockey fans would use to describe. for Hunter.
"You can want to get to April but when you get to April you may not like the answers you get, so you might as well enjoy the ride while it's going on." - Brian McNally on JRR, 8/29/2011
Halpern’s the only one in that locker room who probably knows anything about Dale, though.
You tried your best and failed miserably. The lesson is "Never Try."
Reckon carlson knows a thing or two.
....when the truth is if they knew anything about the game, they'd be in it.
--GMGM
Erskine played in London as well.
"At the international level sport is frankly mimic warfare." - George Orwell
Knows Hunter or knows about him? I assume most know a bit about Dale Hunter.
Plus
Hunter coached Wideman and Carlson with the London Knights.
Hamrlik, Knuble and Vokoun are not youngsters/played against him in the NHL.
Well considering that they all have been practicing next to a giant picture of him for a few years now, I assume they know about him.
Aim for the head baby Jesus
by Doncosmic on Nov 28, 2011 3:37 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
It’s already been said, but I’m in the group that is sad to see him go, although it’s likely best for the team. I think we all saw it after the game Saturday with that quote.
"The Caps fan doesn't say, 'is the glass half full' or 'is the glass half empty'. He wonders when the glass is going to spill."
Hunter as introvert?
I don’t know much about Hunter’s personality, but it seems he might be quite opposite to BB. I remembered what McPhee said about him recently in this Semin English interview with Jill Sorenson: that the last real introverted personality they had here was Dale Hunter.
Not sure what any of this means for Semin, but maybe Hunter will “get” him better for as long as Semin is still here. I just want to see Ovi’s fire back and those two lighting it up more.
Are you not entertained?
Gormley got in just under the wire on this one – look at the time stamp.
http://www.csnwashington.com/blog/capitals-talk/post/Clock-ticking-for-McPhee-?blockID=601652&feedID=10376
"The Caps fan doesn't say, 'is the glass half full' or 'is the glass half empty'. He wonders when the glass is going to spill."
@Real_ESPNLeBrun: Caps GM George McPhee via text says “performance over past 10 days” was tipping point.
Not a shocker here.
Nice guys finish first, but sometimes the season is awfully long.
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Per Peerless:
If Caps fans are scratching their heads about hiring Dale Hunter, remember this…Dan Bylsma had all of 54 games as a head coach at any level before ascending to Pittsburgh. Hunter is 456-191-59 in 10+ years as head coach at London.
Stress here — at any level. At that point, does the fact that it was AHL or OHL really matter.
Nice guys finish first, but sometimes the season is awfully long.
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by STLSpidey on Nov 28, 2011 8:57 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
I think the need here, is less coaching, and more motivation and chemistry. This team doesn’t need X’s and O’s as much as it needs the will to win it all.
I’m buying this… a lower talented team might need the X’s O’s but not so much for this team.
What doesnt kill you makes you stronger.
by BetterOffWith28 on Nov 28, 2011 10:34 AM EST up reply actions
But its still going from juniors to the majors, at the end of every coach’s story they don’t turn out to be Dan Bylsma
Bruce Boudreau when asked about Brooks Laich's return to the lineup, he said: "He just adds another dimension to our team. If it was puzzle, he just fits that thing. He completes us."
Brooks Laich completing everything from teams to tires and everything in between.
Still surprised that Evason survives each change… for now, not surprised about Woods, but given the issues on D, it will be interesting to watch. Woods made some changes when he moved up to be head coach with Hershey.
Maybe its personnal familiarity, guessing he’d make the move for assistants in the offseason.
"My favorite fan base in D.C. Is United's. Period. The end." - Steinberg
Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
by Bald Pollack on Nov 28, 2011 9:01 AM EST up reply actions
Just like the cockroaches.
"My favorite fan base in D.C. Is United's. Period. The end." - Steinberg
Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
by Bald Pollack on Nov 28, 2011 9:05 AM EST up reply actions
Leone
The “C” needs to be taken off Ovechkin and put on Brooks Laich, where it belongs.
"My favorite fan base in D.C. Is United's. Period. The end." - Steinberg
Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
by Bald Pollack on Nov 28, 2011 8:59 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
haha, didnt we play a few games with noone as ‘C’? We should do that
What doesnt kill you makes you stronger.
by BetterOffWith28 on Nov 28, 2011 10:35 AM EST up reply actions
Ovi should never have been given the “C” to begin with. Not sure how he will take the strip. Should have Brooks from the start…
If you want to survive out here, you've got to know where your towel is.
by ns on Nov 28, 2011 9:03 AM EST up reply actions
I don’t think it’s fair to say that without being in the room. We know Brooks plays pretty smart and pretty hard and says the right things, but the doesn’t necessarily mean he’s leading the room.
by David Getz on Nov 28, 2011 9:10 AM EST up reply actions 7 recs
Fair enough. I realize people have their opinion of how to lead effectively, I just don’t think Ovi is ready to take on that role even now.
If you want to survive out here, you've got to know where your towel is.
by ns on Nov 28, 2011 9:16 AM EST up reply actions
I mean supposedly the guys voted him in…maybe the actual team knows better about the locker room musings then we do…
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by Cap-O-Vens on Nov 28, 2011 9:17 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
“In the locker room” is what concerns me. When the Caps were high-flying, winning (albeit regular season), the three guys that were referred to as the best “locker room guys” were Brads, Theo, and Flash. Makes me wonder if losing them, plus all this “accountability” stuff, has taken the spirit out of the locker room.
"You can want to get to April but when you get to April you may not like the answers you get, so you might as well enjoy the ride while it's going on." - Brian McNally on JRR, 8/29/2011
My vote, Knubble or Green, yeah I said it, Green
What doesnt kill you makes you stronger.
by BetterOffWith28 on Nov 28, 2011 10:36 AM EST up reply actions
Captain Space Cadet?
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It’d be just like old times with Chris Clark. We’d have a captain who never sees the ice.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 10:39 AM EST up reply actions
What makes everyone think Brooks is so respected in the locker room?
Aim for the head baby Jesus
by Doncosmic on Nov 28, 2011 3:42 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I agree…with Brooks or Knuble.
I like Laich, but I <3 Green
Keep the faith!!!!!!
by RockinRed4Life on Nov 28, 2011 9:04 AM EST up reply actions
Actually, I’d go with an off the wall choice and nominate Backstrom. Even when he was playing poorly last year he was saying, and doing, the right things just not finishing cause of his injury.
Bruce Boudreau when asked about Brooks Laich's return to the lineup, he said: "He just adds another dimension to our team. If it was puzzle, he just fits that thing. He completes us."
Brooks Laich completing everything from teams to tires and everything in between.
Not Happening .. Is everyone forgetting that the team want Ovi to have the C
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by Cap-O-Vens on Nov 28, 2011 9:05 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Will not happen. Ovechkin has the C until he leaves or unless the team acquires a player of more prominence. For example, even for his short tenure with the Blues, Gretzky was captain.
Nice guys finish first, but sometimes the season is awfully long.
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I would do it. I think Caps would do it. Can’t imagine Flames/Feaster doing it.
Nice guys finish first, but sometimes the season is awfully long.
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Will not happen. Ovechkin has the C until he leaves or unless the team acquires a player of more prominence.
I wonder if Ovie even cares about that C.
Seems to me they gave it to him not so much because he was a great leader, but because he played hard 100%, mistakes aside, of the time and set an example.
I think he’s still that example. If there was drama because of some leadership crap, I bet Ovie would be the type to immediately give the C to someone he thought fit. I think his goals are quite personal: Win a Stanley Cup, win a gold medal. I doubt he cares if he’s Captain when it happens or not.
Agreed. The players picked him, including Brooks and Knuble. They said it was unanimous.
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 9:16 AM EST up reply actions
So true. I remember how both of them said at the time that Ovi should be Captain, that it was his team. It’s why I never play in the “should Ovi wear the C” game. The team unanimously said yes and that was good enough for me.
by capsyoungguns on Nov 28, 2011 9:22 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I don’t disagree that Brooks is a leader, but is it right to take it away from Ovi just because Brooks is there? I don’t think the public fallout would be worth it. It would be distracting. And I don’t think Ovi is a terrible leader. In hindsight, I would have given it to someone else – but I don’t think the Caps should take the C from face of the franchise, and the guy who has brought in millions of dollars and millions of fans and is a gateway to Russia’s prospects.
The club of Russian captains in the NHL is very small. Taking away the C just gives the naysayers fuel to say what a failure he is, and makes teams even more cautious to draft, sign, and give Russian players a leadership role.
by jopierce on Nov 28, 2011 9:07 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Maybe, but that won’t happen. I love Brooksie, but I can’t imagine they strip Ovi of the captaincy. That would do numbers on the locker room.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 9:13 AM EST up reply actions
I think Laich is overrated as captain material. Laich’s the Don Cherry utopia version of Semin. Yes, he’s good defensively and gives great “captain-y” quotes, but he’s just as prone to indifference and sloppy play in the offensive zone as the Siberian Snowflake.
You tried your best and failed miserably. The lesson is "Never Try."
by apk3000 on Nov 28, 2011 9:24 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Minus the fact he’s not in the box every other minute.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 9:25 AM EST up reply actions
What do people think a Captain on a team does that other veteran players don’t? The "C" is just a letter on a jersey that allows you to have more interaction with the officials. I can’t think of one positive that would come from taking it away from Ovi. Do people think that players would say "Oh, Brooks has the "C" now; I should start listening to what he says and follow his lead"
by 7-Hole Glove Side on Nov 28, 2011 9:28 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
For all that it’s very public so the fans love to debate it, I continue in the belief that the C don’t mean shit.
You telling me that a good leader needs a letter on his shirt to lead? You telling me a letter on a shirt tells folks who they ought to listen to?
"Fais gros comme moi!" - Alex Ovechkin
by Gould Old Days on Nov 28, 2011 9:31 AM EST up reply actions 12 recs
This is where I come down on the topic. Do we really think it makes a difference whether Knuble is wearing an A or C when players decide to internalize what he’s saying? I don’t.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:34 AM EST up reply actions
Agreed. I was Captain of my college team and the only thing that made me different from the other senior leaders on our team is that I was nasty at calling heads or tails. Was I a leader and did my teammates listen to what I had to say? Sure. Did what I say have any more impact on them than what the other leaders on the team said or did? Nope.
by 7-Hole Glove Side on Nov 28, 2011 9:38 AM EST up reply actions
Related but unrelated…three current or former caps captains in the room now
↑ ↑ ↓ ↓ ← → ← → b a (select) start
And Langway’s been more involved with the team lately than he has in years.
"Fais gros comme moi!" - Alex Ovechkin
by Gould Old Days on Nov 28, 2011 9:44 AM EST up reply actions
Oh, and I don’t care what anyone says — Olaf Kolzig was captain too.
"Fais gros comme moi!" - Alex Ovechkin
by Gould Old Days on Nov 28, 2011 10:38 AM EST up reply actions
hadn’t even consider this: Olie. Hunter. As coaches. “Boys, this is how you express displeasure with an opponent!”
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Line brawl with Torts!
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by EmilyB on Nov 28, 2011 10:44 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I´m looking forward to read the chapter about this in Boudreu´s next book. It will probably take some, but is still gonna be interesting.
I think he finds a new job where Hadeed does carpet cleaning.
4th Floor, is next, swimvare, undervare, Eric Fehr...
Hadeed knew it was coming. Replaced him with Carlson in their commercials this year.
"The Caps fan doesn't say, 'is the glass half full' or 'is the glass half empty'. He wonders when the glass is going to spill."
by gfcaps fan on Nov 28, 2011 9:06 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Yeah, the last few week there’s been very few or no BB commercials… coincidence? hmmm
What doesnt kill you makes you stronger.
by BetterOffWith28 on Nov 28, 2011 10:55 AM EST up reply actions
ChrisBottaNHL Chris Botta
George McPhee skillfully avoids any discussion of the performance of George McPhee.
I like McPhee overall; doesn’t mean I like every move he makes. Thought it was relevant to bring up with the activities today.
Sure is. The Boudreau hire was a GMGM move, if he screws this one up long-term those questions should be asked moreso.
"My favorite fan base in D.C. Is United's. Period. The end." - Steinberg
Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
by Bald Pollack on Nov 28, 2011 9:04 AM EST up reply actions
McPhee puts #1 seeds on the ice two years straight…not his fault…
by SA-Town on Nov 28, 2011 9:04 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
McPhee also arguably waited 18 months longer than he should have to replace the coach. I’m playing Devil’s Advocate a little here, but I know I had a severe lack of faith Boudreau was ever going to be proactive and strategic enough with this team after watching the Montreal series.
by David Getz on Nov 28, 2011 9:13 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
it’s easy to say that now, but he was still the fastest coach to 200 wins in the history of the NHL. You just dont dump someone with that success. Not an easy decision to can Bruce 18 months ago.
If David and other of us who agree with David’s statement were just mentioning it now then you would be right. However, many of us have been calling for him to be fired since the Montreal series implosion or early last season.
The Artist Formerly Known as CP2Devil.
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I’d actually disagree with this. For example, he’s known for years what Alex Semin is, and how corrosive his presence must have been on the chemistry of the team. And yet he never traded Semin when the guy had actual value. Now he’s stuck trying to get pennies on the dollar for a player who clearly needs a change of scenery.
Beyond that, for a team that talks about “building like Detroit,” GMGM and Boudreau were never in sync when matching player acquisition with the on-ice system. Pretty much anyone could tell you that Boudreau’s system does almost nothing to slow the opposition through neutral ice. This, in turn, puts pressure on the defensemen to be able to skate really, really well. GMGM’s defensive acquisitions over the last year (Hannan, Hamrlik and, to a lesser extent, Wideman), suggest that he doesn’t understand this, or doesn’t care.
Unleash the Apathy.
by D'ohboy on Nov 28, 2011 9:14 AM EST up reply actions 14 recs
Are you basing Semin’s corrosive presence on the team’s chemistry on the fact that players like Bradley say so? Because part of that has to be on the coach to make his players sort out their differences and work as a team.
Are you basing Semin’s corrosive presence on the team’s chemistry on the fact that players like Bradley say so?
Bradley, Steckel, Morrisonn. It’s no surprise that Arnott tried so hard to get the guy integrated.
Because part of that has to be on the coach to make his players sort out their differences and work as a team.
These guys are adults, not high school kids.
Unleash the Apathy.
by D'ohboy on Nov 28, 2011 9:26 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Semin […] clearly needs a change of scenery.
Can there be any doubt that he just got one? I won’t pretend to know Hunter’s coaching, but it’s impossible for me to imagine 32 talking about ‘parenting’ as a model for managing 28, as BB did.
....when the truth is if they knew anything about the game, they'd be in it.
--GMGM
I think Semin will get a chance to turn things around under Hunter, but I have to imagine that if Hunter comes to GMGM and says “that guy has to go,” Semin’s gone the next day.
Unleash the Apathy.
I think 28’s going to change trends or uniforms in the next few months, no other options. Hunter’s ‘kid gloves’ are made from, y’know, kids — lousy backcheckers, mostly.
....when the truth is if they knew anything about the game, they'd be in it.
--GMGM
by redlineblue on Nov 28, 2011 9:56 AM EST up reply actions 8 recs
It’s George McPhee’s job to provide the talent within in the salary cap structure. Considering the team has had the best record in the Eastern Conference the past two seasons indicates this team has a lot of talent. He’s done his job just fine.
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 9:17 AM EST up reply actions
Stupid comment by Botta. Why would GMGM talk about his performance? Pretty clear, to me anyway, if Hunts doesn’t work then GMGM is cooked too.
Just trying to capture the spirit of the thing...
by dcsportsfan1 on Nov 28, 2011 9:31 AM EST up reply actions
I’m sad to see Bruce go, but I was prepared for this. I’m sure he wasn’t completely surprised. Here’s hoping to a great rest of the season and future for the Caps.
He's a better skater than Nick, but he's big in the back[side]...BB
by Backeez Got Back on Nov 28, 2011 9:01 AM EST reply actions
So what happens the first time Ovi tries to call Hunter a “fat f*&k”?
Definitely bittersweet, as others have mentioned. Thanks to BB, but something had to give.
Or this
He was so great…but not exactly the cleanest player ever.
I like Laich, but I <3 Green
Keep the faith!!!!!!
by RockinRed4Life on Nov 28, 2011 9:07 AM EST up reply actions
I spent a few hours one day, after an annoying fair weather fan was talking about dirty players and saying the Caps would NEVER employ someone like that (never mind we briefly had cooke), looking up videos of Dale Hunter. I really like him. Hopefully I will as much as coach.
I like Laich, but I <3 Green
Keep the faith!!!!!!
by RockinRed4Life on Nov 28, 2011 9:16 AM EST up reply actions
That Turgeon hit really soured me when I saw it live back in the day. It left a bad taste in my mouth and kind of left me with an anti-Dale mindset after that. Although I have to admit, with the bad, there is good, too.
I’ll still badmouth him as a player, but I’m looking forward to seeing what he can do as coach. This was HIS team for a while.
So what happens the first time Ovi tries to call Hunter a "fat f*&k"?
Ovi: “Buy why, Dale?”
Dale: “Look up there at the #8 hanging from the rafters”
Ovi: “Where?”
Ah HAAaaa!!! Aaaaa HaaaaAAh!
by Brainumbc on Nov 28, 2011 9:12 AM EST up reply actions 7 recs
Love it. Well played.
Nice guys finish first, but sometimes the season is awfully long.
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?
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Randolph and Mortimer…also in Trading Places…/OT
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a) Subject line
b) Let’s keep the diversions to a minimum if that’s OK.
"My favorite fan base in D.C. Is United's. Period. The end." - Steinberg
Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
by Bald Pollack on Nov 28, 2011 9:42 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
yea
sorry. I was about to try to steer this back on the original quip:
Ted’s the owner and the man that writes the checks
Buy Dale’s been a Cap since 87 and his # is in the rafters there. Dale friggin hunter became a cap when Livin’ On A Prayer was the #1 song in the country, damnit. As much as I crap on Dale and defend Bruce, I’m excited to see what happens next.
Same here. Although I was finding it harder and harder to defend Bruce. It’s not necessarily his fault, but Ovi didn’t seem to want to play for him anymore. If Bruce couldn’t get Ovi motivated, then he wasn’t going to get anywhere with the other guys either.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 9:47 AM EST up reply actions
but Ovi didn’t seem to want to play for him anymore.
All the evidence for that claim is a bit circumstantial. But I think I believe it.
Oh of course. That’s just my observation….but I don’t think it’s far off.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 9:52 AM EST up reply actions
So decision was last week?
From twitterverse:
TheFourthPeriod David Pagnotta
Driving to Philly & heard official news of Boudreau firing. Not surprised. Decision came last week, mngt waited to give him chance but no go
Are you not entertained?
GMGM seems to have confirmed that the past 10 games were the tipping point (via LeBrun) so they’ve probably been mulling it over for awhile.
What’s the interview process like with mid-season coaching changes? There have to have been multiple rounds of interviews. I know with the Red Sox managerial search right now, for example, prospects are going through three rounds of interviews then another as a stamp of approval.
One has to wonder when the first interview took place.
Multiple rounds of interviews with Hunter?
I doubt it. Also, very few options mid-season so fewer interviews, too.
Speculation, but this may have been as much about Hunter’s willingness about the timing in leaving London. as anything else given the history and previous chatter about Hunter being a candidate.
I think McPhee has been talking to Hunter about this off and on for some time. Also, I hope he spoke to others, too, but there aren’t all that many to speak to mid-season.
Yeah, I dunno. This has to be something GMGM has been thinking about for a long time and vetting several candidates for.
Of course. He did not decide on Sunday morning to call Hunter. He did not begin creating his list during the game Saturday night.
Nice guys finish first, but sometimes the season is awfully long.
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Is Dale the interim head coach, or the official new head coach? Caps might still do a coaching search.
You tried your best and failed miserably. The lesson is "Never Try."
One has to wonder when the first interview took place
I’ll take May, for sure. But ’09, or ’10?
....when the truth is if they knew anything about the game, they'd be in it.
--GMGM
June 13, 1987.
"Fais gros comme moi!" - Alex Ovechkin
by Gould Old Days on Nov 28, 2011 9:46 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
Sad Day.
I’ve always been a Gabby fan. I never thought he should succumb to the Coaching Carousel, mostly because he’s done so well with all the talent. The regular-season record should have been something. I will admit that the power play has been a sore spot, and he seemed unable to get through to Ovechkin the past couple years.
I just can’t seem to get over the fact that this isn’t the “right” thing to do. Like U-Maryland and Ralph Friedgen. Something’s not right about this. Maybe it’s just because I really like Bruce and thought he was better than a lot of people gave him credit for.
Good luck, Bruce. May you find success with a team willing to listen.
I do think the team “should” have been the kind of people who would succeed under Boudreau. They got their coach fired. They have a lot to live with right now.
"Fais gros comme moi!" - Alex Ovechkin
by Gould Old Days on Nov 28, 2011 9:34 AM EST up reply actions 6 recs
something had to give, and unfortunately, you can’t fire a big chunk of the team.
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This wasn't how I expected to spend my Cyber Monday
Bruce, thank you for showing this team how talented they are.
Dale, please show them everything they lack
Piss poor playoff performances perpetuate permutation
by kurlNdrag on Nov 28, 2011 9:09 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Damned if you do, damned if you don’t. This goes both for Boudreau and Hunter. Hope Huntsy proves me wrong and can transition from being an OHL coach to an effective one in the big leagues.
That being said, I think this was rather hasty but GMGM has proven me wrong.
Hi. My name is Christoph J. I'm a Caps fan.
I know this was visited ad nauseum, but who were the potential + available candidates besides Hunter?
Hi. My name is Christoph J. I'm a Caps fan.
I think GMGM had his eye on DH for some time now..
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That’s why I don’t like the timing – the team could have done a much better job of due diligence if they’d made this move in the summer. I’m a big fan of Kirk Muller as a candidate, or MacT (I know that other don’t like him, but I think he’d be good for the Caps), or any number of other guys.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:20 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
For me, it was Kirk Muller and Craig Ramsay once the off-season carousel stopped, but before they started taking AHL head coaching and NHL asst coaching positions.
I liked Muller too, but none of the candidates were slam dunks. Muller apparently didn’t interview all that well over the summer.
Interviewing well or not, the guy did an amazing job in an actual job situation in MTL as an assistant. I’d have like to at least give it a shot.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:31 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
It’s also the least likely predictor of success behind the bench
Cross check and all call.
by bigonetimer on Nov 28, 2011 10:03 AM EST up reply actions
I have to imagine that GMGM talked to people during the offseason. If not, he deserves to be fired.
Unleash the Apathy.
I think the decision to keep Boudreau was made early after the Tampa series, but I have no word on that either way.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:32 AM EST up reply actions
You have to think they explored some outside options, at least, after that happened. I wouldn’t be surprised if around that moment (or Montreal) is when GMGM at least started talking to Hunter about a potential move.
"At the international level sport is frankly mimic warfare." - George Orwell
isn’t the story that Hunter was considered before Bruce was hired? I think Hunter was reluctant to leave his team—the ownership of it being a complicating factor if I recall.
by kingbonehead on Nov 28, 2011 10:02 AM EST up reply actions
Wasn’t one of the issues with Hunter the age of his kids? He liked being at/close to home with the junior team. That was a while ago, so I assume they’re at least late teens by now.
"The Caps fan doesn't say, 'is the glass half full' or 'is the glass half empty'. He wonders when the glass is going to spill."
Oh I don’t doubt that at all. I was just wondering if other candidates between now and the off season popped up.
I need some coffee. For the life of me I can’t remember all the candidates that were mentioned here on the various threads as arguable replacements for Bruce Boudreau.
Hi. My name is Christoph J. I'm a Caps fan.
Reaugh
Bottom line on Boudreau firing in WSH: Coaches can’t go from teddy bear to grizzly bear with same team (or vice versa)…
"My favorite fan base in D.C. Is United's. Period. The end." - Steinberg
Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
by Bald Pollack on Nov 28, 2011 9:11 AM EST reply actions 9 recs
Pre-fucking-cisely.
Boudreau will be a much, much better coach at his next stop having learned some lessons from dealing with Ovie and Semin.
Unleash the Apathy.
by D'ohboy on Nov 28, 2011 9:16 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
Not at all, and I will be happy for him…as long as DH puts his name on first
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Well, I don’t know about that. He was handed an unbelievably stacked roster. If you look around the league at places he might end up (Anaheim, Colorado, Columbus), none of them look remotely as good in the near-term.
Unleash the Apathy.
He’s a good developmental coach, but that “no success in the playoffs tag” will always come with him, at least in the short term.
"At the international level sport is frankly mimic warfare." - George Orwell
For the same reason, I think Hitchcock is going to do great in Dallas, at least for a while. Got to the point where he couldn’t change in Columbus. He’s got a blank slate now.
"Fais gros comme moi!" - Alex Ovechkin
by Gould Old Days on Nov 28, 2011 9:42 AM EST up reply actions
I believe you mean St. Louis.
The Artist Formerly Known as CP2Devil.
Associate Editor at Five For Howling.
Yup. Brainfart.
"Fais gros comme moi!" - Alex Ovechkin
by Gould Old Days on Nov 28, 2011 9:47 AM EST up reply actions
I think Hitch has been handed the keys to a really good team and that he’s a pretty good tactical coach. STL is a threat, in my opinion.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:47 AM EST up reply actions
And I think he’s going to be a better coach now for what he went through in Columbus.
"Fais gros comme moi!" - Alex Ovechkin
by Gould Old Days on Nov 28, 2011 9:52 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
As much as I’ve hated watching his team’s from a aesthetic standpoint the guy can flat out coach. I was none too pleased to see the Blues hire him. They became a much tougher team the minute he was handed the keys.
The Artist Formerly Known as CP2Devil.
Associate Editor at Five For Howling.
haven’t watched the Blues yet; are they playing typical hitch style hockey?
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They put 43 shots on the Pens the other night by taking away outlet passes and smart pressure in the zone. There’s still some Hitch-trap going on, but man did they look good when I saw them play.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 10:00 AM EST up reply actions
Oh my God that guy was brilliant in that movie. /OT/
Unleash the Apathy.
by D'ohboy on Nov 28, 2011 9:29 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
First and foremost, as a Caps fan I’m glad to see a change. As a human, I feel bad for Boudreau. He was over his head, but he was such an emotional guy that you know his heart is broken right now. He has to feel terrible. It is absurd that 201-88-40 isn’t enough to keep you your job, but it is also absurd that a 201-88-40 record translates so poorly to the post-season, where it matters more. I wish him success, I hope he wins a cup, but not before the Caps do.
As a Caps fan, I’m also relieved. I’m just glad to see some change. Now all that remains is the unknown.
Will this change ‘fix’ the team?
Is Dale Hunter the right choice?
Will Capitals hockey be fun to watch for a while, again?
Is this George McPhee’s last chance to get this team right?
Will Bruce Boudreau win a Cup with Columbus this year?
Unlikely. I hope so, but it stinks of desperation and appeal to tradition. For the short term at least. I’m not so sure. And I’m a Caps fan, so definitely.
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My dad actually called this yesterday when I went to my ‘rents for lunch. But, my rebuttle yesterday is still the same as it is today, and the same as many of everyone else’s: How do you hire a guy not with just zero NHL experience, but with zero AHL experience? I unfortunately don’t see this working.
I need 100% of you guys to give 110% 100% of the time.
Interesting reaction here up to this point.
The "Keep Boudreau" sentiment is non-existent.
The "What a Fucking Stupid Hire" sentiment is nearly non-existent.
The "Wow. It Really Happened" sentiment is prevalent.
The "Hmmm. Hunter. Hmmm." sentiment is prevalent.
At least we know now who the coach will be for the rest of the season, unless Hunter quits.
Nice guys finish first, but sometimes the season is awfully long.
Follow me on Twitter.
I think the reason behind that is that, in general, we knew either that it needed to happen or was going to happen (whether we like it or not). However, even those that wanted him gone gone gone were still quite unsure as to what the market to replace him was like. I mean, who other than Hunter was a viable choice? Ben Olsen?
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Well. Ben Olsen does have more caps for the US than Hunter.
Nice guys finish first, but sometimes the season is awfully long.
Follow me on Twitter.
by STLSpidey on Nov 28, 2011 9:19 AM EST up reply actions 5 recs
Well if you’re going to drop that knowledge in here, you’ll get my rec.
"My favorite fan base in D.C. Is United's. Period. The end." - Steinberg
Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
by Bald Pollack on Nov 28, 2011 9:21 AM EST up reply actions
Holy shit. While a part of me can’t help but smile a little bit hearing that Dale Hunter is the new coach of the Caps, a large part of me is very concerned he’s jumping into the deep end far too quickly…especially with this team constructed how it is.
Everything ends badly...otherwise it wouldn't end.
Dare I say this comes two years late.
Good Luck BB.
I have faith in Hunter. Jack Adams he we come!!!!
Ice Breakers>Goal Shakers....THE CAPS !!
Well…the Caps do seem to have good luck with firing coaches at Thanksgiving. (small sample size, of course…)
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 9:18 AM EST up reply actions
Wow. These Mondays, man.
"A picture is worth a thousand words. For moving pictures we manage to shorten it to one or two."
Face-offs should improve.
(Thinking of Hunter vs. Boucher).
An admirer noted: "I think it's safe to say that your mustache has experienced more than an ordinary man's entire body".
by Acer Jonesy's Laughker on Nov 28, 2011 9:18 AM EST reply actions
Thank you Bruce...
Thank you to Bruce Boudreau for:
1) Taking this team on a great ride in the 2007-08 season from dead last in the NHL to the playoffs.
2) For winning the division four straight years… admittedly there was a lot more to be won, but you have to win in the regular season before the playoffs…he did that. A lot.
3) For figuring out how to reinvent this team mid-season last year and make it into a winner again.
Admittedly he tried to reinvent the Caps again, but you can only go to that well so often, before you confuse the players. You have one system, they players do it, then another, and they do it and then a third… eventually they’re going to get confused.
Coaches are hired for the right reasons, and fired for the right reasons. The Caps hired Boudreau to clean up a mess that this team was in in 2007. He did that, but the team has moved on from then, and while many of the players are the same, this is a much different team. They need a new direction and Dale Hunter will hopefully provide it.
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 9:23 AM EST reply actions 20 recs
1) Taking this team on a great ride in the 2007-08 season from dead last in the NHL to the playoffs.
That ranks highly on my list of times I loved being a Caps fan. That last 14 games was a heart attack waiting to happen, but god was it fun
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by renstar on Nov 28, 2011 9:27 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
That was an amazing run. The Caps went 13-1-0 down that stretch and passed the Hurricanes for the playoff berth. The ’Canes actually got about 70% of the points they had available down that stretch and the Caps roared past them….
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 10:10 AM EST up reply actions
thank you, Florida Panthers! Without you, the Caps never would have made the playoffs.
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Even if the Canes had won the division, our last win would have put us in the playoffs as the 7th seed that year I believe.
Everything ends badly...otherwise it wouldn't end.
by Davethecapsfan on Nov 28, 2011 10:16 AM EST up reply actions
Maybe I’m not remembering correctly, but I thought the Caps would have lost out on tie breakers. Three teams, including the Caps, had 94 points, and had Carolina won just one more game, they also would have been a 94-point team.
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I keep thinking we had the tiebreaker on someone where had Carolina won we still would have gotten in, and not even as the 8th seed but as the 7th.
Everything ends badly...otherwise it wouldn't end.
by Davethecapsfan on Nov 28, 2011 10:21 AM EST up reply actions
I’m pretty sure the Caps had to win the last game to get in. There might have been a tie breaker scenario if they lost in OT or something.
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Yes they had to win the last game, that wasn’t what I was saying, was saying even if Carolina hadn’t lost the division to us, that last win would have gotten us in regardless.
Everything ends badly...otherwise it wouldn't end.
by Davethecapsfan on Nov 28, 2011 10:23 AM EST up reply actions
The last win got the Caps in regardless. That the Canes lost made it so the Caps won the division.
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 10:40 AM EST up reply actions
No, Ottawa would have been out. There was an Ottawa-Boston game that needed to end in regulation (loser would have lost the tiebreaker to the Caps) and did. Caps controlled their own destiny, CAR just made it a shinier one.
Right, that’s what I thought.
Everything ends badly...otherwise it wouldn't end.
by Davethecapsfan on Nov 28, 2011 10:23 AM EST up reply actions
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Yeah looking at it we would have had the tiebreaker over Boston at least to push them out at 94 points
Everything ends badly...otherwise it wouldn't end.
by Davethecapsfan on Nov 28, 2011 10:22 AM EST up reply actions
The Caps at that point only needed to get a point against Florida in the last game regardless of what the Canes did with Florida. If the Canes had won, they would have clinched the division, but the Caps would have gotten enough points to make the playoffs with a single point either way.
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 10:39 AM EST up reply actions
Incorrect: Had Carolina won, The Capitals needed to win to make the playoffs without clinching the division, and a Boston loss (which happened: in fact, Boston, Ottawa, and Carolina all lost their final game of the season)
http://www.hockey-reference.com/leagues/NHL_2008.html
Tie-breaks for 94 point teams would have been as follows: Ottawa, Carolina, Washington, Boston, with two spots and the southeast division to be decided between them.
Mike Weber Pressbox Incarceration Status: Transferred to IR Jail.
Berube as Dale’s assistant would be awesome. It was Berube who scored the goal on Dale’s 1000th point. Dale had a three point night that night.
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 9:27 AM EST up reply actions
#needstotalktotheFlyers
"My favorite fan base in D.C. Is United's. Period. The end." - Steinberg
Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
by Bald Pollack on Nov 28, 2011 9:28 AM EST up reply actions
He played almost as long over there as here and seems to be comfortable with his position over there. If he’s poached in the offseason, w00t, otherwise I’m not overly romantic about bringing him back.
"My favorite fan base in D.C. Is United's. Period. The end." - Steinberg
Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
by Bald Pollack on Nov 28, 2011 9:37 AM EST up reply actions
well, I was wrong last night.
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by RedBirdie on Nov 28, 2011 9:25 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Welcome to the club. I must’ve spent a good two hours on that flippin’ Fan Post.
Nice guys finish first, but sometimes the season is awfully long.
Follow me on Twitter.
I haven’t even gotten that far. Logged on the to Rink, see “Bruce fired,” felt gut punch.
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Its funny, I felt a gut punch when Bondra was traded. I didn’t read the sports section (since that was back in the physical paper days) for a week after that.
When my dad texted me this morning while I was on the subway, my reaction was more of a resigned inevitability. Oddly I didn’t feel like this was going to fix anything.
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I felt a gut punch when Bondra was traded.
The Caps were almost dead to me at that point. Then again I was living in LA.
At the time I didn’t know much about the politics going on so I was also sad to see Gonchar go.
the acquisition of Jagr and the subsequent firesale almost, almost, made me switch whole-heartedly to Minnesota—which I couldn’t do because of Lemaire and that fucking trap. And then the lockout. Fortunately, I moved back to DC within days of the lockout ending and decided to take a chance of watching that Ovechkin kid play…
Hi, my name is RedBirdie and I have a Capitals problem.
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by RedBirdie on Nov 28, 2011 9:50 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
And Minny has gone back to the trap this year and have no problem calling it “The Trap”
by Rather Bengt on Nov 28, 2011 9:51 AM EST up reply actions
they’re trapping, they have Heatley, Mike Yeo is behind the bench. Really, I can’t wait for them to fail.
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Funny that Russo posted this yesterday. Hitch on Yeo and Wild.
The Artist Formerly Known as CP2Devil.
Associate Editor at Five For Howling.
by Carl Putnam on Nov 28, 2011 10:03 AM EST up reply actions
At least you don’t follow the Skins and the Orioles too! Or do you? Then you’ve got a problem.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 9:52 AM EST up reply actions
I always complained to my fiance when we go to Kohls that they sold all local team sportswear EXCEPT for the Caps. Seriously for years. NOW I just noticed last night they had Ovechkin jerseys (firggin kid/teenager sized for 50 bucks).
I finally figured it out. Kohls will only sell your crap if you’re losing :)
They should have a crap-ton of Orioles stuff then. Talk about miserable.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 9:59 AM EST up reply actions
Hi, my name is RedBirdie and I never ever ever should have become a sports fan. I would have been happier. (less so ‘Skins, but still…..native Marylander. It’s been a rough 30 years)
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I’m convinced I will never get to see a championship team here in the DC area. The Caps are my one chance. Help me, Dale Hunter. You’re my only hope.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 10:02 AM EST up reply actions
Hey, why not?
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 10:11 AM EST up reply actions
My interest had waned since the 97 season, oddly enough when they went to the finals, I kinda knew we were going to get trounced. Then came the Jagr thing and then the dumping of everyone I liked. I was in LA at that point so I was down on the Caps for a few years there.
Then I saw my first Caps game in years actually AT Staples Center and had no idea who ovechkin was. It was his rookie season and he had two assists in a comeback win.
Funny how that one game got my interest back.
1998 :) 1997 was Wings-Flyers.
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I felt a gut punch too. I really like the guy. And I think he’s a great coach.
I can’t help but feel this is a step backwards. A necessary one, but a step back.
Bruce Boudreau’s going to win Stanley Cups. Damned shame it won’t be here.
"Fais gros comme moi!" - Alex Ovechkin
by Gould Old Days on Nov 28, 2011 9:48 AM EST up reply actions
I really wanted to see him lead that parade down 7th street.
you know how there are great coaches that are just complete assholes? People you’d never in a million years invite to Thanksgiving? Yeah. I’m glad Bruce isn’t that guy. He’s gonna go win it all somewhere else with that big fat grin on his face and all “aw shucks, I can’t believe how lucky I am.” And I’ll hate him for it, and still be proud that he was part of the Caps family.
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yep.
He had such a big grin on his face the first year he was at the season ticket hold party at Six Flags. HUGE. He kept telling everyone how he couldn’t believe we all wanted his autograph.
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Cassidy, Hanlon, Boudreau and now Hunter…doesn’t that make 4 straight getting their first NHL coaching gigs with the Caps?
I guess GM and Ted don’t like retreads.
Right move letting Bruce go. It was over after Buffalo. It was fun for a while, though.
Hunter…I guess I’m on board with the thought that he was the only really viable choice.
This should have happened after TBL at the latest though. And probably prior to that.
Patron saint of quality footwear.
Is what it is on the timing. Huntzie does have time to fix stuff this year if he’s capable of doing it.
Everything ends badly...otherwise it wouldn't end.
by Davethecapsfan on Nov 28, 2011 9:28 AM EST up reply actions
At the very least...
… the team will get better on face-offs. Dale was one of the best all-time at winning draws. On a team that featured Andrei Nikolishin and Adam Oates, Dale Hunter was the best face-off guy…. all three of them were top 10 in the NHL on several occasions.
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
I don’t buy that this is an insta-faceoff fix. We might see some improvement, but the Caps aren’t going to rocket back to the top of the team FO standings this season.
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Yep. Gordon and Steckel aren’t easily replaced in that category.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:48 AM EST up reply actions
I never quite understood how some people thought that Caps would remain a scary FO team after losing both of them.
BTW—Rinne’s looked very very human all the sudden ;)
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Exactly. Those guys were your go-to choice on the PK and in the D-Zone and they were both 60+% FO guys. Team’s going to take a step back after losing them, just no way around it.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 10:01 AM EST up reply actions
what I miss most is when the Caps are on the PK FO, it’s no long a pretty sure win. That was a lethal combination. Steckel gets thrown out? Oh, Boyd Gordon’s the back up.
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It’s not immediate, but they will get better over time. Halpern was a 40-45 percent guy as a rookie, but Hunter helped teach him, and now he’s consistently 52-54 percent.
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 10:12 AM EST up reply actions
Halps has only taken 165 draws, less than half of Backstrom’s 351, but he has won 61.2% of them (and has an even better clip—62.4%—while shorthanded).
Cross check and all call.
by bigonetimer on Nov 28, 2011 11:38 AM EST up reply actions
In fairness, Halpern has probably lined up to take as many draws as Backsrom…he just gets kicked outta the circle half the time for cheating :).
by Yoshietree on Nov 28, 2011 11:53 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
If you’re not cheating, you’re not trying. :)
by Gin and Tonic on Nov 28, 2011 12:55 PM EST up reply actions
So what does Hunter say at Practice today? “Hey guys, let’s get to work.”
by Kolzilla on Nov 28, 2011 9:31 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
It’s an interesting question. There a several different ways to go with this one. I would guess he goes with brisk and businesslike, but I have no real way of knowing.
At the end of the day, if the Caps skate hard and commit to a system, they’ll win their share of games.
Patron saint of quality footwear.
Bongos!
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by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 10:13 AM EST up reply actions
We'll see.
I think experience isn’t really a factor with Hunter. He’s coached a lot at the OHL level and others have made the jump from junior coaching to NHL coaching before.
Yeah, there could have been more qualified candidates, but GMGM probably had this card for a while. He just chose to play it now.
Boudreau made this team relevant and fun to watch, and for that I thank him dearly. But moving on, it’s Hunter’s time.
"At the international level sport is frankly mimic warfare." - George Orwell
Love the fire, but skeptical of the hire...
Are the players going to respect a guy with zero NHL coaching experience? I would have
thought we needed somebody with credentials—and I wonder if the players wouldn’t have thought the same. Very strange hire, IMO.
Are players more likely to respect a guy with a ton of coaching experience or a ton of NHL playing experience? Even if optimally you’d want both, Huntzie’s playing career has to be taken in account when wondering if the players will respect him…which I have to believe they will.
Everything ends badly...otherwise it wouldn't end.
by Davethecapsfan on Nov 28, 2011 9:38 AM EST up reply actions
Among the current caps, who besides Carlson, (if any) did Hunter coach in London?
Because now I can justify browsing and commenting during the work day with the argument that I am promoting my business.
The loss to the injury-depleted Sabres in Buffalo was proved to be the final straw. Although Buffalo was without four of its top five penalty killers and seemed ripe for the picking, Boudreau opted to go for a low key game plan in an effort to eke out a rope-a-dope win in a low-scoring game, a strategy that is out of character for the offense-minded coach, and one that might not have been the best option against a team whose roster was littered with nine rookies.
This was in Vogel’s post. I didn’t see the game Saturday…does this assessment of the game plan jive with what everyone else saw? If so, this seems like an approach from a guy that has either lost confidence in his team or in his ability to coach the team. So sad. Good luck with your next gig, Bruce.
That might have had something to do with it, but I don’t think it really matters. The team on the ice Saturday looked completely uninspired. They could have gone with any game plan and still lost.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 9:43 AM EST up reply actions
I’m curious about the logic of Bruce supporters. I understand his regular season record was great, but it’s not the playoffs. Not to mention, how many of those wins can be attributed to the talent behind the Caps’ bench or the Caps’ talent on the ice? The players not only made him what he was, but they also broke him. A change was needed, and you aren’t getting rid of the guys making 9.5 and 6.7 million a year. It’s going to be the coach. Time and time again, he’s failed to make in-game adjustments, and he needed to make sure that he developed a system that suits the players, not the other way around. In addition to this, he’s had 3 ugly playoff exits that included a blown 2-0 lead to the Penguins, a 1st round loss to an 8th seed, and a 4-0 sweep to a division rival that the Caps had seen numerous times throughout the regular season. This was what was inexcusable for me. You have all the film in the world, but you can’t come up with an X’s and O’s plan to win at minimum, one game?
The Buffalo and Toronto games this season were absolutely embarrassing, and were due largely to the point there was no effort or motivation. Like I said before, a change needed to be made. This isn’t a panic button move, and I think a number of people on this message board predicted that Bruce would only lose his job if it appeared he lost the locker room. If lack of on ice effort isn’t a telling sign of losing the locker room, then what is? None of us are in the locker room to tell if he did or didn’t lose the room, the best we can do is see the on ice product, and it hasn’t matched the opposition’s intensity very much this season.
by JimCareyFanClub on Nov 28, 2011 9:42 AM EST reply actions
Haha… As you can see, I’m a big Ace fan, but this team needs more playoff performers, not regular season studs.
by JimCareyFanClub on Nov 28, 2011 9:48 AM EST up reply actions
Me, too...
"And as it’s my personal opinion, I’d appreciate not being told it’s stupid, thanks." - BeccaH
One thing about Hunter as an OHL coach…. he might be an introvert, but he has a reputation of being very chatty from the bench with the officials.
He was that way as a player too. He broke a lot of rules on the ice, but at the same time, he was always on good terms with the refs. I hate to think how many PIMs he might have had if he wasn’t on good terms with them.
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 10:15 AM EST up reply actions
This isn’t about being on good terms…this is about being too chatty and taking some minors from the bench…perhaps if not for his reputation, he’d take even more.
One thing I’ve always hated about Boudreau is his tendency to take things to “eleven” instantly with the refs with any bad call. It’s always straight to the expletives.
Not a good way to work the refs.
"Fais gros comme moi!" - Alex Ovechkin
by Gould Old Days on Nov 28, 2011 10:45 AM EST up reply actions
You’d better f*cking believe he f*cking is.
DUE TO THE LENGTH OF NHL HOCKEY
SKATE ELECTRIC WILL NOT BE SEEN
by docciavelli on Nov 28, 2011 11:32 AM EST up reply actions
He’s a fucking dirty asshat. I love him.
"Don't mind WM...he's an all-around jerk."
by Whiter Mage on Nov 28, 2011 11:33 AM EST up reply actions
It’s always straight to the expletives.
I suspect that’s what he did with players as well. After a while, the profanities are just white noise and the message gets lost in the middle. I’m surprised it took this long, really.
Cross check and all call.
by bigonetimer on Nov 28, 2011 11:41 AM EST up reply actions
I’d like to be a fly on the wall during the sit-downs Hunter and Ovechkin are bound to have over the next few days.
No kidding.
Everything ends badly...otherwise it wouldn't end.
by Davethecapsfan on Nov 28, 2011 9:46 AM EST up reply actions
Step#2 fpr GMGM —
Make a trade with the Blue Jackets for Rick Nash, so we have more Hunts alumni from the London Knights.
(joking, kinda, not really, sorta)
Goodbye Semin, Hello Nash?
I need 100% of you guys to give 110% 100% of the time.
by capsfan4life on Nov 28, 2011 9:52 AM EST up reply actions
I’m not sure that would work even in EA’s NHL 12.
If you want to survive out here, you've got to know where your towel is.
by ns on Nov 28, 2011 9:54 AM EST up reply actions
Oh man…. How about a top line of Ovechkin-Backstrom-Nash….
Roster lust in full force…
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 10:16 AM EST up reply actions
OT but coaching related and related to mid-season coaching changes and what coaches may have been available
- DarrenDreger Darren Dreger
1 coach down. Could there be 2 today? Rumours suggest Paul Maurice will be replaced by Milwaukee’s Kirk Muller. Interesting day.
I was just going to quote this tweet. I’m going to be displeased if this is the case.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 9:54 AM EST up reply actions
Was just about to paraphrase you.
"My favorite fan base in D.C. Is United's. Period. The end." - Steinberg
Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
by Bald Pollack on Nov 28, 2011 9:55 AM EST up reply actions
Damn the Canes may get Muller. Big score for them if they do.
by Rather Bengt on Nov 28, 2011 9:55 AM EST up reply actions
UGH! I much preferred the Canes under Maurice. They were like playful kittens.
The Artist Formerly Known as CP2Devil.
Associate Editor at Five For Howling.
It’s OK, in 3 years we’ll be talking about how they re-hired him.
by JimCareyFanClub on Nov 28, 2011 10:08 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
And according to Bob McKinzie, Muller is in. I am displeased. Without being in the room with both of them, I can’t know for sure, but I would have vastly preferred Muller.
"Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful" George E.P. Box
I have $50 to Olie's autism charity or So Kids Can and a beer on the under for 50/57/107 as AO's final stat line for 2011-'12
And on Pekka Rinne's PK SV% dropping under .920 by the end of the '12 season
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 28, 2011 10:12 AM EST up reply actions
Yeah I was keen on Muller ever since he was an ass’t with MTL. If GMGM made a move in the off-season, I was hoping he would scoop him up before he went to the AHL. Oh well, wishful thinking.
by Rather Bengt on Nov 28, 2011 10:38 AM EST up reply actions
Official from the 'Canes
Maurice is out… no replacement named yet:
http://hurricanes.nhl.com/club/news.htm?id=603554&navid=DL|CAR|home
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 10:25 AM EST up reply actions
Best wishes to Boudreau. I’m sad that he won’t be around for a championship here. You can’t deny he did a lot to bring back a culture of winning to the team.
Here’s hoping that all of the players react well to the change, by which I mean shaken to the core and have the sense of urgency rekindled. Semin should not be traded until we all see how he reacts to this change. If he get a fire lit under his rear and starts playing to his potential, we all know that is a wonderful thing to see.
And of course, best of luck to Coach Hunter, coming into a situation where everyone has very high expectations from the start.
In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king.
I’m almost scared to click over to OFB.
“Dale’s Job 1: He gets in Ovechkin’s grill & says "prove to me you deserve to remain the captain of this team.”
Oh, God.
by coreymull on Nov 28, 2011 9:56 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
True facts:
1) There are very few people who can say that to Ovechkin.
2) Dale Hunter is one of those people.
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 10:27 AM EST up reply actions
Brett Hull is an obnoxious blowhard and barely functional alcoholic. I’m shocked he’s out of bed at this hour.
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by RedBirdie on Nov 28, 2011 10:06 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
truth hurts sometimes!
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there’s drunk and then there’s Brett Hull.
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Hopefully the Caps can stop losing 7-1 and 5-1 so I don’t have to get so “Brett Hull” on the weekends.
by JimCareyFanClub on Nov 28, 2011 10:15 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I certainly hope so. It would explain the idiocy much better for me.
DUE TO THE LENGTH OF NHL HOCKEY
SKATE ELECTRIC WILL NOT BE SEEN
by docciavelli on Nov 28, 2011 11:36 AM EST up reply actions
it’s a rather poorly kept secret that he drinks like a fish
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the ‘z’ is wearing off my computer keyboard
by kingbonehead on Nov 28, 2011 10:06 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
I have hit that key 3 times in a row on many google searches
Check out a new social network, Hockey Connect, a place for coaches, players, family and fans to share strategies and experiences.
by Cap-O-Vens on Nov 28, 2011 10:11 AM EST up reply actions 3 recs
We saw what the team is capable of during the first seven season games and especially the game against the Redwings. That was one awesome game and let me believe that the guys had finally gotten it.
I was supporting Bruce during the last season when the talks about his firing have started.
But i wanted him gone after he managed to ruin the team´s play and the Toronto game was the last straw. I dont know exactly what he was doing, but he just overdo it. After the Toronto game it was evident to me that Bruce lost the team and it needed a change.
I wish him best luck, but i was really looking forward to his firing last couple of days.
So with Boudreau and Maurice gone, the longest serving coach in the Southeast goes to…
Guy Boucher
"My favorite fan base in D.C. Is United's. Period. The end." - Steinberg
Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
Hah!
Did you know that during Bruce’s tenure as Caps coach, every other team in the division has changed coaches at least twice!
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 10:18 AM EST up reply actions
Better late than never. Bruce was the right guy for this squad after Hanlon, but he wasn’t the right guy to help them take the next step. I hope he learns from his mistakes and his Caps experience makes him a better coach in his next gig. He’s a hard guy not to like.
As for Hunter, I’m weary of the hire only because his coaching experience, as noted above, is with junior age players. Coaching in juniors is very different than coaching in the pros. Ask anyone who has coached high school/college and then tried to coach in the pros (or vice versa). You can’t treat pros like teenagers. The one thing Dale has going for him is his own experience as an NHL player. Time will tell if Dale can adjust. GMGM certainly could have done a lot worse (Crawford).
The Artist Formerly Known as CP2Devil.
Associate Editor at Five For Howling.
by Carl Putnam on Nov 28, 2011 10:14 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
I’m weary of the hire
*wary
Don’t want to nitpick, but there’s a BIG difference between those two words, and an incredibly important one right now. ;)
"The Caps fan doesn't say, 'is the glass half full' or 'is the glass half empty'. He wonders when the glass is going to spill."
You aren’t nitpicking.
The Artist Formerly Known as CP2Devil.
Associate Editor at Five For Howling.
by Carl Putnam on Nov 28, 2011 12:06 PM EST up reply actions
Whyno
This next quote is from Bill Watters, who was Bruce Boudreau’s agent during Boudreau’s playing days.
Watters: “I called this a week ago. It was inevitable with Ovechkin. I don’t know whos going to be the second victim, but Bruce is the 1st.”
"My favorite fan base in D.C. Is United's. Period. The end." - Steinberg
Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
wow. second victim: GMGM? Evason? A player?
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George is safe… he’s not the problem.
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 10:19 AM EST up reply actions
Prior? Face it, we’ve got an elite goalie and a goalie who played very well last season both underperforming.
"You can want to get to April but when you get to April you may not like the answers you get, so you might as well enjoy the ride while it's going on." - Brian McNally on JRR, 8/29/2011
A lot of that is on the other guys playing, too. Two good goalies don’t just suddenly become two bad goalies. It’s not Prior’s fault.
The fact that Varly is still healthy means maybe Irbe wasn’t doing enough or being effective at keeping him healthy. Varly hasn’t played very well, but he is healthy.
Is the goaltending coach in charge of goalie conditioning/training as well? Not sure I see how it’s Irbe’s fault that Varly hurts himself.
Irbe once said they were working on ways to keep Varly from injuring himself while keeping his style of play. It seemed to me that Irbe had a lot to do with Varly’s conditioning. Of course, I don’t think Varly has a goalie coach at all now, so maybe that’s one of the reasons he’s doing so poorly and isn’t making those spectacular saves that, I’ll admit, I miss seeing.
Yes. Justin of the Goalie Guild has also thought that Col opted to not hire a full-time goalie coach was a mistake. He thought Varly being so young would still need one to continue his development and not fall back into bad habits.
"You can want to get to April but when you get to April you may not like the answers you get, so you might as well enjoy the ride while it's going on." - Brian McNally on JRR, 8/29/2011
We’re like 20 games in. Varly has had stretches of relative good health over 20 games before.
Everything ends badly...otherwise it wouldn't end.
by Davethecapsfan on Nov 28, 2011 11:42 AM EST up reply actions
There’s going to be a lot of that, I would imagine; how much is justified is hard to know. But I think there are going to be a lot of people who believe that Boudreau can’t be the problem since he’s a good Canadian boy who lives the game.
is it that, or the TEB column from a couple weeks ago? Despite the headline about how Bruce needed to get on the same page as Ovie, the meat was clearly “Ovechkin has become all but uncoachable.” and I don’t feel like TEB buys into the whole “good ol’ Canadian boy” narrative.
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Don’t really know not really knowing Watters and all. I’m sure the criticism that will be directed at the players – Ovie included – will be more than justified in a lot of instances, but I still expect a lot of people to side with Boudreau because they like the guy.
Some more
Watters: “When they decided that keeping Alex Ovechkin happy was secondary to winning a Stanley Cup, that was the end of Bruce Boudreau.”
"My favorite fan base in D.C. Is United's. Period. The end." - Steinberg
Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
by Bald Pollack on Nov 28, 2011 10:19 AM EST up reply actions
Be honest, when was the last time that you can remember something reflecting well on 8?
"You do that, you go to the box, you know. Two minutes, by yourself, you know and you feel shame" -Denis Lemieux
Him scoring while on his back against Phoenix.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 10:25 AM EST up reply actions
his spin-a-rama goal, featuring the unmoving force, Roman Hamrlik
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So Roman is used to getting beat. I knew there was a reason I didn’t like him.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 10:29 AM EST up reply actions
Bill Watters, who was Bruce Boudreau’s agent during Boudreau’s playing days.
Grain. Salt.
"Fais gros comme moi!" - Alex Ovechkin
by Gould Old Days on Nov 28, 2011 10:48 AM EST up reply actions
When, precisely, did they decide that? And how exactly did they implement this happiness keeping?
Is there something I’m missing here?
↑ ↑ ↓ ↓ ← → ← → b a (select) start
A lot of people would argue getting out-coached over and over in the playoffs was the end of Bruce Boudreau…it was just a long, dragged out and painful process.
Everything ends badly...otherwise it wouldn't end.
by Davethecapsfan on Nov 28, 2011 10:24 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
And some more
More Watters: “You’re not going to win with Alex Ovechkin playing for the Capitals the way he plays.”
"My favorite fan base in D.C. Is United's. Period. The end." - Steinberg
Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
by Bald Pollack on Nov 28, 2011 10:44 AM EST up reply actions
I never get why agents run their mouths publicly like this thinking it helps their clients. This isn’t politics. Spinning in this fashion makes both Ovi AND your client look bad.
The Artist Formerly Known as CP2Devil.
Associate Editor at Five For Howling.
by Carl Putnam on Nov 28, 2011 10:46 AM EST up reply actions
We’ll see. We’re all frustrated with Ovie but in fairness it has to be tough to keep buying into a coach that has led the team to one playoff failure after another.
I’m not saying he’s wrong. I’m saying as an agent its not a bright move. Makes your client look weak and an excuse maker by extension.
The Artist Formerly Known as CP2Devil.
Associate Editor at Five For Howling.
by Carl Putnam on Nov 28, 2011 11:03 AM EST up reply actions
Technically, Boudreau is Ovi’s second victim. Bykov was the first.
You perhaps knew me better as "Your Nation's Capital." Same great commentary, now with 100% more transparency!
Bykov did it all on his own…
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 10:42 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Well, in either case, wouldn’t Hanlon be the first NHL coach victim?
You tried your best and failed miserably. The lesson is "Never Try."
eh. I’m not prepared to lay Hanlon’s firing at the feet of Ovie.
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I still trust him. The guy just isn’t Caps coach anymore.
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 10:25 AM EST up reply actions
I think this, in the end, will end up being a mistake. I’m not sold on Hunter, though I know half of you longer time caps fans probably wet yourselves.
I'm on the twitters! Currently Watching: Catching up on Walking Dead
"Common sense is not so common."
The combination of the two? I’m in the camp of it being a player issue.
I'm on the twitters! Currently Watching: Catching up on Walking Dead
"Common sense is not so common."
by Ovechwin on Nov 28, 2011 10:20 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
It may very well be, but I think it’s hard to argue Boudreau didn’t look like he was in over his head. The players may very well need to be re-organized, but it was Boudreau’s time.
I was getting to that point, but it still sucks because I really liked Bruce.
I'm on the twitters! Currently Watching: Catching up on Walking Dead
"Common sense is not so common."
I like plenty of people, doesn’t mean they shouldn’t be fired when they aren’t cutting the mustard.
The Artist Formerly Known as CP2Devil.
Associate Editor at Five For Howling.
by Carl Putnam on Nov 28, 2011 10:27 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Liking Bruce as Bruce and as the Caps head coach are two completely different things. I defending him like crazy the last two years, but it’s getting harder and harder to do that considering the talent we’ve got here and their performance on the ice.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 10:30 AM EST up reply actions
should we trade players?
if so, then should we blow this ship up? I think we’re way too early to say that the ship ran its course right now…..
They had no choice but to let Boudreau go. When a team lays down like they did against Buffalo, it’s over.
I can understand why the team lost confidence in him, too. His performance has enough holes in it to understand that.
Patron saint of quality footwear.
Just my observation again, but the only “adjustments” I ever really noticed Boudreau making were line changes. If they lost a game, he’d come out with all new line combos and defensive pairings. Then they’d lose another game and he’d switch everything again. I’m looking forward to getting more steady line combos and actually making adjustments to the style of play.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 11:45 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Even that wasn’t anything new. It was the trap. It never was adapted for the personnel on the team, nor did it provide any kind of smooth offensive transition.
It seemed that BB never put his stamp on it, which is why it ultimately failed. He was never comfortable with it.
by Gin and Tonic on Nov 28, 2011 12:54 PM EST up reply actions
He turned them into a legitimately good defensive team. The offense failed, but the offense had failed before he implemented the trap so…
But that was a big picture, organizational level strategic change. He wasn’t good at the smaller, tactical adjustments.
Nor did he implement those changes quickly or proactively.
And his only tactical adjustment was to mix the line combos.
The offense failed because he couldn’t implement a system that countered how the opposition was shutting the offense down.
by Gin and Tonic on Nov 28, 2011 1:07 PM EST up reply actions
That always sort of screamed, “I don’t know what to do!”
"Oh, so that's what you're gonna do."
by Rainbow, Kitty, Beer on Nov 28, 2011 11:52 AM EST up reply actions
I know half of you longer time caps fans probably wet yourselves.
The hell?
"My favorite fan base in D.C. Is United's. Period. The end." - Steinberg
Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
by Bald Pollack on Nov 28, 2011 10:20 AM EST up reply actions
I heard a lot of people were way into the idea because they liked him so much when he played here.
I'm on the twitters! Currently Watching: Catching up on Walking Dead
"Common sense is not so common."
And that calls for “wetting yourselves?”
"My favorite fan base in D.C. Is United's. Period. The end." - Steinberg
Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
by Bald Pollack on Nov 28, 2011 10:24 AM EST up reply actions
similar to a dog that can’t control it’s bladder when it gets all excited. Cocker Spaniels are notorious for this.
by Beakers Lab on Nov 28, 2011 10:39 AM EST up reply actions
I think most of us are more in the Uh….how is this going to work? mindset. Hardly a wet yourself opportunity.
There's always more to learn about Hockey.
I"m just explaining how I read the “wet yourself” comment, I’m firmly in the I like Hunter but this could be a total disaster camp.
by Beakers Lab on Nov 28, 2011 10:44 AM EST up reply actions
Come on, that’s not fair. I mean we didn’t hire Bengt Gustafsson.
by Rather Bengt on Nov 28, 2011 10:47 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I am totally floored to see Dale Hunter, a name I half-jokingly threw out there during the Sabres game, as the new head coach. I was sure at the time that GMGM would choose a more seasoned NHL coach.
Does GMGM believes AO is part of the problem?
Oh, and Hunter needs to clean house and bring in his own crew.
"And as it’s my personal opinion, I’d appreciate not being told it’s stupid, thanks." - BeccaH
That’s what I’ve been thinking about. How fast all the asst. coaches go.
Jeez. We have Pittsburgh this Thursday.
Rumour has it he will be bringing his brothers Mark and Dave as assistants, as well as Fred Dryer who will play “Hunter”.
by Rather Bengt on Nov 28, 2011 10:50 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Can Will Ferrell come in as a pro scout and reprise his role as “Bitch Hunter?”
Unleash the Apathy.
by D'ohboy on Nov 28, 2011 10:54 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Green practicing today
Per multiple sources. So if Green plays tomorrow night and they win, I envision some great conversations about whether it is a continuation of Green being the most vital cog of this team, or whether it because Hunter has given them a renewed energy.
I’m curious as to how well a guy like Green does with Hunter. Mr. mentally fragile……and one of Bruce’s favorites….
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by RedBirdie on Nov 28, 2011 10:30 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Any evidence from the last 3 seasons that Green is mentally fragile? Physically, sure. I’ll even give you the fragile brain from getting hit in the head. But mentally fragile? I don’t understand why that guy gets no credit for changing his game as much and as well as he has.
"Fais gros comme moi!" - Alex Ovechkin
by Gould Old Days on Nov 28, 2011 10:50 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
you know I’m a huge Mike Green fan and no one was as thrilled to find him working with a sports shrink as I was. I hope hope hope that he’s made strides and continues to do so. But, in the past, it’s been exceptionally easy to throw him off his game. I recall Green saying how he used to be too worried about what other people thought about him, too.
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Sports psychologist. Not worried about Green at all. I just hope his season didn’t get derailed by getting drilled in the groin. So happy to see he was on the ice skating this morning (and apparently over the weekend as well).
"The Caps fan doesn't say, 'is the glass half full' or 'is the glass half empty'. He wonders when the glass is going to spill."
Can’t imagine he plays tomorrow. If anything, they’ll bring him back for the Pitt game.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 10:31 AM EST up reply actions
great, So St. Sid can elbow him in the head. Fabulous.
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And not take a penalty for it. Maybe we can bring back Jurcina for some intense, front-of-the-net cross-checking action!
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 10:34 AM EST up reply actions
Erskine (not that I want him out on the ice against the pens top line).
I’ll never forget the day ShaMo decided the best way to neutralize crosby was to sit on him.
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Or he’ll block a shot with his ankle and get a concussion.
There's always more to learn about Hockey.
by WordsOnIce on Nov 28, 2011 10:34 AM EST up reply actions 2 recs
our world would be a vastly less confusing place without Mike Green’s strange injuries.
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Green needs to sit until he’s 110%.
"And as it’s my personal opinion, I’d appreciate not being told it’s stupid, thanks." - BeccaH
So he should just retire then?
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 10:39 AM EST up reply actions
That guy is never going to be 110 percent. That’s not to say he can’t still be a force though.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 10:44 AM EST up reply actions
I saw him Friday night out after the Rags game, he looked extra spacey
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FWIW, wait and see….Green sightings at the practice facility does not mean Green will practice with the team at noon.
Reasons to be at practice facility: Welcome new coach, say goodbye to old coach (if he is around), get treatment, possibly skate on his own before team…
if there’s anyone I expect to make sure they say goodbye to Bruce in person it’s Green, followed by Laich (who else is a holdover from the group? Anyone?)
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can’t believe I forgot Sarge, and Hendy for Bruce giving him that PTO to turned into a full time gig.
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The return of a dman who can actually skate will be a nice change. When Wideman took a digger last game I nearly fell out of bed laughing. Reminded me of that shoot out he had back in Florida.
the return of a d man that can actually play D would be awesome. because that in no way describes Dennis Wideman.
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specifically the core players, in whom so many years and dollars are invested – who are simply incapable of receiving the message, insistent on freelancing and system-allergic
AO has been freelancing since he entered the league, and probably always has played like that. It will be interesting to see how Dale handles him, or if he thinks AO is a problem at all…
"And as it’s my personal opinion, I’d appreciate not being told it’s stupid, thanks." - BeccaH
Well...
I’m back in as an actively interested fan. I’ve been watching the games this season but hardly with the same level of interest as in many years before. I wish this change would have happened in the off-season but now is better than later this season, I suppose.
See ya Gabby. Your regular season accolades were quite impressive. Cheers on breaking 200 wins.
If you want to tell people the truth, make them laugh, otherwise they'll kill you.
by zephyr on Nov 28, 2011 10:33 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
The season definitely just got a lot more interesting. Dunno if Hunter has the chops to coach a playoff winner, or the subtle feel for game momentum that Gabby had… But he should be a lot of fun to watch!
by Berube Doobie Doo on Nov 28, 2011 10:59 AM EST up reply actions
West coast checking in… Wow. Well, some of us are getting what we wanted. I was convinced this team wasn’t going to win a Cup with BB as coach, so I feel, one way or another, we just got closer.
"...what're you gonna do?"
by Rainbow, Kitty, Beer on Nov 28, 2011 10:40 AM EST reply actions
So tempted to bolt from work, head to KCI to watch the first Dale Hunter Caps practice. Alas, way too much work, little of which I am getting to thanks to the BB firing and the very active Japers’ Rink today!
I’m off and I’d be joining you, but I’m spending the day babysitting my grandson (he’s napping now) hopefully it’ll be nice this afternoon so I can take him to the park.
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 10:44 AM EST up reply actions
If you do, I’d suggest a FanPost so it doesn’t get lost in the mung.
"My favorite fan base in D.C. Is United's. Period. The end." - Steinberg
Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
by Bald Pollack on Nov 28, 2011 11:17 AM EST up reply actions
Also Remember Folks...
..Despite being fired as coach, Bruce is still an employee of the Caps and will still be working for them in some capacity until he finds another gig. I could see BB becoming an advance scout for a bit..
It’s still in BB’s interest for the Caps to do well…
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
Wouldn’t he want to just cut ties and begin his new career search? I wouldn’t wanna hang around if I were just fired from a company.
Gotta wait for Columbus to fire their dude.
"Don't mind WM...he's an all-around jerk."
by Whiter Mage on Nov 28, 2011 11:02 AM EST up reply actions
they’ll probably give him some time to chill out before finding him a position. And given the value placed on loyalty over at Kettler, I’m sure it was a very long conversation yesterday. I think GMGM and Ted genuinely like Bruce the person and it wasn’t easy to tell someone like that that they’re no longer the coach.
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I dunno… if someone told me don’t show up to work but we’re still going to pay you for the rest of the year, I’d probably be like “Sure, why not?”
Esp. since Bruce was certainly making 7 figures a year… Maybe he’s made enough that he and Crystal can simply retire, or he can be a studio analyst for Comcast/NBC or NHL Network.
Occasionally reporting from Section 421 of the Verizon Center...
by MikeL-Pivonka on Nov 28, 2011 7:04 PM EST up reply actions
Random stats that I don't have any commentary for...
GF-GA during the 8 game losing streak last year: 11-28 (-17)
- 0-5 in 1 goal games
During the last 8 games this year: 17-34 (-17)
- 2-1 in 1 goal games
I’m going to miss GOD’s postings on that fine bire foudreau he so enjoys.
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I won’t. It didn’t feel good to call for the head of a coach I liked and who I think is a very good coach.
"Fais gros comme moi!" - Alex Ovechkin
by Gould Old Days on Nov 28, 2011 10:51 AM EST up reply actions
If you start twisting “Curb Hunter” you might run into some trouble.
"My favorite fan base in D.C. Is United's. Period. The end." - Steinberg
Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
by Bald Pollack on Nov 28, 2011 10:52 AM EST up reply actions
And my response was overly harsh. I guess I’m just feeling more strongly today about what just happened than I thought I would.
"Fais gros comme moi!" - Alex Ovechkin
by Gould Old Days on Nov 28, 2011 12:40 PM EST up reply actions
it’s okay. my stomach fell when I logged into the Rink and “Bruce Fired” was the first thing I saw. still trying to process it.
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A concern of mine is that some of the more blue-collar guys may begin to resent the so-called star-players such as Ovechkin and Semin whose play/antics contributed to Boudreau getting canned. May be completely off-base but was just one of the first things that came to mind when I heard.
begin? I think that ship sailed
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Yeah. If you can’t see the dividing line on that team between the blue collars/Bruce’s Hershey guys, and the “euros” and skill players on the other, you’re blind.
Unleash the Apathy.
curious as to where one Mike Green falls on that spectrum. Skill out the wazoo and yet vice president of the Bruce’s boys
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I put him and Brooks in the latter category, not the former. Green owes a hell of a lot to BB.
Unleash the Apathy.
Brooks, without hesitation, I put in that blue collar/Hershey graduates category. I wavered on Green, despite knowing that that’s practically a father-son relationship.
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I think it’s just as likely that the blue-collar guys resented BB for letting the stars do what they want and are looking forward to a coach who will bring some real accountability.
Release the Mackan!
by Killer_Carlson on Nov 28, 2011 1:24 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
The Blue Jackets might as well come out and say they’ve hired him already.
But seriously, best of luck to him. He’s like Hanlon at this point – he did his job, and his ship has sailed. I hope he succeeds at his next port of call against all teams that are not based out of DC.
Hunter? Outside of his awesome OHL record and how douchebaggy he demands his players play (I think?), who knows? I guess we’re all in wait and see now.
"Don't mind WM...he's an all-around jerk."
Dale's impact
Based on little more than my gut instinct, I anticipate:
-Consistent lines and D-pairings, among them Carlznerson back together.
-Some fire behind the bench once in a while.
-Dale will unleash Carlson the way Boudreau unleashed Green 4 years ago. We’ll be seeing a motivated, enthusiastic Carlson, and we’ll be seeing a lot of him on the power play. I think it’s time.
-This to be only the first move in a shakeup…
-This move will take time, but it will improve our team and chances of success in the playoffs.
The keyboard is mightier.
I’m not sure it brings consistent lines. Fire once in a while? Bruce had fire, but he just yelled. We might see Huntsy throw shit on the ice after an Islander goal. I hope you’re right on point 3. Point 4 is likely. Point 5? We all hope, but I’m not sure.
"Don't mind WM...he's an all-around jerk."
by Whiter Mage on Nov 28, 2011 10:55 AM EST up reply actions
well that’s quite a way to wake up on a monday. I guess deep down I thought that they never could win a cup with Bruce which is why I thought this move would come not in the middle of the season and not after another playoff disappointment. hopefully that won’t happen now.
"I was so drunk I thought a tube of toothpaste was astronaut food"
My Twittah!
Is there an online video or radio link for the press conference?
by JimCareyFanClub on Nov 28, 2011 10:56 AM EST reply actions
WJFK said they’d have it.
"Don't mind WM...he's an all-around jerk."
by Whiter Mage on Nov 28, 2011 10:56 AM EST up reply actions
I’m listening to the WJFK livestream on their website, assuming they’ll pick it up http://player.radio.com/player/RadioPlayer.php?version=1.2.12495&station=114
"I was so drunk I thought a tube of toothpaste was astronaut food"
My Twittah!
They definitely said they would while I was driving home. I’mma be pissed if they don’t.
"Don't mind WM...he's an all-around jerk."
by Whiter Mage on Nov 28, 2011 11:02 AM EST up reply actions
shit. I have a meeting in 2 minutes.
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catch you on the flip side.
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Two minutes. And WJFK is actually doing a good job of covering it. B-Mitch wants GMGM to get fired too, but it’s good to hear the radio not talking Redskins for more than 2 minutes.
"Don't mind WM...he's an all-around jerk."
by Whiter Mage on Nov 28, 2011 10:58 AM EST up reply actions
B-Mitch doesn’t know shit about hockey.
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by RedBirdie on Nov 28, 2011 10:59 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
In fairness to him, his argument wasn’t framed as poorly as I put it. He said something like “If this guy doesn’t work out, it’s his fourth hiring, and at some point you gotta look at the guy making the hirings. He seems to like guys from the minors instead of big names, and if he gets another chance he’ll probably look that way, but at some point you gotta look up.”
"Don't mind WM...he's an all-around jerk."
by Whiter Mage on Nov 28, 2011 11:01 AM EST up reply actions
Eh….I don’t always buy that argument. Coaches always get held accountable for not making the players play to their potential, but I feel as though that’s rarely the case. These guys are adults and aren’t going to play if they don’t want to. A coach isn’t going to change much.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 11:03 AM EST up reply actions
He’s talking about the GM, not the coach, and your argument is one where who knows? I think sports is almost mostly coaching.
"Don't mind WM...he's an all-around jerk."
by Whiter Mage on Nov 28, 2011 11:06 AM EST up reply actions
Prediction for what GMGM says:
- Very difficult decision to make.
- Lot of respect for Bruce. Can’t underestimate the success he had here and the value he brought.
- Just felt like this is what the team needed, and, unfortunately, it’s my job to make these decisions.
- The team really didn’t seem like it would get out of this funk without a change. No question they have to play better, but I feel like we gave Bruce a team to be successful.
- I’m not going to discuss which coaches we considered or when we reached out to Dale, etc. That’s company business.
- We feel like Dale gives us the best opportunity to win now and in the future. You can’t dispute his heritage here in DC and the respect the players have for him.
- I’m not going to speculate on future player moves. Next question.
- It’s not just Ovie or Semin. Every player needs to step up. Every player has to look at himself and ensure he’s giving maximum effort.
- Before we make any player decisions, I want to give Dale the freedom to evaluate the players and provide input.
- I hope the fans understand that we’re doing everything we can to bring a Stanley Cup to DC.
Nice guys finish first, but sometimes the season is awfully long.
Follow me on Twitter.
- Also I am appointing Doh’ as my new consigliere, he has been calling for this hit for a few years now.
Check out a new social network, Hockey Connect, a place for coaches, players, family and fans to share strategies and experiences.
GMGM says no deals lined up, but they’ll get back on the phones tomorrow. I think that says a lot in that he thinks there are more problems with this team.
by hockeyman33 on Nov 28, 2011 11:18 AM EST up reply actions
Holy shit, he really said they’ll be on the phones? There’s definitely going to be another trade this season then.
Proud member of the Popsicle Division of the Cupcake Conference.
I’m sure many have said these things, but…
First, thanks to Bruce. He did a great job as Caps coach and took this team as far as he could, for whatever reason. Second, I don’t think firing BB was the wrong move – the team just wasn’t playing for him anymore, and the buttons he pushed didn’t work anymore. Third, I am concerned about Hunter’s lack of NHL experience, but I love his fire and the fact that every player will have instant respect for him. He’s Mr. Capital and built his career on hard work and sandpaper.
Godspeed Bruce, and god save the Caps.
by grapejoos on Nov 28, 2011 11:07 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
“We have too many players playing bad” — GMGM … yeap, that’s the issue right there.
What doesnt kill you makes you stronger.
by BetterOffWith28 on Nov 28, 2011 11:08 AM EST reply actions
Hmmm. Isn’t that “playing poorly”?
Nice guys finish first, but sometimes the season is awfully long.
Follow me on Twitter.
good players playing bad, and rich players playing poor
Check out a new social network, Hockey Connect, a place for coaches, players, family and fans to share strategies and experiences.
yea, i should have said paraphrasing… I have pretty bad memory :P
What doesnt kill you makes you stronger.
by BetterOffWith28 on Nov 28, 2011 11:10 AM EST up reply actions
“we’ve got the players attention now” I’d say so
"I was so drunk I thought a tube of toothpaste was astronaut food"
My Twittah!
“He’s the best coach in juniors, it’s not one, two, three years, it’s eleven years, and they’re the top team in Juniors. He played 19 years and was a captain.”
"Don't mind WM...he's an all-around jerk."
by Whiter Mage on Nov 28, 2011 11:12 AM EST up reply actions
“This is the only team he wanted to coach.”
Oh man, warm fuzzies.
"Don't mind WM...he's an all-around jerk."
by Whiter Mage on Nov 28, 2011 11:13 AM EST up reply actions
I was thinking of you the minute I saw who was replacing Bruce.
There's always more to learn about Hockey.
I’m not sure how I feel yet.
"Don't mind WM...he's an all-around jerk."
by Whiter Mage on Nov 28, 2011 11:25 AM EST up reply actions
yeah…I love hearing this. Live up to it Huntzie, please.
Everything ends badly...otherwise it wouldn't end.
by Davethecapsfan on Nov 28, 2011 11:50 AM EST up reply actions
What GMGM seems to be getting at :
We’re proud of BB.
This is not a slump, players didn’t respond to BB
Players aren’t playing well (all players, not calling out Ovi)
Dale Hunter is a hard worker and needs to bring this new attitude in
Great resume with playing career and coaching. “We’ve been talking consistently for 11 years”
Coaching is coaching, NHL or OHL. He understands the game.
“We’ve been trying to get him for a long time.”
"Don't mind WM...he's an all-around jerk."
by Whiter Mage on Nov 28, 2011 11:14 AM EST up reply actions
That’s interesting. You wonder if they tried to get him over the summer.
Nice guys finish first, but sometimes the season is awfully long.
Follow me on Twitter.
Yep, that lends a new perspective to things. So I guess we can go ahead and conclude that the 24/7 comment about “if they knew anything about the game they’d be in it” was typical GMGM deception as well. He was thinking about this for a long time.
Do you think he’s wanted to fire BB for a while, or that he knew when the time came that Dale would be the replacement?
by JimCareyFanClub on Nov 28, 2011 11:20 AM EST up reply actions
My guess would be that he’s been considering the option of firing BB for a while and lining up potential replacements. Probably wanted to give BB a few months to see if adding depth would make a difference.
Right… I don’t think he’s planned on firing him as much as he has said “what will I do if that time comes?” If he wanted Bruce out over the summer, he would have done it.
by JimCareyFanClub on Nov 28, 2011 11:23 AM EST up reply actions
I don’t think that’s disrespect to BB. Hunter is a Caps legend, so I think you always entertain the idea of getting him back into the organization, especially as a head coach.
by JimCareyFanClub on Nov 28, 2011 11:15 AM EST up reply actions
Was this in response to a question?
"Oh, so that's what you're gonna do."
by Rainbow, Kitty, Beer on Nov 28, 2011 11:48 AM EST up reply actions
One of the CSN reporters (Lisa Hillary or someone) mentioned taking the captaincy away in a question but was actually asking about something else, and GMGM cut her off and said no, thats not happening.
by hockeyman33 on Nov 28, 2011 11:54 AM EST up reply actions
CSN reporter is Jill Sorenson. Lisa Hillary has been in Philly for two years.
"The Caps fan doesn't say, 'is the glass half full' or 'is the glass half empty'. He wonders when the glass is going to spill."
Thanks. I wouldn’t conclude that Ovie will definitely keep the C through the rest of the season, though.
"Oh, so that's what you're gonna do."
by Rainbow, Kitty, Beer on Nov 28, 2011 12:00 PM EST up reply actions
McPhee always says he’s looking for trades
"Fais gros comme moi!" - Alex Ovechkin
by Gould Old Days on Nov 28, 2011 12:43 PM EST up reply actions
GMGM’s body language makes him seem really sad too. Looking down a lot, seems to be thinking more about his answers, bouncing back and forth. Not sure if i’ve seen any of his pressers before so i don’t know if this is normal with him. Sure is sad about BB leaving.
I think there’s a natural regret/sadness about letting a guy who you’ve interacted with for a few years, though that said I think this one (where he sought the guy out, almost stashed him in Hershey) might have stung a little more.
"My favorite fan base in D.C. Is United's. Period. The end." - Steinberg
Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
by Bald Pollack on Nov 28, 2011 11:25 AM EST up reply actions
at a personal level, GMGM has always been very fond of Bruce. Prior to this, if you’ve ever heard GMGM speak of Bruce, he just lights up—and GMGM is not an easy man to get to light up.
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You know how Bruce would sometimes pull the goalie in order to motivate the team? This is McPhee’s version of that.
Reporter: "What’s your Mom’s birthday?"
Tortorella: "I have no idea."
by Wheeler on Nov 28, 2011 11:23 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
are you me? because I just thought that word for word
"I was so drunk I thought a tube of toothpaste was astronaut food"
My Twittah!
Other blogs
I thought about going over to Pensburgh to see what’s the reaction over there, but I just don’t have the necessary masochism to do it.
There's always more to learn about Hockey.
Or they are rejoicing. They’ve said some pretty nasty, biting, ice-cream related fat man comments over there pretty often.
There's always more to learn about Hockey.
I believe you’ve confused thepensblog for Pensburgh. We use tpb for the wing-sauce and Haagen-Dazs jokes, while reserving Pensburgh for the more substantive comments like, “I wonder if Hunter will motivate Ovechkin to return to 50-goal form. Shit.”
DUE TO THE LENGTH OF NHL HOCKEY
SKATE ELECTRIC WILL NOT BE SEEN
by docciavelli on Nov 28, 2011 11:29 AM EST up reply actions
One can hope Docc, one can hope.
Everything ends badly...otherwise it wouldn't end.
by Davethecapsfan on Nov 28, 2011 11:52 AM EST up reply actions
I'll give you the Pens' fan reaction:
Shock, and disappointment that it comes just days before the Pens play the Caps. The Caps should be motivated to get a big win for their new coach, and it may negate the seeming advantage the Pens had, coming in with Crosby for the first post-Winter Classic “Sid v. Ovie” matchup.
Did not see this coming, though I probably should have.
DUE TO THE LENGTH OF NHL HOCKEY
SKATE ELECTRIC WILL NOT BE SEEN
by docciavelli on Nov 28, 2011 11:28 AM EST up reply actions
They’d have been motivated for the Pens regardless (not saying they’d have won, but motivation vs. the Pens is never an issue).
All this “new coach” talk will come to an end Thursday as AO rings Sid’s bell for the last time.
"And as it’s my personal opinion, I’d appreciate not being told it’s stupid, thanks." - BeccaH
I'll pop a FanShot link to this over there.
I suppose we’ll see what the reaction is.
DUE TO THE LENGTH OF NHL HOCKEY
SKATE ELECTRIC WILL NOT BE SEEN
by docciavelli on Nov 28, 2011 11:30 AM EST up reply actions
My hockey acumen is not the best so my gut feeling regarding Dale is probably wrong. My only problem with hiring Hunter is that he is/was a legend here. To me it raise the question if he’s the best coach choice available.
What doesnt kill you makes you stronger.
by BetterOffWith28 on Nov 28, 2011 11:25 AM EST reply actions
He’s suggesting maybe there was someone better who was obscured by Hunter’s aura.
"Don't mind WM...he's an all-around jerk."
by Whiter Mage on Nov 28, 2011 11:27 AM EST up reply actions
Thanks for the clarification …precisely.
What doesnt kill you makes you stronger.
by BetterOffWith28 on Nov 28, 2011 11:30 AM EST up reply actions
That’s my concern. Is this a case of playing to the fanbase, at the expense of the team?
DUE TO THE LENGTH OF NHL HOCKEY
SKATE ELECTRIC WILL NOT BE SEEN
by docciavelli on Nov 28, 2011 11:32 AM EST up reply actions
I don’t even see it as playing the fanbase, I see it to some as corporate nepotism.
What doesnt kill you makes you stronger.
by BetterOffWith28 on Nov 28, 2011 11:36 AM EST up reply actions
SP … I see it to some extent as corporate nepotism
What doesnt kill you makes you stronger.
by BetterOffWith28 on Nov 28, 2011 11:37 AM EST up reply actions
What was Hunter’s prior role again?
DUE TO THE LENGTH OF NHL HOCKEY
SKATE ELECTRIC WILL NOT BE SEEN
by docciavelli on Nov 28, 2011 11:38 AM EST up reply actions
OHL coach?
What doesnt kill you makes you stronger.
by BetterOffWith28 on Nov 28, 2011 11:38 AM EST up reply actions
That’s what I thought.
DUE TO THE LENGTH OF NHL HOCKEY
SKATE ELECTRIC WILL NOT BE SEEN
by docciavelli on Nov 28, 2011 11:40 AM EST up reply actions
To the extent Hunter’s past role as a player has anything to do with this, I think it’s for the players on the team, most notably the one who wears the “C” that Hunter once wore. He’s a guy who the players will respect instantly for who he is. We’ll see how he can coach.
To be honest, I don’t think GMGM is taking local legendary status into this. If he is, I’m pissed, and I like the hiring.
"Don't mind WM...he's an all-around jerk."
by Whiter Mage on Nov 28, 2011 11:26 AM EST up reply actions
Hunter Toughness
Let’s hope next time someone takes a run at Green (like the last Devil’s game, IIRC) there’s some hockey frontier justice meted out.
by ShootTheBullets on Nov 28, 2011 11:27 AM EST reply actions
Hunter’ll hop the bench for that shit.
"Don't mind WM...he's an all-around jerk."
by Whiter Mage on Nov 28, 2011 11:33 AM EST up reply actions
not sure if this got brought up yet...
but on PD Wysh called Ovie a “coach killer” not really sure if that applies but ok
"I was so drunk I thought a tube of toothpaste was astronaut food"
My Twittah!
He’s a saint!
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 11:29 AM EST up reply actions
I missed that one….is it on youtube?
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 11:39 AM EST up reply actions
Yes. Have a barf bag handy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMW64KYCiBc
There's always more to learn about Hockey.
ahahahahahahaha……that kid totally JIHP when he saw Crosby.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 11:54 AM EST up reply actions
yeah crosby has had 3 coaches just like ovie.
"I was so drunk I thought a tube of toothpaste was astronaut food"
My Twittah!
Is that really fair, though? I wasn’t here for the Hanlon era. My first experience with the caps was right after Bruce was hired.
There's always more to learn about Hockey.
absolutely not fair to blame Ovie for Hanlon, imo. Also not fair to blame him for Boykov (sp?)
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This is sorta ridiculous. There are other players on this team. If they’re all little sheep and just blindly follow Ovechkin, we’ve got problems a lot deeper than we thought. I really don’t think they’re all not playing just because Ovechkin isn’t.
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 11:29 AM EST up reply actions
Makes more sense to call Semin a “coach-killer” than Ovechkin. Semin’s done more to harm the team this season.
DUE TO THE LENGTH OF NHL HOCKEY
SKATE ELECTRIC WILL NOT BE SEEN
by docciavelli on Nov 28, 2011 11:37 AM EST up reply actions
I’m curious if Wysh thinks Bruce is more likely to succeed or fail at his next job.
by JimCareyFanClub on Nov 28, 2011 11:36 AM EST up reply actions
This thread is killing my browser. It’s running slower than Hamrlik.
by jopierce on Nov 28, 2011 11:40 AM EST up reply actions 6 recs
You’re using the new “Hal Gill” browser?
DUE TO THE LENGTH OF NHL HOCKEY
SKATE ELECTRIC WILL NOT BE SEEN
by docciavelli on Nov 28, 2011 11:40 AM EST up reply actions
boom…roasted!
I don’t have much tolerance for stupid. Or cheese on food that doesn’t need it. -duck
by twistedlogic on Nov 28, 2011 11:40 AM EST up reply actions
you must be running on a 286 cpu then
What doesnt kill you makes you stronger.
by BetterOffWith28 on Nov 28, 2011 11:41 AM EST up reply actions
Where are JP and F&B on this? They must be either doing some research or letting everyone else vent :)
Sounds like it’s a real job kind of day for JP, judging by his tweets.
If wishes were horses, we'd all be eating steak.
by Hang a Laingtern on Your Problems on Nov 28, 2011 11:40 AM EST up reply actions
F&B isn’t on all that frequently during the day.
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Who would have ever thought that DC sports radio would spend an entire Monday morning talking about hockey the day after a Redskins win?
by JimCareyFanClub on Nov 28, 2011 11:45 AM EST reply actions
Wow, hell of the news to wake up to. I have so much work I should be doing today—have to do today—and so, of course, I’m here and on twitter, and everywhere. Bizarrely, the first thing I read on this topic was a tweet from Nicky’s brother. And the only thing he found interesting enough to tweet from the press conference was that GMGM said he’d look for trades.
I have to say, I loved Bruce, and I’m so sorry that we couldn’t win a Cup with him, because he will win one someday. But, as everyone else has said, his comments after Buffalo, and the Dale Hunter rumors made this a sad reality but in no way a shock.
I was already planning to be at practice on Wednesday, but wild horses couldn’t keep me away now. (I’d be there right now if I weren’t in TN…and didn’t have all this work.)
Fresh ice here: http://www.japersrink.com/2011/11/28/2592188/farewell-bruce-welcome-dale-second-thread
You perhaps knew me better as "Your Nation's Capital." Same great commentary, now with 100% more transparency!
My Thoughts
As many of you know, I’ve been a pretty loud critic of Boudreau’s coaching as early as the 2007-2008 season. That team lacked structure, it didn’t go to the net with any kind of regularity, and it (predictably) lost to a less-talented, but more experienced team. The initial failure could be attributed to the inexperience of key players, or a roster still sprinkled with the leftovers of the rebuild. With time and some roster tweaks, it was a reasonable assumption that the team would progress and compete for the cup.
2008-2009 saw much the same results. The team performed well in the regular season, but it still lacked defensive structure or an ability to grind out games. The team had two glaring kryptonite-level weaknesses: the neutral zone trap and hard forechecking pressure. The trap denied the Caps the ability to score off the rush, and hard forechecking exposed the fact that Mike Green was their only reliable puck-moving defenseman. Predictably, a tight neutral zone checking scheme and great goaltending allowed the Rangers to push the Caps to the brink before Dan Bylsma’s pressure forechecking system finished the Caps off for good.
Still, we could look at the roster that offseason and see the holes. The Caps still lacked good defensemen outside of Green, and the forward corps was still populated with soft, oft-injured or inexperienced players. The acquisitions of Knuble and Brendan Morrison, combined with the eventual arrival of Karl Alzner were supposed to help matters.
The Alzner situation didn’t really resolve itself for another year, but Knuble and Morrison contributed to what was, in terms of regular season success, the best Caps team in history. Still, the team had the same flaws. Take away their ability to score on the rush and slow down their power play, and the Caps really couldn’t grind out victories – particularly with a mediocre penalty kill. The Canadiens exploited these flaws ruthlessly en route to a major first-round upset.
This was the point at which Boudreau more or less lost me. The first two years, I could see that the roster was still filled with some players who probably didn’t belong, and the “core” group was still young. This loss though – in a season where everything could have lined up for the Caps – was just brutal. Especially when another team with an inexperienced core stormed to a Cup victory.
Another off-season brought more roster improvements though. Alzner became a full-time player and was joined by Carlson. Finally, the Caps had some defensemen, other than Green, that could skate and move the puck. The trade of Fleischmann for Hannan reinforced the defense and ended the ludicrous “Flash as #2C” experiment.
Most importantly, however, Boudreau finally admitted that he needed to teach the team to play defense. He realized that he couldn’t let the opposition skate through neutral ice uninhibited. He figured out that he had to demand that his wings help out on defense and block shots, rather than flying the zone. At the time, he was hailed for making the adjustment, but to me it was too little and far too late. There wasn’t a team in the league that didn’t have some type of system designed to slow down the opposition through neutral ice – except for the Caps. There also wasn’t a team in the league that asked so little of its wings defensively – except for the Caps.
The Caps had been weak against trapping teams and heavy forechecking pressure for two years. They likewise had an inability to slow other teams down, which left their D exposed against forwards with a head of steam. Boudreau fixed one of these problems, but only after the prospect of being fired mid-season. The Caps’ roster improvement helped with their ability to handle pressure, but they still had a fundamental problem offensively: the team liked to score on the rush, or on the power play. Take away the rush’n attack (gratuitous NES reference) and stymie their power play and the team was eminently beatable.
Everyone knew this. And yet nothing changed. The Caps beat a massively outgunned Rangers squad before falling to a team that denied them the ability to rush the puck and managed to shut down what was a predictable and stationary power play. It was the Montreal game plan from 2009-2010, just better executed. Bruce received praise for implementing the trap (which is something his team should have had from day one), but he couldn’t teach the team how to play the kind of slow, grinding possession game that wins in the playoffs.
At this point, the issue largely boiled down to a binary choice: either Boudreau wasn’t designing the right game plans, or his players weren’t buying into them. McPhee’s offseason moves suggested that he believed it was the former, rather than the latter. He brought in new players – veteran “character” guys – who would help settle down the room and follow instructions. And yet. . . the team still looked atrocious. Any structure they picked up last year was lost. While they increased the frequency of their cycling, they still tried to score too often off the rush. After the initial novelty of Ovechkin moving from the point wore off, the power play went back to being predictable and mediocre.
Finally, the team just looked lost. Players didn’t seem as though they knew what they were supposed to do or where they were supposed to go. Sometimes they appeared to put forth effort, only to pull in the wrong direction. Combine this with visible rifts in the locker room and the obvious regression of several key players, and it was beyond time for Boudreau to go.
Ultimately, Bruce seemed to be a bit reactive as a coach. He improved the PK, but only after it was shown to be an Achilles’ Heel for several seasons. He eventually installed a trapping system, but only after the team’s offense dried up. He moved Ovie from the point, but only after that power play alignment had become stale and predictable. His “go-to” move was to play shake and bake with the lines in an almost-panicked fashion. (I think the season really took a turn for the worse after he demoted Knuble, benched Perreault, inserted Eakin and broke up Laich-Chimera-Ward.) It’s not surprising that a coach who seemed to scramble everything when the chips were down produced a team of players that panicked and played individualistic hockey whenever their backs were against the wall.
It’s sad, because he seems like a genuinely good person who probably deserved better. I think he’s actually a good coach who will probably take a lot from this experience and parlay it into a much more successful second tenure somewhere (my guess is Colorado). His arrival will forever be linked with the team’s rise to prominence, but it should also forever be linked with the team’s failure to live up to its promise. It’s possible that, over time, other names will come to be linked with that failure, but right now it’s hard to look at what this team failed to accomplish and how it has regressed and not feel that it was long past time for a change.
Unleash the Apathy.
by D'ohboy on Nov 28, 2011 12:20 PM EST reply actions 24 recs
Couldn’t have said it better or more thoroughly.
Also, BB to Colorado? I’d love to see Varlamov’s reaction…
Release the Mackan!
by Killer_Carlson on Nov 28, 2011 1:43 PM EST up reply actions
I don’t think Sacco is long for this world, and the Colorado roster reminds me a bit of the Caps in 2007 – full of promise and in need of some direction.
Unleash the Apathy.
I agree that Sacco is on thin ice. Anderson’s ridiculous season that got the team to the playoffs probably raised expectations a bit too high for Sacco to survive following it up with a couple big down years. I just think it would be funny to see BB coaching Varlamov again after everything that happened in DC and the speculation that BB may have contributed to Varlamov wanting out of DC.
Release the Mackan!
by Killer_Carlson on Nov 28, 2011 1:50 PM EST up reply actions
Ovi keeps "C"?
Stating categorically that Ovi retains the “C” shows just how out of touch GMGM is with the needs of this Caps team, IMHO. That’s not necessarily to say GMGM or Hunter should take the captaincy from Ovi, but at least leave the door open.
I concur with the suggestion that Ovi ought to surrender the captaincy voluntarily, at least in part to acknowledge his accountability for the mess the Caps find themselves in. It’s a “tough row to hoe,” but isn’t a captain supposed to lead and support his team, not sulk when things aren’t going the way he wants?
Considering the entire team chose Ovi unanimously which has been mentioned in this thread numerous times, why would you think the general public knows who should where the C in red better then the guys on the team.
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I disagree with you, almost entirely.
Ask any player on the team whose team it is, and the answer will be Alex’s. Teams rarely strip the captaincy from a player, and when they do it embarrasses and alienates people tremendously. Would you want to alienate and embarrass a player who has a decade left on contract with the organization? I didn’t think so.
Secondly, this topic is stale to me. WE are not in the locker room, or on the ice, or on the bench with this team. WE do not know what Alex does as a captain – and for all we know, he may be the only person keeping this group of guys together right now. Because of all these things we don’t know, I don’t see how you can soundly say that stripping the captaincy from Alex would be the right move, ever.
This is quickly becoming my new least favorite topic being brought up around these parts…
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If you listen to the entire interview he DOES leave the door open. He basically said that Hunter can go behind his back and do anything if it makes the team win.
"Don't mind WM...he's an all-around jerk."
by Whiter Mage on Nov 28, 2011 12:59 PM EST up reply actions
I put the “Ovie should give up his C” meme as equally ignorant as the “We should trade Ovie” meme.
I’m sorry, but it’s not going to happen. Ovie’s captaincy is not to blame for the team’s woes. It could be the old coach, we’ll see. Furthermore, taking the C way from Ovie will have no impact on the team. I can guarantee players aren’t not speaking because Ovie has a letter on his chest.
Even so, this is just not going to happen. It’s not. They won’t embarrass the face of their franchise.
Move on people. Find a new thing to bitch about. Find something remotely plausible.
Nice guys finish first, but sometimes the season is awfully long.
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What?
Is this an article, or a pat on the back for alleged clairvoyance? Everyone knew he was on borrowed time ever since we lost to Montreal. For those who didn’t make that realization, the time period encapsulating the 24/7 series made it very clear that he was dangerously close to the axe… a year ago. The only thing worth discussing is how, despite all odds, we’re having this conversation so long from those time periods. Besides, there’s plenty of substance to not warrant quoting previous material.
I’m more concerned with how the Rink is emotionally is reacting to this news. We tend to be overly pragmatic and while supportive of the change, there’s got to be a lot of mixed emotions thrown in there… doesn’t there?
"Baseball was my first love... hockey is a sultry temptress and stole my heart." - Corey Masisak
We don’t do that here.
"My favorite fan base in D.C. Is United's. Period. The end." - Steinberg
Keep United in DC. A Fair Deal at RFK, and a Pathway to a Stadium for a team loyal to the city.
by Bald Pollack on Nov 28, 2011 7:26 PM EST up reply actions
Did anyone just catch Allen May on NHL Live? He told Millbury that he would love to bring Dale Hunter with him to the studio to kick Millbury and Jonesy’s asses and May wouldn’t have to throw a punch. Awesome.
by JMurphyCSC on Nov 28, 2011 7:30 PM EST via iPhone app reply actions
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