2009-10 Rink Wrap: Alexander Semin
by J.P. on Jun 4, 2010 11:00 AM EDT
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PrintFrom Alzner to Varlamov, we're taking a look at and grading (please read the criteria below) the 2009-10 season for every player who laced 'em up for the Caps for a significant number of games during the campaign, with an eye towards 2010-11. Next up, Alexander Semin.
Alexander Semin
#28 / Left Wing / Washington Capitals
6-2
205
Mar 03, 1984
5
$6,000,000 cap hit in 2010-11; UFA after 2010-11 season
7.46 rating
6.51 rating
Key Stats: Semin finished fifth in the NHL in goals-per-game during the regular season, but failed to light the lamp even once in the post-season (despite still being in the top-20 in the League in playoff shots on goal).
Interesting Stat: Semin has the best regular season plus-minus (+61) among NHL forwards over the past two seasons.
The Good: Semin put up some awfully pretty impressive numbers in the regular season, including top-ten finishes in goals, goals created, plus-minus, even-strength goals, points per game, goals created per game, multi-goal- and multi-point games, all while getting less power-play time per game than 79 other NHLers and missing nine games. His first career 40-goal season leaves him with the sixth-best goals-per-game in the League, post-lockout, and he's one of just a dozen players with at least 26 goals in each of the past four seasons. Semin scored more points-per-minute over the course of the season than Nicklas Backstrom (despite getting a quarter-of-a-minute less power-play time per game and playing with inferior linemates at five-aside), and had the fifth-best points-per-sixty at five-on-five in the League. Interestingly, Semin skated more often with Backstrom and Alex Ovechkin than he did with Brooks Laich and Tomas Fleischmann (his second-most frequent linemates), but scored more at even-strength with the less-talented duo. Regardless of the with whom he was playing, Semin found a bit more consistency in 2009-10 than he had shown in the past, only once going more than two games without a point and rarely going into prolonged goal-scoring droughts (he only failed to light the lamp in four-straight games three times, and never went more than a half-dozen games without a goal)... during the regular season.
But it wasn't all offense for Semin, who was a fantastic penalty-killer in limited ice time (to the surprise of no one). Impressively, he was only on the ice for three 5-on-4 power-play goals against all season long in more than 71 minutes of SH TOI. Even more impressively, Semin was on the ice for three 4-on-5 goals for (he led the team with two shorthanded goals), meaning that in more than three-and-a-half total periods of short-handed hockey played, Alex Semin's Caps scored as many goals as they surrendered. And while we'll deservedly bemoan his discipline below, it's worth noting that only 12% of his penalty minutes came after the second intermission, which is a bit mitigating, and that he drew more penalties and at a better rate than any other player on the team (with the exception of Mathieu Perreault in that latter grouping), which is hugely mitigating.
The Bad: The playoffs. On the one hand, the odds of a 14.3% career shooter going 0-for-44 are just over 0.1%. On the other hand, he was 0-for-15 in his prior seven-game series (and right at that 14.5% career number in his post-season career previously). So is it a fluke that he's gone 64 playoff shots without a goal (0.005% likely), or is there more to it? Obviously it's a bit of both. Despite the fact that Semin's average five-on-five shot distance in the playoffs was actually lower than during the regular season (i.e. he was shooting from closer in, and yes, those stats are notoriously shaky), his unwillingness to take a hit to make a play became an ever-growing source of frustration to Caps fans (check out this bail-out, for example, and that was probably the closest Semin was to the net all series). It's impossible to place the blame for the series loss on one player, but if Semin had produced in the playoffs at anywhere close to the rate he did during the regular season, the Caps would have advanced. He didn't and they didn't.
Semin's regular season featured some trouble spots as well. While he did set new career highs for goals and points, his per-game goal and assist totals were actually down from 2008-09, and it was very much feast-or-famine for Sasha - he totaled 64 points in 27 multi-point games and just 8 goals and 20 points in 46 other games, being held of the scoresheet entirely 26 times (or in 36% of his games). Semin's discipline continued to be a problem, as he took the most minor penalties on the team in terms of raw number (including the most stick, restraining and hooking, holding and tripping penalties on the team as well as the most offensive-zone infractions) and rate at five-on-five (yes, even more than John Erskine), and no forward had a lower hit-per-minute rate than Semin (yes, even less than Flash). But really, you accept all of this because of the production... as long as that production is there.
The Vote: Rate Semin below on a scale of 1-10 (10 being the best) based on his performance relative to his potential and your expectations for the season - if he had the best year you could have imagined him having, give him a 10; if he more or less played as you expected he would, give him a 5 or a 6; if he had the worst year you could have imagined him having, give him a 1.
The Discussion: Should Semin be in the Caps' long-term plans or should the team pursue trading him prior to next season's trade deadline? What will it take for him to earn a 10 rating next year?
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"Rate Semin below on a scale of 1-10 (10 being the best) based on his performance relative to his potential and your expectations for the season – if he had the best year you could have imagined him having, give him a 10; if he more or less played as you expected he would, give him a 5 or a 6; if he had the worst year you could have imagined him having, give him a 1."
They're coming.
by Bald Pollack on Jun 4, 2010 11:08 AM EDT reply actions 5 recs
First “trade him now!!!!!” comment coming in 5….4….3…2….
I never travel far....without a little Big Star...
Ron and Fez 11 to 3
by YvonLabresMoustache on Jun 4, 2010 11:12 AM EDT reply actions
I’m setting the over/under for a personal bias comment around post 43.
They're coming.
by Bald Pollack on Jun 4, 2010 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions
DC is a bad sports town
Or: why I can’t accurately rate Alex Semin
What? You say. How do those two statements have anything to do with one another? I’m glad you asked.
A couple weeks back, our esteemed leader said (paraphrased) "Some Caps fans would rather have the team be entertaining that actually win." I’ll admit, I’m new to hockey and the Caps, but as a life-long fan of DC sports, I think this is both a legitimate statement when applied to the Capitals, and one that applies across the spectrum of Washington athletic competitions.
I have this whole thing on how people who live in the DC area are all Type A overachievers who need to win. I am one of these people. And yet, when it comes to sports, this market seems to be way more forgiving than most in terms on winning. Chris Cooley is acceptable at football, but people love that guy. I think it’s because he’s a ridiculous, social media-savvy, hilarious lunatic willing to make an ass of himself to be entertaining. Gilbert Arenas, bum knee and all, didn’t attract hatred or real anger until he made a laughingstock of his organization and his city. When he was sucking but at least being hilarious, he seemed to get a pass. I’m thoroughly convinced that the Nationals’ greatest sin was not two 100 loss seasons, but failing to be at least a little amusing.
Even here (and this is so not a dig at anyone, just anecdotal evidence), there’s a Team Tyler. Is this guy legit NHL material? Probably not. But he’s a good guy, works hard, etc. It’s all about the intangibles, right?
But can you picture Arsenal fans lobbying to keep around a guy who usually can’t pull his own weight, just because he’s a good story?
My (unnecessarily long and belabored) point is that we look at factors other than pure statistics. We look at entertainment value, character, the dreaded "makeup", and our own personal preferences.
But what the hell does any of that have to do with Semin?
Sasha is my sacred cow. The man is alternately brilliant and terrible, the most talented player in the league and a hockey idiot. As Churchill once said about Sasha’s native land, he is "a riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma."
But, God bless, there are few players I find more entertaining. I love watching him. Sure, sometimes he’s beyond infuriating, but there was a game early in the season where he sat in the penalty box and licked the glass. What? Who DOES that? I chuckled.
I can’t even give the guy a number, because intellectually I realize that he ahem underperformed when it mattered most, but emotionally I’m all "But look at all the hilarious things he did!"
I’m certainly not trying to sway anyone’s opinions of our little Siberian Snowflake. It’s just my reasoning of why I want Semin to stay on the team, and I know others (many? most?) will disagree with me. That’s cool. I get it. Maybe it makes me a bad fan that I want my team to be entertaining; I get that, too, but there it is. I wouldn’t say that I’d rather have them be funny than win—I’m greedy. I want both.
Alex Semin is a crazy fucking head-case. But dammit, he’s our crazy fucking head-case.
If wishes were horses, we'd all be eating steak.
by Hang a Laingtern on Your Problems on Jun 4, 2010 11:13 AM EDT reply actions 24 recs
I give this post a 10, based on the number of times it made be laugh.
#savethekittens!
Donation info for SAVES FOR KIDS 2010!! Make a difference.
This is fantastic.
On the Forecheck: preaching the Predators' gospel to the unwashed masses.
Twitter/Cycle Like the Sedins
Somewhat humorous (but not really) that he’s getting all those 10’s. Presumably they’re all coming from the Semin Lobby, which apparently is failing to realize that by giving him a 10, one is essentially saying that one expected him to be an absolutely awful player and he surprised one by being good. It also says that said didn’t see the playoffs.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
by J.P. on Jun 4, 2010 11:14 AM EDT reply actions 6 recs
I was just thinking I’d be curious to hear what someone who voted ‘10’ expected out of Semin this year.
Particularly when in principle, he “could even do more.”
They're coming.
by Bald Pollack on Jun 4, 2010 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Just remember that was a translation and there was considerable discussion about what he really meant, IIRC, including that he feels he can keep it up and continue pushing to be better (what if he had said he could do no more, ie. not get better? How would you criticize him then?). I don’t think it means he’s just idly sitting around with a drink in one hand and a cig in the other saying, “Yeah, I guess I could play a little harder.” Then shrugs.
Understood, and know that I was tossing that out there as three-quarters snark. That said, it’s funny how the expectations of him are basically unchanged from last year to this (stay healthy, 40-40-80, etc.)
They're coming.
by Bald Pollack on Jun 4, 2010 11:59 AM EDT up reply actions
Yes, I was rereading that yesterday. Much the same conversation, but much more disappointment this year, along with an unhealthy dose of bitterness.
Didnt give him a 10, but he blew away my expectations in the “taking dumb stick penalties” category….
#NeedsMoreBradley
As far as i can remember he took less stick penalties this year then last… 66 to 77 PIMs
I’m too lazy to look up his individual penalties but in general I was very happy with his reduction in total penalties.. Sasha will always take stupid penalties and that is something I’ve come to grips with.
That being said his general play, stats and PK awesomeness really impressed me this year.
I gave him a 7, I didn’t expect his PIMs to go down and I was still on the fence to his PKing, though I accepted he generally played better over all while getting time on the PK.
yes his stick penalties suck, but they’re getting better and he really does bring a lot more to the table then I would like to admit!
It also says that said didn’t see the playoffs.
Yeah, but most of the blame for his playoff performance is on his linemates! I mean, did you see how many shots he had!?
"Do not be afraid to ask for credit, for our way of refusing is very polite."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jun 4, 2010 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions
He was performing, just not producing?
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
A lot of people agree with the idea that if you were to replay his shots from the playoffs you’d have seen a much different result, yet the notion that him scoring no goals equates to him not showing up for the series seems to be party line here, and I can’t figure out why.
by Bushwood Bushwhacker on Jun 4, 2010 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions
the notion that him scoring no goals equates to him not showing up for the series seems to be party line here
Not really. In fact, I think I pretty much detailed how astronomical the odds of him taking as many shots and not scoring was and how it’s much more fluky than an indication of his effort. However, what was more of an indication of effort were the fly-bys (as noted), plays against the boards, etc.
Alex Semin isn’t criticized solely for not scoring goals in the playoffs, but when you’re a goal-scorer and you don’t score, a good amount of criticism is both warranted and fair.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
by J.P. on Jun 4, 2010 11:26 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I think that’s an oversimplification. People aren’t just going “Zero goals! He failed epically!” They’re seeing that he seemed to be pressing, took bad shots, wasn’t as strong as he should have been around the net, etc.
by David Getz on Jun 4, 2010 11:28 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
It seems that in today’s NHL, the best penaly killing teams are the ones that block the most shots.
I’d say it’s mostly because you’re ignoring half the argument. Probably start there to figure out why. Have you happened to notice the criticism about him not taking a hit? Or taking a terrible penalty ten minutes into game 6 that totally turned the momentum of that game? Or checking out and looking pretty disinterested in game 7 after he hit the post (in the first period)? Or the fact that despite his shot total he went long periods of time without really doing anything or making an impact on the game? The thing about Semin is that he can disappear for 40+ minutes and still come out with decent looking numbers because his talent allows him to get a full games’ worth of numbers in 20 minutes or fewer.
I waited all year for this?
by Rob Parker on Jun 4, 2010 11:28 AM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
*
Somehow blockquoted the wrong quote. Should have blocked:
yet the notion that him scoring no goals equates to him not showing up for the series seems to be party line here, and I can’t figure out why.
I waited all year for this?
I have to disagree with this post. I would not say that most of the blame is on his linemates. Montreal’s system was to play with 6 goalies and keep the Caps to the outside. The Habs were very comfortable with guys shooting from the outside because they would either be easy saves or blocked. Semin (and the other caps) played right into the Habs game plan. He mainly had so many shots because he was unwilling to get dirty and took the easy way out by shooting from a far. I gave him a 5…a 9 for the regular season and a -4 for the playoffs.
by CapsFanSince1979 on Jun 4, 2010 6:03 PM EDT up reply actions
I split up the grading in half, five for regular season, five for playoffs.
Regular Season: Five
Playoffs: Two
Total: Eight, because I’m a tard and clicked on the wrong number before voting.
by CaptainAwesome on Jun 4, 2010 10:13 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
For what it’s worth, I gave him a 4 – a bit better than expected in the regular season (and I had admittedly high expectations for him – I think the world of his talent), but knocked down to 4 for the playoffs.
Any of the 10’s want to justify their rating?
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
Exactly my thoughts and rating as well. Healthy for most of the season he should be a 40-50 goals scorer.
If I’d known about the 2C troubles I might have bumped him up to a 5 or even 6. I thought that wouldn’t be an issue and hence we’d see more of the same. But pre-season I hadn’t thought much about that and probably unrealistically expected a bit of improvement over last season.
Cидни Kросби: Александр Oвечкин, он твой папа теперь
Red Line Station: for Capitals fans who can bear reading something less intelligent than a story at Japers' Rink
(note name change)
by red army line on Jun 4, 2010 1:48 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m not justifying a 10, I gave him a 5 — one of few Caps about whom I would say he is exactly who I thought he was. Consistently inconsistent!
by CapitalCentre on Jun 4, 2010 2:38 PM EDT up reply actions
6
The problem is, I expect greatness from Sasha.
Would we be so harsh on him if he was making $4.5-5mil per year? Probably not, but the reality is he is paid elite player dollars and we expect him to step it up a notch when needed. We saw spouts of this sprinkled through the regular season, where he would seemingly take over, dance around the offensive zone, and bomb away at opposing goalies, but this all disappeared come playoff time.
I can’t seem to think of him as a pure winger, and this might be a little hockey ignorance, but he seems to excel when he is creating, ala playmaking center. Would the much needed 2C have that much impact on our snowflake? I, unfortunately, don’t think so.
Love the guy and the amount of skill he brings to the table and am happy I am not the one who has to deal with figuring out whether he stays longer.
If you want to survive out here, you've got to know where your towel is.
Would we be so harsh on him if he was making $4.5-5mil per year?
Well, that’s exactly what he was making this past season – the one we’re grading.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
by J.P. on Jun 4, 2010 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
brain fart.
If you want to survive out here, you've got to know where your towel is.
by ns on Jun 4, 2010 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions
The one thing upon which we can probably all agree: there is no more polarizing player on this team than Alexander Semin.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
by J.P. on Jun 4, 2010 11:17 AM EDT reply actions 3 recs
Polarizing in terms of play or fan base perception, because I see an argument for Jeff Schultz.
"Don't mind WM...he's an all-around jerk."
Fitting that their wraps are back-to-back.
"Do not be afraid to ask for credit, for our way of refusing is very polite."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jun 4, 2010 12:02 PM EDT up reply actions
I mean divergence of opinions among the fanbase. And yeah, Double-Nick is right there, though less so this year (or so I thought prior to yesterday).
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
well, yesterday seemed to be to be freakinandpeakin against the world…not an entire anti-schultz lobby.
Ahh but at CI and some message boards there is still a strong anti-Schultz lobby. Also of McPhee. The lobbies are smaller than those from past years but it’s still ranting.
That was a lively discussion yesterday. Made for some interesting reading.
"I’m very happy to hear the news," Ovechkin said when he heard about Backstrom's longterm contract--"because he’s one of the top centers in the world, one of my best friends and we want to play together for a long time. He’s a guy who wants to stay in one place and be comfortable and win, just like me. We talk all the time about playing together, and we talked after the playoffs about how we can win in Washington."
by capsyoungguns on Jun 4, 2010 5:20 PM EDT up reply actions
I can’t stand McPhee haters, or at least the ones I’ve come across. In my experience it’s just complaining without offering any solution. It’s just, “God, McPhee sucks, he should have picked up a legitimate second line center!” Yeah, McPhee knows that, and I’m sure he’d have liked to. But unless you can point to a guy who would likely be available for a reasonable price and could fit under the cap, it’s not really fair.
There’s also a lot of “trade Schultz and Fleischmann for Dubinsky and Staal!” going on. Apparently one of McPhee’s major failings is that he doesn’t force other GMs into making idiotic decisions.
As soon as I see “McPhail” I know what to expect from the poster. Most likely just blow the team up. Or Shero is better. Or, or, or….! The few times I’ve engaged I usually say something along the lines of “it takes two to tango” or “well, what trades out there that happened did you want McPhee to have made.” I read a lot of bluster about why we didn’t get certain rumored trades, Hammuis for example, and then I feel compelled to point out that the player in question didn’t actually get traded, so therefore the price was too high for more GMs then McPhee. I have since learned my lesson. I no longer engage. Too much ranting, not enough discussion.
"I’m very happy to hear the news," Ovechkin said when he heard about Backstrom's longterm contract--"because he’s one of the top centers in the world, one of my best friends and we want to play together for a long time. He’s a guy who wants to stay in one place and be comfortable and win, just like me. We talk all the time about playing together, and we talked after the playoffs about how we can win in Washington."
by capsyoungguns on Jun 5, 2010 3:07 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, but there’s a big difference in that. One is a guy who’s still finding his game, the other’s a guy who almost scored 40 goals in year two and (save for an overhaul of his two way game) is, well, trending himself. If Sarge came out in year 2 with a +50 and struggled to get back to that, then I could understand the hate.
They're coming.
were any more words devoted to any other player in a wrap so far?
If you've read this far...seek help.
I wrote a lot on Ovechkin. I’d have to do a word count. Maybe I can borrow OFB’s intern to do that grunt work.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
I’m pretty sure they are too busy coming up with great blockbuster trades like “Semin for a #1D man” at the trading deadline next year.
Choking since 1985.
Get this mental picture of the O Henry story where the wife sells her hair for a chain for hubby’s watch, and he sells his watch for a comb for her hair.
We trade Semin for a great 2C, who in turn no longer has a 40-goal wing to dish to…
Oh, Sasha.
/goes back to working on moonbeam-hand containment systems
This is like if O Henry! and Allanis Morissette had a baby and named it this exact moment!
I'm gonna pain you dearly Woodhouse, when I peel all your skin off with a flensing knife, sew it into Woodhouse pajamas, and then set those pajamas on fire.
by Steckel Me Elmo on Jun 4, 2010 1:57 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I was waffling between 5 and 6. I ended up going with 6, perhaps a little too high. I didn’t expect him to hit 40 goals, and his PK was better than I could have expected/hoped for. His improved discipline (however small) was also a plus. So he gets pluses for all of those … in the regular season. His score is brought back down to about average for the disappearing act in the playoffs. While I can’t say I was surprised, I was hoping and expecting a better outing from him, for some odd reason.
I'm gonna pain you dearly Woodhouse, when I peel all your skin off with a flensing knife, sew it into Woodhouse pajamas, and then set those pajamas on fire.
by Steckel Me Elmo on Jun 4, 2010 11:18 AM EDT reply actions
7
Really wanted to go with an 8 but just couldn’t. I’ve knocked everyone else for the playoff disappearing act, so Semin has to also. The only “mitigating” factor with Semin’s playoff disappearing act (in terms of this exercise) is that I almost expected it (I definitely feared it) so I almost felt like I shouldn’t take off a point. But I didn’t expect 0 goals, and that’s not acceptable, so he goes to 7.
He was definitely more healthy and consistent this year (even given that he was still inconsistent) than I expected. His totals were higher than I thought he’d be able to put together. I was a little surprised that his rate scoring went down, but that isn’t a total surprise when he played more games than previously.
I started the 85 Cent club, and I’m not backing down. Unfortunately, I don’t think we have any chance of getting 85 cents for Semin, so I’d say just keep him. Before the 2010 playoffs I told J.P. we may as well keep Semin for the 2010 and 2011 playoffs and then let him go. If he’s hot for one playoff year, we win the Cup. Obviously he wasn’t hot for the 2010 playoffs, but he could be for 2011. He proved that he’s not flipping the switch consciously, but that doesn’t mean he can’t coincidentally get hot in the spring again. Unless we have a gaping hole, I don’t see a reason to trade Semin at the deadline. If we do, it had better be for a real impact player. He’s too expensive, unreliable, and redundant to be in this team’s long term plans.
A 10 is a 50 goal, 100 point season. I don’t think he’ll ever cure the inconsistency, but if he can close that gap between points in multi-goal games compared to other games it would help a lot.
I waited all year for this?
by Rob Parker on Jun 4, 2010 11:19 AM EDT reply actions 3 recs
I gave him your 8. I am actually surprised you gave him as high as a 7. All I figured is his ratings would be all over the map, inconsistent, and they are. I guess for most Caps fans, the issue in a nutshell. But, I agree 100% with Lantern. Winning would be great, the best, terrific, but I also want to watch entertaining hockey for 82 games, not boring hockey. It was the entertaining part that got me to tune in after years of resisting my boys’ entreaties. Specifically, it was watching Sasha on TV while my family went to the games because, frankly, I hate the crowds, the rudeness of some fans, and the bad language in what should be a family atmosphere. I told my sons 3 years ago that Sasha had more talent than Ovi and was the best one to watch. That’s why I like him, why I want him to stay here. You all can quibble over what he’s paid. Ultimately, GMGM will have to decide that and what’s best for the team. I still hope he decides, and Sasha agrees, that staying here for some mutually agreeable amount is best for all. In the meantime, I will soak up his talent and intriguing personality. I’m not responsible for him, so I can enjoy it!
Anyone that has followed my rants on the trap knows I want entertaining hockey. I guess it just comes down to “what is entertaining hockey?” I love the skill that he can provide, but I don’t always think he’s entertaining. I don’t like seeing guys float, I don’t like seeing guys bail out, I don’t like turnovers at the blueline. When we talk entertaining hockey, give me Dustin Brown over Alex Semin. And ultimately, entertaining means nothing if you don’t win a Cup.
I am actually surprised you gave him as high as a 7.
Makes sense. The Semin Lobby has never been very good at understanding my position on Sasha.
I waited all year for this?
by Rob Parker on Jun 4, 2010 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
You can stop with the Semin Lobby BS. I could just as easily call you the Anti-Semin Lobby, but I prefer not to pidgeon-hole people. You probably don’t care, but I do try to respect your views. I disagree that entertaining means nothing without a cup. That would mean all of the years of watching the Caps has meant nothing, as would be said for most other NHL teams. So all of that time wasted meant nothing? No, there was entertainment value. A cup certainly is the goal, but the journey (year after year) is part of it and is worth something.
I don’t think they’re talking about you – there’s a large pro-Semin lobby that basically just talks about how awesome he is without bringing forward any discussion or factual statistical stuff. He (and most of us) want to know from the “Semin lobby” their thoughts and why.
Signed, a member of the Erskine and Flash lobbies.
"Don't mind WM...he's an all-around jerk."
I could just as easily call you the Anti-Semin Lobby, but I prefer not to pidgeon-hole people.
Go ahead and call me the Anti-Semin Lobby. I don’t care. And no, you may not want to pidgeon-hole [sic] people, but you’ll freely critique their parents without knowing anything about them.
The years of watching the Caps don’t mean “nothing.” But they are failures and it doesn’t really matter if the team was exciting or not. I’d rather not look back after 20 years and think about a team that scored 7000 goals and never won a Cup.
I waited all year for this?
You hold a grudge for a long time? I am a parent of 3 boys and see a lot of what I think is rude behavior and language, whether that falls back on parents and parenting (me sometimes), or peers or personality, is debatable. But, get over it already.
Weird, the first time you interact with me you criticize my parents (who, by the way, are the fucking bomb) and I take it personally. I’m sure your boys do some stuff you wouldn’t condone when you are not around. I may use foul language and be rude sometimes, but it’s the internet. Get over it already.
You hold a grudge for a long time?
No doubt, and I don’t turn it over with a lame ass curl and drag at the blueline either.
I waited all year for this?
by Rob Parker on Jun 4, 2010 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions 11 recs
Rec’d hard for:
Weird, the first time you interact with me you criticize my parents (who, by the way, are the fucking bomb) and I take it personally.
And
No doubt, and I don’t turn it over with a lame ass curl and drag at the blueline either.
But especially the first quote.
I'm gonna pain you dearly Woodhouse, when I peel all your skin off with a flensing knife, sew it into Woodhouse pajamas, and then set those pajamas on fire.
by Steckel Me Elmo on Jun 4, 2010 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Hi I swear a lot. Words are words, and the JR community has always been nearly entirely adults. If you want your kids to read it, ask me to not swear or something, or suggest to the admins that the language needs to be toned down.
But to suggest that rude language is on my parents is some garbage. My parents don’t swear at all, and I don’t swear around them. It’s about situation. Here, I feel comfortable using language that isn’t considered inappropriate just because it’s Anglo-Saxon words instead of Latin, which is the origin of swear words anyway(or so I was taught in English 101). “Fuck” was just the Saxon word for “fornicate,” “Shit” was “Deficate,”. But the Roman Empire pushed it’s way up to some wall near Scotland or something and then said ’Nah, dawgs, those words are bad. Use ours.
You want your kids to not swear and not to expose them to the language? It’s on you, not everyone else. Keep them above the comment page, or ask us to stop swearing. We’re not going to stop just because some kids might stumble on it.
"Don't mind WM...he's an all-around jerk."
by Whiter Mage on Jun 4, 2010 12:15 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
For heaven’s sake, there’s no need to reopen this. I was simply responding to F&B’s grudge. What is all of this defensiveness about the right to swear? I don’t prefer it in every day discourse, but I have certainly used it in anger. That’s my preference, but I have not brought it since that initial time. This really had nothing to do with the kids reading it. The only who does is 19, so no issue.
Moving to OTOT.
"Don't mind WM...he's an all-around jerk."
by Whiter Mage on Jun 4, 2010 12:28 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
If you have been saying for years that Semin is more talented than Ovechkin, how are you so pleasantly surprised at Semin’s season that you gave him an 8? The voting is supposed to be based on expectations, not overall results.
Of all our iniquities ignorance may be the worst
by Killer_Carlson on Jun 4, 2010 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
ah, thank you for showing up. I was wondering where you were. The tag team is complete!
BTW, I said he had more talent, not that he was the better player, and there’s a difference and that affects expectations.
And I was wondering when you’d start playing the poor victim card.
So what were you expecting from Semin? You’ve always defended him against criticisms of inconsistency and poor work ethic, and you’ve always talked about how he can take over games. So what was it that he did that blew away your expectations? He was dominant at times, horrible at times, and injured at times. Have we come to expect anything different?
Of all our iniquities ignorance may be the worst
by Killer_Carlson on Jun 4, 2010 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions 5 recs
Semin Lobyist voting: 3
The entire argument I have had for being a Semin lobbyist was that he is better than people give him credit for and that “he is a monster in the playoffs”. FAIL.
I was expecting around 45 goals, better discipline, continued growth in his emotional maturity, continued growth in his hockey maturity / sense, and incredibly valuable contributions to a long Cup run. That’s a fail on almost all account, thus I have no choice but to give him a 3. Yes, my expectations may have been much too high, but that’s what they were, and thus, that’s my grade.
I have resigned from the Semin Lobby (I still enjoy him as a player but cannot be a proponent of his anymore) and can only hope he turns that corner.
My expectations for next year a MUCH lower, and I’d give him a 9 if he hits my expectation from last year, a 10 would mean a significant role in bringing the Cup to DC.
If anyone knows who to send a resume to for the Carlson Lobby, I’d appreciate it.
Great. Now I have to change my name to "Jaromir meet Alex".
by Chris meet Alex on Jun 7, 2010 11:21 AM EDT up reply actions
Sasha.
Criminally under appreciated, over critiqued, and misunderstood.
Poor Sasha.
by Bushwood Bushwhacker on Jun 4, 2010 11:20 AM EDT reply actions
Disagree, disagree, agree
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
by J.P. on Jun 4, 2010 11:21 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I don’t see him as under-appreciated. Read “The Good” above – seems pretty borderline-deifying to me.
Over-critiqued? I think it’s fair to analyze a guy making that much money (or any player, for that matter), and it’s really the whole point of blogging.
Misunderstood? Agreed – no one knows how to reach the dude, it would seem, from the coach on down.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
by J.P. on Jun 4, 2010 11:28 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Here at least we hit it more or less correctly, I think. Its from the guy who got into hockey yesterday and doesn’t really care all that much about hockey—just about watching a winner—that would underappreciate and overcritique him, I think.
Cидни Kросби: Александр Oвечкин, он твой папа теперь
Red Line Station: for Capitals fans who can bear reading something less intelligent than a story at Japers' Rink
(note name change)
by red army line on Jun 4, 2010 2:32 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t know – someone who doesn’t really care all that much about hockey might see the goals and highlights and over-appreciate and under-critique Semin.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
Definitely. Just using my dad as an example, he sees the games and notices how Semin has the propensity for a bad penalty like an HHT, which in itself nullifies any good. Sort of like Schultz playing 45 minutes of solid invisible defense and then getting beaten by Dubinsky and people are like OHMIGODHESUX!!!1
Cидни Kросби: Александр Oвечкин, он твой папа теперь
Red Line Station: for Capitals fans who can bear reading something less intelligent than a story at Japers' Rink
(note name change)
by red army line on Jun 4, 2010 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions
True. I meant more that he is under appreciated around the league and even by his own fans, and since you do appreciate his skill set you might be more inclined to think he was.
by Bushwood Bushwhacker on Jun 4, 2010 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions
6
Pretty much as expected, really. An injury-shortened season, amazing point production (but noticeably streaky, as Semin tends to be), etc. Same old, same old.
There were things that I thought were better this year than in the past, particularly as the season went on; for example, his ability to draw penalties – and that’s with a lot of refs "ignoring" calls because of his rep for diving – shows just what kind of skill he has and just how effective it can be at frustrating other teams. And while JP mentions that fly-by in the playoffs, for the most part I didn’t get the sense that he was just floating through games in the playoffs; to me it seemed more like a really badly timed slump combined with a Habs team able to take away his shot. But whatever the reason, the fact that he didn’t – or couldn’t – contribute in the postseason keeps the rating at 6.
Would love to see BB use him on the penalty kill more next year because as we’ve seen (and discussed), PK time seems to bring out a more focused Sasha that lasts all game. Plus, you know, he’s good at it and the Caps are…what’s the word? Not? Right. And for a 10 I’d like to see him inch closer to the 50-goal mark, find more consistency to his game, stop with the lazy penalties and show up in the playoffs.
I voted 6. Overperformed on the PK and in terms of sheer point totals and goal scoring totals, but also underperformed in the playoffs. I expected the utter lack of discipline.
To get a 10 next year would involve doing one of three things:
a) putting up 50 goals and 100+ points in a full 82 games;
b) taking 10 or fewer minor penalties in 60+ games, along with putting up a point per game, and being nominated for the Lady Byng;
c) Conn-Smythe Trophy.
"Ovechkin, what is good in life?"
"To crush your enemies. To see them driven before you. And to hear the lamentations of their captain."
I think if he’s being more consistent, we’ll see some serious Selke consideration, but Byng I can’t buy. Too reputation based, you know?
Cидни Kросби: Александр Oвечкин, он твой папа теперь
Red Line Station: for Capitals fans who can bear reading something less intelligent than a story at Japers' Rink
(note name change)
by red army line on Jun 4, 2010 2:33 PM EDT up reply actions
What will it take for him to earn a 10 rating next year?
It’s really kind of mind-blowing to think about what could happen if Sasha reached the upper limit of his potential and had everything break right for him in a season. What would that be? 60 goals, 60 assists, the team’s best penalty killer, good defensive numbers, the Hart, and the Pearson Lindsay?
60/120 would be reachable if he had full line minutes and was healthy. Add in he has the potential to be an elete player in his own end, and a top PK’er in the league, what isn’t within reach. It’s frighning. It really is.
Yep. Basically a ‘10’ for me from Semin would be a season where, at the end of it, everyone goes “You know, there’s really no debate: Alexander Semin was the best player in the NHL this year”.
Right, which is really scary. I said 50/100 but even that is setting the bar low. How many guys in the NHL have more skill than Semin? I bet it’s less than 5.
I waited all year for this?
Depends on your definition of skill. By mine, a lot. Semin has a really quick, nasty shot, but as we learned against Montreal, that doesn’t always get it done.
He’s an interesting player, but I tire of the “Semin is so dripping with skill” meme. So were guys like Alexei Kovalev. To wish a guy who was so skilled was a better hockey player is to wish Quintin Lang skill. Nice sentiment but sometimes it’s just not reality.
Choking since 1985.
60/120 would be reachable if he had full line minutes and was healthy.
and this is one of the things that drives me crazy about the man. He’s the Caps’ best RW. But when you pair him with the best LW in hockey history and the 5th best center in the league, he makes that line less than the sum of its parts.
60/120 is what he should be doing on the SOB. Instead, he makes it the Care Bears.
Atta dinnin stick a who!
by Gould Old Days on Jun 5, 2010 1:42 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t know that the Care Bears are less than the sum of their parts – they put up dominating numbers when they were together in the earlier part of the season both in terms of shot/possession metrics and scoring. They didn’t do it in every game, but I don’t know any line that does.
The real problem with that line is when they weren’t scoring, no one else was either. The 21/9/22 line was a mess, the third line wasn’t clicking and the fourth line is the fourth line for a reason – much as we all love Brads, Stecks and Gordo, they’re never going to be offensive threats on a consistent basis.
Outside of Mike Green, the SOB line is the group with all the dangerous skill. Flash comes and goes, but aside from them, where is the offensive threat coming from? Grinders are good and necessary, but aren’t all that effective without some skill to compliment them. With the real offensive threats on one line and Green often on the ice with them, the other three lines are going to do a lot of treading water, neither generating chances with regularity, nor allowing them.
Only YOU can prevent idiots from commenting!
by Knee high to a duck on Jun 5, 2010 2:18 PM EDT up reply actions
I wouldn’t necessarily call the 21/9/22 a mess but.they aren’t necessarily the skill sets you’d want to put together.
If memory serves me correctly, we started off with OBS and 21/9/22 and both lines started off well. (But we had Flash and Fehr would so essentially got no scoring outside of the top 2 lines.) But then the 2nd line tailed off so only the first one could do anything and when they slumped…..
Rocking the Red since 1975
about a 4.5
Slightly exceeded my expectations in the regular season, greatly underachieved in the playoffs (again).
I truly believe this team has proven it can lose with Alex Semin, and I’d like to see what else we could do with that $6M salary and explore other options. Preferably before next season.
Choking since 1985.
7
I went 7.
He improved on the same old same old, while basically keeping his per game production while playing more time with lesser teammates.
Also helping his number go up to a 7 was:
For only the second time he missed single digit games.
He was one of the few forwards who showed up on the PK.
Hurt:
Playoffs (a point deduction) though I’ve not let a single 7 game series cost anyone more then a point.
To get a 10 from me he’s got to play 75 games go 50/100, and have steady production in the playoffs, and do it primarily on the 2nd line.
4
I expected he would have a strong playoff season this year and would directly help the Caps move far into the playoffs.
And my subjective impression was that he seemed at least as unreachable in the regular season as in previous years – team play, playing til the whistle, focus, etc – and I had expected some growth/maturity.
If I adjust my expectations to be more realistic for next year can we lower his salary too?
I believe that Semin should be and is in the plans for next season and beyond provided there is a reasonable chance of resigning him. Unlike others, I believe losing Semin would be a huge loss, you don’t replace someone with his talent and production. He is the key to having a line other than the Ovechkin line being a threat to score. What we need is a center that thinks the game the way Semin does and can develop chemistry with him. I admit it may be difficult to find such a center, however, I would like to see Perault and Marcus Johannson given the opportunity. As for his failure to produce in the playoffs this season, that was disappointing but it was not because of lack of effort or that he disappears in “big” games. In fact, overall his playoff statistics for his career are quite good and he has had some very good games in what I consider “big” regular season games. Maybe I don’t understand the rating system but I gave him a 9.
Proud to be a Caps fan. Its a Great Day for Hockey.
He is arguably the most productive second line forward in the NHL… in the regular season.
He is arguably among the top five wingers in the game… in pure skill
He has demonstrated himself to be an elite goal scorer and well rounded player… when he’s in the lineup.
If you could get 75 games out of this guy and 80 percent of his regular season production in the playoffs, he’d be an $8 million a year player.
He also would not be a Cap after this year, but then again, I think that’s going to be the case, anyway, to his everlasting regret.
I gave him a B+ on my rating, which I guess would be about a 7 here.
If you've read this far...seek help.
by ThePeerless on Jun 4, 2010 12:00 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
He also would not be a Cap after this year, but then again, I think that’s going to be the case, anyway, to his everlasting regret.
FWIW, teh twitterz are reporting he is having a lot of work done on his house.
people often do work on their house to prep it for sale…
Just trying to capture the spirit of the thing...
by dcsportsfan1 on Jun 4, 2010 12:53 PM EDT up reply actions
5.
I expected him to show up in the playoffs. He didn’t. I expected him to have a solid regular season. I think it wouldn’t hurt the team to consider trading him if the right offer came along, but mostly just for his contract. But 40 goals is a lot of goals…damn.
"Don't mind WM...he's an all-around jerk."
6
I never expected him to get 40 goals or to play in 73 games. I figured 65 games and 30 goals. He did a good job in the regular season in terms of his offense. The PK was a bonus and he probably should do that more often.
That said, some of the boneheaded plays he makes are so [Francischetti]ing frustrating it’s incredible. A lot of it comes from some of his immaturity. He makes a mistake, gets frustrated, and then takes a penalty. We’ve all seen it. Sasha, mistakes are a part of life. When you turn the puck over, go play D, don’t hook down the guy who took it from you.
And yes, maturity is an issue with him. Remember at the olympics, the big story before the tourney was how when all the past and present Caps got together for team Russia, Semin went and stole a luggage cart. What would possess him to do that?
He would have gotten a 7 or 8 from me if he had shown up in the playoffs, but he never did anything. Of course, if he showed up and played in the playoffs like he did in the regular season, the Caps beat Montreal and move on to play (and likely beat) Philly and either Boston or Pittsburgh… and of course it means we’re not writing comments on these Rink Wraps yet…
It can be so frustrating watching him from Section 421. On the one hand, you can see the amazing talent he has, but at the same time, the stupid shows up.
As for the future, if he grows up, then yes, the Caps should pursue a long term deal. If he stays as is, then let him go chase the big bucks elsewhere. He probably wants a salary similar to Backstrom and Ovechkin, and a team with lots of Cap room (meaning a bad team) will give it to him. If he wants to be a star in Edmonton, let him.
A ten for next year. 45 goals and 75+ games played, and some success in the postseason. He doesn’t have to be the big star, but contributing something would be nice.
Washington Capitals 2009-10 = Quebec Nordiques 1994-95
--- D'ohboy
he was what i expected in the regular season. stretches of jaw dropping talent surrounded by moments of forehead slapping stupidity. fortunately the former seemed to exceed the latter in the regular season.
but his playoffs were so far below what i expected, particularly coming off his 0-fer against the pens the year before. the guys has been a producer in the two previous playoff series before the pens series so i expected him to break out of his slump. sure he got lots of shots and sure halak played great, but seriously, zero goals after scoring 40 in the regular season. unfathomable.
he gets a 4 from me.
long term plans? well, lets say he gets on a roll this year, scores 40+ goals, etc. he’s going to demand a salary north of the $6M he’s getting today unless he wants to take a bit of a home town discount. to me, not worth it given that the team is going to need to pay a goalie and a couple of the young dmen, HH21 and MG52 going forward, not to mention taking on the salary of a 2C this off season (hopefully). if he goes in the tank this year, then i think we part ways.
question is, do you ride him through the playoffs or deal him during the season. i just dont see semin being a guy you lock up long term for the type of $ he’s going to command. i say be open to deals at any point in the season, particularly if it brings you a quality defensman under contract for a few more years.
Just trying to capture the spirit of the thing...
5
I expected something close to 35-40 goals, a point per game average, and 10 games missed. He mildly exceeded those expectations in the regular season, and would have received a 6 or 7 but lost a couple points for the playoff disappearing act.
We’ve seen him play very well in the Flyers and Rangers series. We’ve seen him disappear in the Pens and Habs series. Here’s hoping the trend reverses next april.
A 10 would be 50 goals, 100 points and a point per game in the playoffs.
Because now I can justify browsing and commenting during the work day with the argument that I am promoting my business.
I’m considering voting 5 or 6. I wish I could be more surprised about the up and down but often fantastic regular season followed by a no-show in the playoffs.
To get a 10 next year he’ll have to continue improving on the PK and discipline and actually be hot for the playoffs. I’ve given up on his consistency, which is why I have made it clear for months that I think he is not worth locking up long term. Aside from the consistency, I also fear that Semin brings out the worst in Ovechkin’s play – his care bears side. The Captain my miss his friend, but I’m not so sure he is the best on-ice influence.
Of all our iniquities ignorance may be the worst
6
He is one of those players that manages to tip the scale (both good and bad) almost simultaneously. I expect him to be one of the higher scorers on this team, and I expect him to be a scoring threat when he’s out there, whether it be 5v5 or 4v5. He was slightly higher in goals (I figured low to mid 30’s), but he was also equally as frustrating with the stick penalties and his well-documented palyoff performance (I probably didn’t dock him enough for his playoff performance). But at the end of the day, on a team with Ovi and Backstrom, it’s great to have a 40-goal guy who can also play good D. I’d love to see him on the PK more next year, and if he’s with the club for the entire season, I’m hoping for another 35+ goals, and some over-due playoff scoring.
5
Pretty much as expected. The guy goes from “hands down best player in the league” to “TRADE HIM” in not just games, but individual periods. Hell there were probably more than I could count individual shifts with the same sentiment.
A 10 next year? Play consistent. I could care less about the goals; he has the talent level to score whenever he chooses to. Same with him out on the PK, if he wants to wreak havoc he has the talent level to do so. If he puts it all together for one season, it’s going to be Ovechkin who? But, he’s not. In the end he’s going to put up 30 goals again with many multi goal games to go with dry spells. The thing with him is that if he actually does that, he’s immediately unaffordable for the Caps. If he sticks with his inconsistent greatness, it’s hard to want him on the team but he’s definitely affordable. Damned if you do, damned if you don’t. He’s still the type of guy that if he buckled down he could look like Fedorov or Datsyuk out there. Incredible scoring talent hidden inside an absolutely dominating defensive forward.
All the king's horses and all the king's men
Couldn't put Humpty together again
7
I read the comments before I voted because the more you know, the more you know. I’m not sure why but Alex Semin evokes more extreme reaction, good and bad, than probably any other player who’s ever worn a Caps uniform. I’d love to know why, but then that would take away all the fun. What does make me laugh is when someone says I gave him a five because I expected him to score 40 goals. Really? 879 players suited up for a game in the NHL last season. Exactly six (inlcuding Semin) scored 40 or more goals. That means Semin scored more goals than 99% of the players in the league. I don’t know about everyone else, but that sure exceeds my expectations no matter how talented the player is. If Semin had some success in the playoffs, I’d have given him an eight, maybe a nine. But he didn’t so he got the seven.
I don’t get it. Did it surprise you when AO scored 50?
I waited all year for this?
by Rob Parker on Jun 4, 2010 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
What does make me laugh is when someone says I gave him a five because I expected him to score 40 goals. Really?
Semin scored 34 goals in 62 games last season. That’s .55 goals per game. Multiply that by 82 games and you get ~45 goals. So why would expecting him to score 40 be chuckle-worthy?
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
Semin scored 34 goals in 62 games last season. That’s .55 goals per game. Multiply that by 82 games and you get ~45 goals.
Point of correction on my part. Seven players not six scored 40 or more this season. As to your point about why I shouldn’t automatically expect Semin to score 40 goals, my answer is because it’s so hard to duplicate performances from year to year. Case in point, in 07-08, 10 guys scored 40 or more. In 08-09, only two guys, Ovi and Kovalchuk, were able to duplicate that feat. And in 09-10, the same two were the only ones able to duplicate it again. There were a lot of great scorers on that list, guys like Hossa, Iginla, Nash, yet they couldn’t repeat their performance of scoring 40 goals. It’s just that hard. The fact that Semin did it this season should be a big point in his favor and instead, it’s received by many fans with a “so what, I expected more.”
So it’s more reasonable to expect that his goal-scoring would regress than remain constant or improve?
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
The point I’m making ( I guess not very well) is that 40 goals in today’s NHL is a big milestone. I’m not a huge baseball guy but I’d probably equate it to 40 home runs. The fact that so few players can duplicate it from season to season I think attests to that fact. And Semin had a lot of hurdles he had to overcome this season to reach 40. By my count, he had at least five different centers. Ovehckin was gone for 10 games, making Semin the #1 target for the opposing defense. And Sasha himself was injured a lot, missing nine games and playing through some wrist and back problems. I just think (and apparently you don’t) that getting to 40 goals this season was pretty remarkable, no matter how talented a player he is.
I think if you take a look after AO’s rookie season (and make him 26, which means he won’t improve much as is natural) then you could say “52 was a bit lucky” especially since it was the first time AO did it.
Semin hit 40 for the first time and unless he cures his inconsistency he won’t be able to get much more. Sort of like AO and say, 65ish goals.
Cидни Kросби: Александр Oвечкин, он твой папа теперь
Red Line Station: for Capitals fans who can bear reading something less intelligent than a story at Japers' Rink
(note name change)
by red army line on Jun 4, 2010 2:37 PM EDT up reply actions
40 goals is big, no doubt. I certainly don’t mean to discount the achievement. More to the point, it’s a testament to how skilled I think he is that I could, I believe, reasonably expect him to be right around 40 goals for the season.
And, not to nitpick, but all of the stuff you credit him with overcoming happened during the season, and our expectations are supposed to be pre-season expectations.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
Semin is more talented than 99% of the league, so yes, I expected him to be able to do things that 99% of players couldn’t do.
Of all our iniquities ignorance may be the worst
by Killer_Carlson on Jun 4, 2010 1:19 PM EDT up reply actions
Six
There aren’t too many better goal scorers with a heavier shot than Comrade Jizz, and when he actually puts his mind to it, he is the Caps’ most versatile threat. When he doesn’t, well…I really want this to work, this Soviet Bromance, but it’s past time to see 28 put it all together, because there is just way way too much inconsistency Being held off the score sheet greater than 2 out of 6 games, for example, cannot be acceptable any more.
At the end of it, however, I think we have to keep him through this contract, and find a nasty center who will complement him. Someone who can coax a 10 out of Sasha, to the tune of 50/50 +25. I’d also like to think he’s capable of committing half the lazy stick fouls. But most importantly, I want 28 stepping up his game to take over and dominate like he can, instead of drifting through stretches like he still does.
More norrissey, less morrissey
Any of the 10’s explain their vote yet?
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
Yep. 1’s should be explained as well, but there are only a few of them, so I chalk it up to the usual trolling.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
As someone who is a Semin fan, my feeling here (pure conjecture with no data to back it up), is that this place is not seen as a very friendly place for people who like Semin, so why bother? People are more likely to speak up in a complaining mode about anything rather than in a supportive one, so more people who like to criticize Semin show up here. Maybe the people who gave him a 10 just really like him for whatever reason, think all things considered he had a pretty good season, but they are not about to jump into the abyss here.
That said, I think some of the criticism here is valid, but the level of bitterness so directed at him seems unfair to me. The number of 10s may get back to the issue of entertainment and the fact that most hockey fans may not be quite as focused on every nuance of a particular player’s performance as many are here. They see a spectacular play, a goal, a beauty of a pass, and the stats to confirm what they saw most of the time. They also know that all players make bad plays, have turnovers, take penalties now and then. I just think the average hockey fan may be more forgiving. For the most part, people here are not average.
JP, how many different commenters post here on a regular basis (say, every day for a week) during the season? One time I counted and came up with 20-30; that may be way off, I don’t know. The point is, there probably are many more people who read Japers’ without ever commenting, and then there are many more Caps fans who probably never read Japers’. It is a terrific resource, though (thank you). Again, no data, just my opinion.
there probably are many more people who read Japers’ without ever commenting, and then there are many more Caps fans who probably never read Japers’.
Unquestionably true on both counts.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
Maybe the people who gave him a 10 just really like him for whatever reason, think all things considered he had a pretty good season
The number of 10s may get back to the issue of entertainment and the fact that most hockey fans may not be quite as focused on every nuance of a particular player’s performance as many are here.
Maybe. But if that’s the case, they’re not answering the questions as put forth.
Because it matters.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
by J.P. on Jun 4, 2010 2:38 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
hey now, some of us don’t get to elect Senators!
#savethekittens!
Donation info for SAVES FOR KIDS 2010!! Make a difference.
As commented by DMG, that’s not really answering the poll properly. If anything I’d say that the people that hate Semin have more reason to give him a 10, if they are answering the right question. Semin had a very good season, but it comes down to what was expected. Those that love Semin should be expecting big things from him, and therefore not give him a 10. Those that hate him should be giving him a 10 if they really think he’s terrible.
I'm gonna pain you dearly Woodhouse, when I peel all your skin off with a flensing knife, sew it into Woodhouse pajamas, and then set those pajamas on fire.
by Steckel Me Elmo on Jun 4, 2010 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions
But despite claims to the contrary, none of the people who criticize Semin think he is a terrible player. There is no reason to give him a 10 other than as a popularity contest.
Of all our iniquities ignorance may be the worst
by Killer_Carlson on Jun 4, 2010 2:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, I was using hyperbole. But my main point is that those that love Semin have even less reason to rate him 10 when going by the question. There is absolutely no way Semin earned a 10 this season considering the physical tools he has at his disposal.
I'm gonna pain you dearly Woodhouse, when I peel all your skin off with a flensing knife, sew it into Woodhouse pajamas, and then set those pajamas on fire.
by Steckel Me Elmo on Jun 4, 2010 2:29 PM EDT up reply actions
I would tend to disagree. If you are one of those people that loves semin, I think you honestly just overlook the flaws to a large extent. if you are overlooking the flaws, then you just see the great plays and excellent point totals and say “he’s super awesome!”. Now granted, maybe if you love him a REALLY lot you might say “but he should be able to score 50 and 100, not ‘just’ 40 and 85!”.
I was aiming at the latter. If you love him and think he’s an awesome player (which, no doubt, he can be) then your expectations should be higher, making it harder for him to earn a 10 in your eyes. Conversely, if you hate him and don’t expect much in the way of consistency, that 10 should be a bit easier for him to come by.
I'm gonna pain you dearly Woodhouse, when I peel all your skin off with a flensing knife, sew it into Woodhouse pajamas, and then set those pajamas on fire.
by Steckel Me Elmo on Jun 4, 2010 4:53 PM EDT up reply actions
The truth is, this isn’t a test in school, and while many of us may go through the cirteria and think about it, others will give a number based on whether they like or don’t like someone as a player (and these probably are people who don’t comment ever). It will be an opinion they have come to from watching all season and it’s not likely to change by reading the wrap. The wrap may inform, confirm, or contradict their opinions, but it’s not likely to change anyone’s mind significantly. When I read many of the comments in the wraps, it’s evident that people approach it differently, regardless of the intructions.
And if they give a number based on whether or not they like the player they are answering the wrong question; and a question that is not entirely relevant.
I'm gonna pain you dearly Woodhouse, when I peel all your skin off with a flensing knife, sew it into Woodhouse pajamas, and then set those pajamas on fire.
by Steckel Me Elmo on Jun 4, 2010 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions
There’s a difference between approaching it differently and answering a different question. Different people may weight the regular season and playoff differently, or may place different amounts of value on different factors but still be answering the question. There’s certainly room for interpretation in that sense.
But to vote based on how much you like a guy rather than how he performed relative to your expectations is like answering “Chocolate cake!” when you’re asked what your favorite soda is.
by David Getz on Jun 4, 2010 2:35 PM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
What if chocolate cake really is your favorite soda? Ever think of that, smarty pants?
Of all our iniquities ignorance may be the worst
by Killer_Carlson on Jun 4, 2010 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions
I like to take a chunk, soak it in tequila, then eat/shoot it.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
So is eat/shooting tequila-soaked chocolate cake – I eyeball it.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
Me, I like to hide these in my chocolate cakes.
You just got iced, bro!
"Ovechkin, what is good in life?"
"To crush your enemies. To see them driven before you. And to hear the lamentations of their captain."
by Wheeler on Jun 4, 2010 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
My hypothesis: Canes Country is messing with us. They are probably still bitter about that Mario .gif.
"Do not be afraid to ask for credit, for our way of refusing is very polite."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jun 4, 2010 3:05 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
On a substantive point, it continues to be maddening to me how little SH TOI Semin gets, especially given that he’s a 2nd-liner (i.e. when Bruce throws the 1st line out after a PK, he doesn’t have to worry about Semin being fresh for it, which is a legit reason not to use Nick on the PK, I suppose).
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
by J.P. on Jun 4, 2010 1:31 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
my first thought is that semin can be far too loose with the puck to be relied upon on the PK. i have visions of shorthanded 2-2 rushes where jizz makes a patented drop pass at the opposing blue line which turns into a 3 or 4 on 2 the other way. it would be nice to have an offensive threat on the point during the PK to maybe get the defense backing up. i think its clear that it’s not BB’s (or whoever is the "brain"s behind the PK) style to pressure the points to try and create SH opportunites. seems to be working well so why change…wait…
my smart ass response would be it’s hard to get SH TOI when you are in the box.
Just trying to capture the spirit of the thing...
has he actually done that vision of yours? He does make passes on his own zone when he should clear (at least on even strength) but does he really take stupid risks when attacking on PK? I don’t think I remember such happening in the 89 games I watched this year (and I had my eyes on him like an isolation cam)
i have no specific recollection of him doing that on the pk, but i do recall many dont-do-it-dont-do-it thoughts of semin on the rush making such moves. and he’s not the only offender. the original point was why doesnt he get more SH TOI, so i was offering that up as to why he might not getting much PK time despite stats the suggest he should spend more time out there when down a man.
Just trying to capture the spirit of the thing...
Well, his actual performance in PK situations pretty much negates those first couple of lines…
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
if anything, the PK is the one place where Semin’s has shown consistency (a positive consistency!) in his game.
#savethekittens!
Donation info for SAVES FOR KIDS 2010!! Make a difference.
Yeah, he’s Mr. Consistent on the PK. The only time he is inconsistent when he manages to wow someone who knows how good he is with his absolutely sublime skill. That ridiculous shorthanded goal comes to mind — he was the only guy on the Capitals squad who could have pulled that off, period.
All the king's horses and all the king's men
Couldn't put Humpty together again
6 from me, but whats with the results?
I take it we are seeing Mike-Green level ballot stuffing with droves of “10’s” and instead of 130 explanations we have none?
proud 4th line advocate
ECS Member
You do not need an account to vote in the poll, so really any given person could stop by and cast a vote. Hell, I could log out right now and vote again.
"Do not be afraid to ask for credit, for our way of refusing is very polite."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jun 4, 2010 2:04 PM EDT up reply actions
His quirkiness is so adorable, mark it 10!
Of all our iniquities ignorance may be the worst
by Killer_Carlson on Jun 4, 2010 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions
The Zooey Deschanel of hockey!
I'm gonna pain you dearly Woodhouse, when I peel all your skin off with a flensing knife, sew it into Woodhouse pajamas, and then set those pajamas on fire.
by Steckel Me Elmo on Jun 4, 2010 1:56 PM EDT up reply actions
To paraphrase an old Chris Rock joke, he’s like the Justin Bieber of hockey. Everyone has his album, but nobody wants to admit it.
They're coming.
by Bald Pollack on Jun 4, 2010 2:00 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
6. About an 8 for the regular season, and a 4 for the playoff. He was flat-out robbed several times during the playoffs, but as a borderline all-star, you need to be able to step up your game to the next level. And, while I do hold him in high esteem, with the contracts of 8 and 19, I don’t see any way we can re-sign him after next year, so I’m for trading him for as much as possible now.
I'm the first to admit when I'm wrong.... except when someone else beats me to it.
by Backhanded Complement on Jun 4, 2010 2:03 PM EDT reply actions
6
Would have been a 7 without his playoffs disappearing act (crudely named, I know…and I understand how he got 40 sog, and it was hugely fluky that he didn’t score…but still, results are results). He was much better on the PK than I expected, but he was about right where I would expect on offense (maybe even a notch low…but that would be pushing it). While I know he CAN be so much better, I really have a hard time expecting it…so a 6 seems about right. A little above average, except for the playoffs.
To get a 10, I think it’d have to be what others have been saying…50/100, considered one of the best players in the league, etc. He’s definately capable of it.
As for is he’s part of the future…I don’t think so. Really, it comes down to money. The Caps have plenty of offense, and even without Semin, it’ll be fine. But they do have some kids (Carlson, Alzner, Neuverth to name a few) who are going to be up for raises soon. Big raises possibly. And the Caps will need cap room to deal with that. If Semin is signed to a contract that he’s worth (probably in the 6 million range), it could make things really tight down the road in keeping all these guys under contract and in Washington. I don’t think you trade him unless you have a big hole to fill, though. Use his offense, hope he gets hot in the playoffs, and try to use him to win you a Championship this year.
Esta noche nosotros cenamos Tortugas
Así que bueno, ellos serán
Z!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
4 for me
Haven’t read any comments yet, but I am shocked that he has received so many high numbers considering his playoffs. I arrived at a 4 because he was a bit above expectation in the regular season, but not nearly enough above them to offset the miserable playoff performance. I was very close to voting him a 3.
The Discussion: Should Semin be in the Caps’ long-term plans or should the team pursue trading him prior to next season’s trade deadline? What will it take for him to earn a 10 rating next year?
I don’t think the caps can afford to keep all 3 of Semin-Ovie-Green and still keep a good team around them, so I say see-ya Semin. Not sure it happens before next trade deadline or if they simply let him walk at the end of his contract. Part of me says you need that scoring depth in the playoffs, but the cynical part of me says “we’ll get more scoring from an empty slot in our lineup in the playoffs”.
To earn a 10 next year, he needs to put up near 45-50-95 pts, be a top PK’er, stop taking so many penalties, and most importantly SHOW UP IN THE PLAYOFFS.
I don’t think the caps can afford to keep all34 of Semin-Ovie-Green-Backstrom and still keep a good team around them, without ridiculous development and production from young cheap ELC guys.
Fixed.
Related: should the Caps keep him for the playoff run if they can’t get him to sign an extension? He’ll be UFA and if he’s having another 40 goal season his selling price will be very high.
Cидни Kросби: Александр Oвечкин, он твой папа теперь
Red Line Station: for Capitals fans who can bear reading something less intelligent than a story at Japers' Rink
(note name change)
by red army line on Jun 4, 2010 2:41 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m of the mind that you should avoid letting an asset like that walk for nothing if you can help it. So if there’s no extension and no indication that one will be reached prior to the deadline, yes, I’d explore trading him.
That said, $6 coming off the books is something, so if the return isn’t good enough, you enter the playoffs with him and hope for the best.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
If there’s the possibility of getting a Bergeron type, I think we agree trading Semin is good. But if the return is a more Callahan type (but at center) and maybe some picks or prospects, should GMGM pull the trigger? I think in that case GMGM should hold onto 28.
Cидни Kросби: Александр Oвечкин, он твой папа теперь
Red Line Station: for Capitals fans who can bear reading something less intelligent than a story at Japers' Rink
(note name change)
by red army line on Jun 4, 2010 2:45 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m of the mind that you should avoid letting an asset like that walk for nothing if you can help it.
I think this generally applies to teams that are not in Stanley Cup contention. If a team was short on scoring, they might trade for a high scoring winger whose contract is about to run out. Why shouldn’t the Caps keep Semin through next year’s playoffs in the hopes that he can turn it on, even if they know they’ll lose him after. Isn’t that better than getting some prospect for him who might help you four years down the line?
I know it’s all nested hypotheticals, but the bottom line is that I think contenders generally ought to keep going with the team that got them there. If the Caps are in first place again next year, trading Semin before the playoffs is exactly the wrong message even if the team has no intention of keeping him.
Atta dinnin stick a who!
by Gould Old Days on Jun 5, 2010 1:51 PM EDT up reply actions
I’m wholeheartedly on board with a trade during the summer if it nets us a seriously good center (Bergeron’s been brought up before, I’m impressed with his two-way game) or a quality D-man. Once the deadline rolls around, a major move like that is unlikely to help the team unless it’s for a staggering return and someone who would never be available via trade comes up.
Only YOU can prevent idiots from commenting!
by Knee high to a duck on Jun 5, 2010 2:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Regarding your follow-up Q, it’s all about what the caps can get in return. If Semin’s value is high enough that they can get something that helps them with a cup run then I am willing to move him. But, I don’t think the caps can afford to move a 40-goal guy right before the playoffs without getting equivalent roster help in return. They need to be focused on winning the cup this season, not stockpiling draft picks and prospects.
6
I have an unhealthy amount of love for Semin, but that of course results in higher expectations.
Waiting 'til next year.
People, stop the madness!
Sorry I’m late to the fray…bloody work gets in the way sometimes. What’s up with all these 10s though? Are we that hockey-dense as a fanbase? I give Semin a 4, which broke out to a 7 for the regular season and a 1 for when it counts, and that averages out to a 4.
To follow up on one of Laingtern’s points up at the top, too many people are dazzled by this guy’s skill that they overlook the bad. Sure he can razzle-dazzle against crappy teams like the Kitties or Islanders or, hell, he can have a terrible game and still pot two highlight-reel goals like he did at Ottawa in February. But when it counts this guy folds. Why? To me, there are two reasons that prevent him from reaching his potential:
1) He’s not the brightest bulb in the basket.
2) He’s soft and spineless.
While his skillset is about 4 deviations off the mean compared to the average NHL player, his hockey sense is about 4 deviations on the wrong side. He has great offensive instincts, but when the game isn’t played like a free-flowing pickup game he just doesn’t have the mental horsepower to adjust accordingly. I believe that if Semin simply had median hockey sense for an NHLer, he’d probably be the best forward in the league. He doesn’t. Add his world-class softness to the mix and you get a playoff choker, someone unwilling to pay the price to win.
So I understand the “wow” factor and am, too, pretty amazed at what he can do with the puck. But it hasn’t translated to winning when it matters. Semin hasn’t shown physical or mental fortitude to consistently handle playoff hockey. And all I care about is winning the Cup, not scoring highlight-reel goals or racking up regular season points. Until then, count me as part of the Anti-Semin Lobby – he’s not a core, indisplenable asset to this team and I’m not sure his presence is going to get us any closer to Lord Stanley’s Cup. But take solace Semin fans, his presence will get the Caps on TSN’s nightly highlights more frequently.
So my brother ran into ShaMo and Laich at Front Page in late March. He wished them "good luck" for the upcoming playoffs. When he told me this story I got really pissed and blurted: "You wished THEM luck?!? They need to wish us fans luck for the excruciating way they'll manage to break our hearts this spring." They didn't disappoint.
Shit, shit, shit, a thousand times shit!
How’d I forget his shootout attempt against the Stars?!?!?!
In fairness to me, it fits neither under “The Good” nor “The Bad,” and would’ve necessitated creation of “The Awesome.”
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
Tsk, tsk, tsk. You’re slipping, J.P.!
I'm gonna pain you dearly Woodhouse, when I peel all your skin off with a flensing knife, sew it into Woodhouse pajamas, and then set those pajamas on fire.
by Steckel Me Elmo on Jun 4, 2010 4:55 PM EDT up reply actions
that got a special mention in my 2009-2010 Caps yearbook
#savethekittens!
Donation info for SAVES FOR KIDS 2010!! Make a difference.
and, please, it merits not a “The Awesome” but a “Teh Awesome!!!!!!!!!!!” as they kiddos say
#savethekittens!
Donation info for SAVES FOR KIDS 2010!! Make a difference.
That’s his most memorable to me too. Just for his expression (apology??) to Neuvy alone.
"It hit me on the pants. I had protection. It felt good. Why? I wanted to win."
Just looked at it. Guess he wanted to ensure having the GWG. That was a bad turnover on the PP. Luckily we were winning the game and did 5-2, but Neuvy had the puck stopped and Sasha lost his footing causing Neuvy to lose the puck. Yes, the expression alone is memorable. I remember Neuvy talking about it after the game.
Snovchkin game 1! We moved down to sit with friends who have seats right by the goal the Caps defend twice and had an up close view of that amusing little debacle. Damn, can’t believe I forgot to include that in the book I put together on this season.
#savethekittens!
Donation info for SAVES FOR KIDS 2010!! Make a difference.
6
woulda been an 8 but for the offensive fail in the playoffs.
I like Sasha and will enjoy rooting for him this year, which I fully anticipate will be his last as a Cap.
A danger to myself and others on the ice
10
- 4 = 6, which is what I rated Semin. Good on PK, dumb penalty frequency diminished during the season, oh that sweet Semin (wrist) shot, production away from Ovechken-Backstrom, but knocked down from 7-8 because of that f&$#@#$!!!-ing disappearance in the playoffs.
I believe in JC.
Is this the first voting that wasn’t basically a normal curve? Maybe there are just a lot of people that wanted to vote 11-13 so it would have ended up normal? I honestly can’t wrap my head around the voting here. This is the most inexplicable vote we’ve had since MVC 9.
I waited all year for this?
by Rob Parker on Jun 4, 2010 5:33 PM EDT reply actions 3 recs
I was literally about to post something like this. Very weird. Like people would’ve given him a 12 if they could’ve.
by Bushwood Bushwhacker on Jun 4, 2010 5:34 PM EDT up reply actions
But doesn’t it just fit with our subject? Inexplicable, mysterious, enigmatic, inscrutable . . . and the adjectives could go on. I think it’s highly appropriate, maybe should have even been expected. It’s rather hilarious to observe the befuddlement of the rink! (Maybe they have their laptops up in Turkey and had the whole Russian National team vote, plus their guests, which could be many.)
I’m sure there are logs that would show if there were a bulge in the number of people joining the Rink in the last couple of days.
Because they apparently couldn’t wait til the season was over to join.
But not just to read – which is open to all – but to either comment or vote – which requires an acct.
I haven’t seen all that many new names associated with comments
And not one such new name defends a 10 vote for #28
Honestly? I just find evaluating him so confusing — every statement/sentiment one way is reflexively qualitfied with an equally valid point on the other way. He is extraordinarily gifted, but… He’s frustrates me in a similar way to Eric Staal, if only to a higher degree — talented player, but just not all there with enough frequency to achieve greatness.
Wound up giving him a 7, as a nod to his ability in the spirit of moderation. There’s no way he deserves a 10, as as I’m concerned.
Looks like I picked the wrong season to stop sniffing glue.
I agree that he’s extremely difficult to judge, but I don’t see how over 50% of voters can’t picture much, if anything, more from him. I’d give Eric Fehr a 10 for 40 goals. I’m positive Semin has the potential for 50.
I waited all year for this?
Agreed. Semin’s potential is huge, but I have problems envisioning him ever getting close to fulfilling it due to something intangible about him. He’s mercurial on a grand scale.
Looks like I picked the wrong season to stop sniffing glue.
Like an inverse Poisson distribution of some sort. Except not at all; it kind of defies statistical description. That is, in at least some small way, the kind of player he is, though, so I guess, in some small way, that should be expected (enough commas?). I certainly did not expect what I saw after I voted, though.
I’m calling shenanigans on the voting. Has any poll had as many votes? And the vote distribution is, uh, questionable. Oh, and not one of the ~400 10’s has admitted their vote in the comments.
Click on people’s names and you can see their votes… see any 10’s?
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
Can you tell how posters voted even if they don’t respond? My guess is the ones who voted 10 are female and under 30.
I didn’t know you could do that! I’m one of those females under 30, by the by, and didn’t give a 10, much as I adore Sasha.
I’m just surprised there are that many 8s and above, not just 10s. I definitely think he exceeded expectations, but I never expected so many others (at JR, anyway) to feel the same, so it’s weird.
It’s possible that a lot of people who read JR and vote in the polls do not express their opinions on JR, so what you read here on a daily basis may not be reflected in such a poll. As a Semin fan, it took me awhile before I decided to sign on and comment at all because, frankly, the tone of negative comments about Semin sometimes is hostile, not just about him, but also to the person who may have a positive view that is not shared by those who most often comment here. That’s my feeling and others can certainly disagree.
The reason I used to lurk was because I don’t like making accounts. But this account is probably the second-most important account I’ve made, behind Google. And it’s close.
Maybe someone linked to it on an alien SBN blog, or Pensblog, or PD, or something?
Cидни Kросби: Александр Oвечкин, он твой папа теперь
Red Line Station: for Capitals fans who can bear reading something less intelligent than a story at Japers' Rink
(note name change)
by red army line on Jun 5, 2010 6:22 AM EDT up reply actions
There are definitely far more readers/voters than commenters, that’s for sure.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
I’m not saying ALL of the voters who voted a 10 are female/under 30. I’m just guessing that the majority of them are. Is it less sexist sounding when a female makes that assumption?
Is it less sexist sounding when a female makes that assumption?
No.
by CaptainAwesome on Jun 5, 2010 12:21 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
What do you base that on? What exactly are you suggesting by saying that a certain demographic gave him high marks?
First, I think I should add that I’m female, although I’m older than 30. I guess I’ve just seen and read enough stuff on other messageboards to make that assumption. I realize I’m probably offending those people, and I’m not really that type of person—but hey, it’s just my opinion.
Sorry, I’m really not trying to offend you or anyone else. If you really knew me, I’m probably one of the least judgemental people around. Heck, I have 2 daughters in their 20s.
I’m just trying to come up with a reason. Do you have one as to why someone would give Semin a 10?
Well I gave him an eight when I meant to click seven by mistake, so there’s that.
Then there’s this thing that you just invoked – The Opinion.
Does he deserve a ten? Hell the fuck no, you’d have to be an absolute goddamn moron to think that he earned a ten. But opinions are indeed like assholes. Everyone’s entitled to one, for their own reasons.
392 votes for a ten doesn’t mean that there’s a mass of giggly, smitten girls with sprained index fingers from clicking so fast to cast their vote.
392 votes for a ten means that there are 392 dumbasses that engaged in the poll.
But hey, it’s just their opinion.
by CaptainAwesome on Jun 5, 2010 12:34 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
No, I don’t know why so many people would give him a 10. I can see some people doing it. I accept what you said about trying to find a reason, but I think it could be a lot of different types of people. If it’s not some kind of “shenanigans,” maybe there’s a silent majority out there that wanted to make a statement? Who knows?
Now, that’s a good thought about the “silent majority.” And that’s a good point, there could be a lot of posters who are afraid to post on these boards because let’s face it, they can be intimidating at times (I’m finding that out right now). And they’ve probably seen Semin being picked on left and right and really don’t want to get into the argument, but can silently support him by giving him a 10.
And I never said my opinion was right. It’s just what I think. Isn’t that what these boards are for—to post what you think?
Isn’t that what these boards are for—to post what you think?
Yup, you posted what you thought. And so did I.
Now if you’ll excuse me, I have a DVR Burn Notice marathon to get back to.
by CaptainAwesome on Jun 5, 2010 12:35 AM EDT up reply actions
Others have had a similar number of votes and a couple more. Given Semin’s status on the team and the polarized opinions, a high vote count should not be surprising. Shenanigans? How would that occur and why not on other polls? Maybe, just maybe, a lot of people have a different view, and many of those could be the same people who also gave Backs and Ovi high numbers. Regardless, the number of votes for players as follows:
Green 1611
Backs 1518
Semin 1461 (as of now)
Ovi 1427
Neuvy 1406
Carlson 1174
Corvo 1173
Knubs 1171
Flash 1102
Fehr 1088
Laich 1083
Belanger 1025
by Seminrocks on Jun 4, 2010 11:58 PM EDT up reply actions 5 recs
Shenanigans? How would that occur and why not on other polls?
How: stuffing the ballot box by voting over and over
Why here and not elsewhere: people didn’t care enough to do it elsewhere
But how is it done here? I can’t do it. I am not given the option. Do you know that it’s possible to do here and is actually done?
When I am logged in I can only vote once. When I am logged out I can vote each time I visit the site/clear my cookies.
(Just tested it.)
(Yes, I know about the avatar hounding - just pretend mine is invisible.)
I haven’t tried that just to see, but it’s not something I would ever do on votes such as these that are supposed to be one-time (even though I’m from TX, I don’t believe in stuffing the ballot box!).
If people are doing it, then how much, and most of all, why? Either they have nothing better to do and for some reason want to stick it to a Japers’ poll for fun or they have nothing better to do and it’s a backlash.
I also am wondering if any such charge about shenanigans was made when Green received 383 10s, 128 9s, and 202 8s, for a total of 713 8-10s, Tens were the highest of that group. As I recall, he and Semin were the main scapegoats for playoff failure. IMO, Semin certainly had a better regular season for himself with career stats and better overall play, so I am not surprised Semin’s overall ratings would be higher than Green’s.
I also am wondering if any such charge about shenanigans was made when Green received 383 10s, 128 9s, and 202 8s, for a total of 713 8-10s
Yes – someone (I want to natty bumpo or Knee High to a Duck) noted that with Green.
IMO, Semin certainly had a better regular season for himself with career stats and better overall play, so I am not surprised Semin’s overall ratings would be higher than Green’s.
But it’s compared to expectations. I gave Green a higher rating because he did better relative to my expectations.
I don’t think I noted it with Green, but I’m noting it with ShaMo right now – look at his 9s.
Only YOU can prevent idiots from commenting!
by Knee high to a duck on Jun 5, 2010 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Oddly enough, over the course of late friday / weekend the vote totals (almost exclusively 9’s and 10’s) went WAY up for BMo and Neuvy.
Well, I don’t know what they were before Friday, but I recorded the totals for players above 1000 and specifically the 8-10s for all players (although I forgot about Alzner) around noon on Saturday. They could not have gone way up for BMo in 9-10s since he only has 2 10s and 1 9 and today they are the same as they were on Saturday. For Neuvy, his 9-10s are the same as they were when I recorded them, but he had one more 8, and his vote total is only up by 3 votes since I recorded it. Again, I do not know what they were before Friday, but not sure what you mean by “way up” given BMo only has 3 9-10s total.
Sorry, meant ShaMo. I have actually been tracking stuff in a spreadsheet, but I don’t keep track of the “previous” numbers that I overwrote. But in general, other wraps (that weren’t closed) increased by 3-20 votes depending on how old they were. I think ShaMo went up by over 200 votes, and Neuvy by about 400.
OK, so "undo" is my friend
I hadn’t actually closed the sheet since I updated the numbers, so I was able to undo all the overwriting I had previously done. I typically update the numbers for all the players in the morning, so as of about 9am Friday the totals were:
ShaMo: 4 10s, 1 9, 16 8s.
Neuvy: 66 10s, 52 9s, 202 8s.
As of Monday morning, those totals were
ShaMo: 4 10s ( +5), 243 9s ( +242), 22 8s ( +6). 258 total new votes (242 of which were 9s)
Neuvy: 365 10s ( +299), 342 9s ( +290), 204 8s ( +2). 594 new votes total (589 of which were 10 or 9).
For comparison, other “non closed” wraps saw the following total new votes(oldest to newest):
Laing +3
BMo +4
ShaMo + 259
Neuvirth + 594
Ovie + 22
Perreault +20
Poti +46
Schultz +169
Semin +1964 (no previous data)
Google to the rescue!!
This link:
Will EVENTUALLY tell the tale, but not today. It will take a while for Google to update the crawls of the profile pages (which they seem to do on an infrequent basis).
Patience is a virtue.
Great. Now I have to change my name to "Jaromir meet Alex".
by Chris meet Alex on Jun 7, 2010 11:26 AM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
7
Playoffs sucked of course, but I kind of expected it
never let the truth get in the way of a good story
6 for me
What’s the average # of votes typically per player rink wrap? The past 2 players only had a little over 600, but I looked at Ovechkin and he had over 1,400. Semin is nearing that number. That is a lot of 10’s for anybody, something ain’t right.
Ovi’s wrap was also on a Friday, which left the whole for votes. Semin’s already at 1400+ and it’s only Friday. Yikes.
"It hit me on the pants. I had protection. It felt good. Why? I wanted to win."
10?????
How is 10 winning? We’re trying to win a stanley cup, a guy taking up 6 million dollars of your cap can’t score 0 goals and be way above expectations. For the amount he gets, he HAS to be at least good in the playoffs to earn a 10. (That 6 million can be put to a lot of other players who will help the team in the playoffs rather than hurt it)
by 8vechkin on Jun 4, 2010 6:27 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
I guess I see your point. I probably voted incorrectly, as he should probably get more than a 1 for the regular season.
However, as I wrote earlier with Green, playoff performance is going to be my sole criteria. Our team had one goal- win the cup. Semin can score a million goals in the regular season and it gets us nowhere (we learned that this year). He was invisible in the playoffs, in fact hurting the team with his play. Since he’s being paid a huge portion of the salary cap to score and he couldn’t in the playoffs, he was drastically below my expectations. I know semin can do better and I think that with more consistency he can earn the contract. But for the past year, his playoff performance was a nightmare, and really fell short of where I think Alex Semin can be.
I promised someone else I’d stay consistent with the “the playoffs are what matters” criteria, so I can’t change it now.
I don’t really think he deserves a 1 for the playoffs, either, but to each his own. Getting the number of shots on goal that he did, regardless of what quality they were, is not 1 material.
But for 6 million dollars of our cap is shots on goal all he’s expected to do? He’s one of the highest paid players on the team who’s paid to score- taking a lot of shots but being unable to score is fine if you’re not Alex Semin or Alex Ovechkin.
That’s part of it, but part of it is that the shots just didn’t go in. You can point to various reasons why, but fact is, when you take so many shots from the average distance Semin was shooting from, and with the speed on his shot etc etc, it’s unlucky if you don’t score.
Cидни Kросби: Александр Oвечкин, он твой папа теперь
Red Line Station: for Capitals fans who can bear reading something less intelligent than a story at Japers' Rink
(note name change)
by red army line on Jun 6, 2010 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions
10 really?
How are this many people giving him a ten? This must be some sort of joke?
…Ashton?
"When I look at the net I don't see a goalie." - Pavel Bure
actually, just as baffling to me is that you can say the 10s are all obviously really out of place, but there’s just as many 9s, and there’s really not that many 4s or 5s. I totally did not expect that. That means (if, big if, people voted correctly) Semin really did exceed, to some extent, people’s expectations.
Pretty much anything you can about Sasha has been noted in the comments by now, and I admit to being a huge Sasha supporter, but I gave him a 7. I expected he’d take the most minor penalties and not much of a hitter, but +1 for being more consistent, +1 for the improved discipline, +1 for exceeding my expectations re the PK (I was expecting good things, but not that good), +1 for the impressive numbers, keeping in mind injuries and despite having revolving linemates (especially ones like Flash), – 1 for the playoffs.
5
He’s coming along well. I know this because his goal count is up and he hasn’t gloved a puck in order to throw it in, what, two seasons now?
If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and never will be.
I have a feeling a lot of the ones who gave Semin a 10 are female and young—I know that’s sounds bad, but I just don’t understand how anyone could give him a 10.
I gave him a 5. I was actually pretty sympathetic toward Semin’s playoff performance, but I find myself being less understanding as time goes by and I’m honestly not sure why.
It does sound bad, I’d avoid making that kind of broad categorization in the future.
Only YOU can prevent idiots from commenting!
by Knee high to a duck on Jun 5, 2010 10:08 AM EDT up reply actions
Not worth much to me. For a journalist, Corey is just about the most biased person when it comes to Semin. He takes every single opportunity possible to snipe at him. I have to wonder if it’s because Semin won’t talk to him.
Did Corey send out similar tweets when the voters accounting for 10,209 votes in the 8-10 categories for all of the other Caps wrapped so far were registered? Furthermore, it’s quite a leap to equate someone giving a player a 10 and them not caring about winning the SC. If I give my child a piece of candy, does it mean I don’t care about his nutrition? It’s about as ludicrous. They are not mutually exclusive.
I don’t recall such a tweet for Green (also a playoff scapegoat) who received 383 10s, as well as 128 9s and 202 8s.
Ovi received 143 10s, 356 9s, and 464 8s. I think all in all, his regular season was less than what was expected (mostly due to the effects of the suspensions and Olympics on him), but he still received 963 in the 8-10s to Semin’s 1093 in the 8-10s. Backs received the most 10s (627), as well as 704 9s and 1456 8s, all which make sense in relativity.
It could be that certain incestuous views of Semin are not shared by a lot of people, or at least not with the same degree of bile. Going to the dark side, on the other hand, maybe the 10s reflect that so many people expected him to fail miserably in just the playoffs and he exceeded their expectations. If I can consider that, maybe others should consider the possibility that their opinion of Semin represents the minority of Caps fans who read the rink and voted, without shenanigans. Beyond that, sometimes I think the sports pundits talk to (read) each other too much which serves to reinforce their own views, dismissing or discarding those that don’t toe the line.
Hopefully we’ll all be here next year to give every player a 5 because the Caps won the SC and that is what we expected.
So the idea is that despite the votes not falling into a normal distribution like every other wrap has that the voters, with a massive anti-Semin bias, all got together and figured out what the criteria are supposed to be for this one vote? Contrary to every other wrap so far, where folks have to be reminded what the voting criteria is? Not buying it and I don’t think you buy it either.
Only YOU can prevent idiots from commenting!
by Knee high to a duck on Jun 5, 2010 2:57 PM EDT up reply actions
If I give my child a piece of candy, does it mean I don’t care about his nutrition? It’s about as ludicrous.
That’s a total strawman; the analogy just doesn’t work. An apt analogy would be if your child brought home a good report card, save for failing chemistry. If you then concluded “This is as good as I could possibly imagine him/her doing”, it’d be fair to ask “Wait, you don’t care about chemistry? Or you expected him/her to fail it?”
Hopefully we’ll all be here next year to give every player a 5 because the Caps won the SC and that is what we expected.
Hopefully not. Misunderstanding the question in one way isn’t really any better than misunderstanding it another way.
by David Getz on Jun 5, 2010 3:16 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
What is it about Semin that engenders such strong reactions from Japers’ Rink (hence Caps fans’) readers!
I mean this rhetorically. Poor guy. HYLP summed him up perfectly for me with:
As Churchill once said about Sasha’s native land, he is “a riddle wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma.”
The 10s are a bit odd (my Alzner-like understatement), but Semin was much better this regulation season than last. However, “sigh”, he was so frustrating in the postseason. I did have high expectations for him, and so for me the postseason is why he ended up as a 6. (I might add that no player including Ovi has earned a ten from me nor have I voted for all of them).
What he did right: Sasha stepped it up when Ovi was out, he remained pretty injury-free (for him), he stepped it up when Ovi became Captain, he was magnificent at times during the streak, he seemed his most comfortable and at ease with the team and the media this season, and he was much more disciplined this season. Yet he went cold at the worst time—during playoffs. So I knocked him back down a few points.
I really do hope that GMGM can solve the 2nd center position because if Sasha can have a creative pivot along with our baker Laich, the second line really could be a 1b line. That’s what I want for the next postseason.
"I’m very happy to hear the news," Ovechkin said when he heard about Backstrom's longterm contract--"because he’s one of the top centers in the world, one of my best friends and we want to play together for a long time. He’s a guy who wants to stay in one place and be comfortable and win, just like me. We talk all the time about playing together, and we talked after the playoffs about how we can win in Washington."
Sasha stepped it up when Ovi was out,
IIRC duing AO’s injury Semin did diddly squat and I think that’s when “trade Semin” began to pick up Semin lobby members like myself. But during his suspension Semin was great, I think.
Cидни Kросби: Александр Oвечкин, он твой папа теперь
Red Line Station: for Capitals fans who can bear reading something less intelligent than a story at Japers' Rink
(note name change)
by red army line on Jun 5, 2010 3:12 PM EDT up reply actions
I was thinking of his play during the suspension period—Sasha’s balky wrist period during Ovi’s injury is a little distant to me at this point.
I did only give him a 6—better than last season but still inconsistent.
What I so very much appreciate about Ovi and Backs is their consistently elite play. That’s why tho’ I love watching Semin and hope that he can get a bona-fide center for his and Laich’s line, he just isn’t in the Ovi/Backs level of eliteness. His inconsistency is his achilles heel no matter how remarkable his stick work may be. To get a ten from me he would have to become consistently great. Especially in the postseason.
"I’m very happy to hear the news," Ovechkin said when he heard about Backstrom's longterm contract--"because he’s one of the top centers in the world, one of my best friends and we want to play together for a long time. He’s a guy who wants to stay in one place and be comfortable and win, just like me. We talk all the time about playing together, and we talked after the playoffs about how we can win in Washington."
by capsyoungguns on Jun 5, 2010 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
If that doesn’t happen…should BB maybe put 19 and 28 together and 8 with whatever 2C fix the Caps have?
Cидни Kросби: Александр Oвечкин, он твой папа теперь
Red Line Station: for Capitals fans who can bear reading something less intelligent than a story at Japers' Rink
(note name change)
by red army line on Jun 6, 2010 1:46 AM EDT up reply actions
This has nothing to do with his performance, but does anyone really believe Sasha weighs in at 205?
Tic Tac Toe Hockey -- Original Caps Photography For The Fan With Compromised Standards
Jack Hazard Photography
by turnituptoeleven on Jun 5, 2010 1:02 PM EDT reply actions
They still list him as that? I get exaggerating, but that’s way past generous. He’s 185, max.
by CaptainAwesome on Jun 5, 2010 1:30 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, I was thinking 180ish at the most. It’s not as ridiculous as listing Shaq at 325, though; he’s pushing 400 easily.
Tic Tac Toe Hockey -- Original Caps Photography For The Fan With Compromised Standards
Jack Hazard Photography
by turnituptoeleven on Jun 5, 2010 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions
A 10 for Alex Semin is the Conn Smythe trophy.
It hasn’t been given out yet, but I don’t think he’s going to win it.
Atta dinnin stick a who!
by Gould Old Days on Jun 5, 2010 1:56 PM EDT reply actions 2 recs
If the same people who voted here vote for that…
Cидни Kросби: Александр Oвечкин, он твой папа теперь
Red Line Station: for Capitals fans who can bear reading something less intelligent than a story at Japers' Rink
(note name change)
by red army line on Jun 5, 2010 3:13 PM EDT up reply actions
Semin = 5
Is a 5. He did what I expected him to. He certainly didn’t overperform either of his contract or his expectations. In fact, I’d say he underperformed, especially when it really mattered.
Not Semin's fault
It’s not Alex Semin’s fault…..it’s the system. Semin is the perfect exhibit to prove that BB needs help. The question is: Do we want this team to be a flashy contender or a hockey dynasty? I’m guessing dynasty. We have the players. Semin’s numbers prove that we have an overwhelming amount of talent that is ineffective in the post season where you encounter disciplined and determined opponents that stick to their game plan and play within their systems. This is why our run and gun system mops up in the regular season but falters when it faces said teams in the post season. I like the excitement and where BB has gotten us so far but he needs bring more discipline to the offense. He needs to impose some order. Develop some systematic crease presence and work on some more set plays so when the initial rush doesn’t produce a goal we have something else to do. Watching Semin skate around wildly and desperately throw low percentage shots on goal is not going to cut it next post season. Its a waist of his talent and it will produce the same results next year if we don’t address the problem.
The 10s
My hypothesis is that the 10s are giving the what-for to the extremely vocal handful of anti-Seminites on this board. Kinda refreshing b/c as a Semin fan (t-shirt level only, the jersey will always be 19), I find this a rough place to hang out, especially with the frequent “I only bash him endlessly b/c he has so much friggin’ potential!” — honey, I only beat you b/c I love you so much.
I love this site, but the Semin discussions are the one place I think it breaks down for me — more heat than light in the comments, though the Semin season recap was awesome.
Note, I’m not a 10, I’m a…
9
Closer to 8 than 10. Reg season was a 10: most value-creating F who doesn’t skate with a legit center two-thirds the time & doesn’t get consistent 1st team PP minutes. I think that’s a ridiculous, singular achievement. As for the 9 somehow implying i had low expectations for him: I think he is what is, and I don’t see evidence of tons of yet-untapped potential in a 26 year old. Wouldn’t surprise me if we just saw his career peak season. I’m hoping for even more, but I certainly don’t expect even another 40g season.
Playoffs were bad but mostly bad luck. Random stuff happens in a short series — even supposed clutch gods like Sid can get shut down in a short series (1 g and minus 1 vs. Mon). Don’t expect to persuade anyone so keeping it brief.
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