Ovechkin hit on Campbell - What They're Saying
by EmilyB on Mar 15, 2010 2:19 AM EDT
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PrintTaking a quick swing 'round the hockeysphere to see how Alex Ovechkin's hit on Brian Campbell is playing.
Be advised - it's not pretty.
Please feel free to add additional links and thoughts in the comments:
Japers' Rink Reax
Damian Cox takes a look at Colin Campbell's inbox
Puck Daddy weighs in, then has additional thoughts
SBN's From The Rink compares and contrasts with Lapierre/Nichols
TJ at Alex Ovetjkin archives the good, the bad, and the ugly
Chicago Tribune reports
Peerless notes one play, two points of view
5ive Hole points us to ESPN and Scott Burnside's take
Puckhead was thinking the officiating crew got it right
SteinBog was surprised that Milbury was thinking they didn't
Dobber sez the League is in a lose-lose situation
Committed Indian breaks out the MS Paint
Early injury report from ESPN
The Confluence has a playlist and a picture of Jamie Heward
The Checking Line opines on Another Day, Another Alex Ovechkin Incident
HockeyDraft.ca goes to the archives
"The Shove Heard 'Round the Hockey World": MD Pro Sports
Chicago Sun-Times reports that the caps and hawks see things differently
If this FanPost is written by someone other than one of the blog's editors, the opinions expressed in it do not necessarily reflect those of this blog or SB Nation.
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It'll be interesting for sure...
My guess? He gets suspended. Campbell will look at Lapierre’s hit on Nichol and use the “repeat offender” term. I say he gets 3 games.
I don’t agree with it, just my guess.
That being said, everyone talks about the Cooke hit vs. Richards hit. But I like to think that Cooke’s hit was closer to Green’s hit (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-VKflDcBEY), one in which he got suspended for against Florida (3 games).
I find it interesting that Green’s hit hasn’t been brought up before. Also, Green is not a repeat offender and he got 3 games, but again Cooke got nothing.
It’s a lose-lose for the NHL, it sucks.
So we wait and see.
The largely unmentioned part of this is that Nichol was headed perpendicular to the boards and got crosschecked, while Campbell was approaching the boards at an angle, attempting a swing-around, and got pushed into them.
The anti-AO crowd will point to the Nichol incident, and the pro-AO crowd the Cooke/Richards precedents. At this point, honestly, all that’s left to do is wait for Colin Campbell to spin the Wheel of Justice and dish it out. Hopefully, Sid goes on a bit of a drought. I’d hate for something like this to cost our captain the Richard he’d otherwise likely earn.
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The From the Rink link has some good footage of the incident and the Lapierre/Nichols comparison is interesting. For my money, the Lapierre/Nichols hit looks worse as it is more squarely in the back than Ovechkin/Campbell.
"We are such fans of your music and all of your records. I'm not speaking of yours personally, but the whole genre of the rock and roll."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Mar 15, 2010 8:39 AM EDT reply actions
The thing I hadn’t previously realized about Lapierre/Nichols was that Nichols was trying to make a play on the puck. Nichols shoots, hits the crossbar, it bounces back at him, and he’s waving his stick at the puck.
I don’t know if it makes it OK that Lapierre was hitting a guy who was trying to take a shot at the time.
Atta dinnin stick a who!
by Gould Old Days on Mar 15, 2010 9:32 AM EDT up reply actions
It’s not like the puck is at Nichols’ feet though. The puck up in the air and he is looking for it over his right shoulder, which is turned away from the goal. It looks like it would have been played with a high stick anyway, so it’s not like Lapierre was trying to prevent a legit scoring opportunity. Maybe it mitigates it some, but not much IMHO.
"We are such fans of your music and all of your records. I'm not speaking of yours personally, but the whole genre of the rock and roll."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Mar 15, 2010 9:52 AM EDT up reply actions
How exactly is any of that relevant to a clear hit from behind? It doesn’t matter where the puck was.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
I don’t know if it makes it OK that Lapierre was hitting a guy who was trying to take a shot at the time.
I was responding to what GOD said, namely that Lapierre was trying to prevent Nichols from taking a shot on goal. It’s a penalty either way, but we were talking about the context of the play. If the puck is down at Nichols’ feet, one could argue that Lapierre was simply overzealous at attempting to stop a scoring opportunity. Since the puck is up in the air, it is harder to make that assertion.
"We are such fans of your music and all of your records. I'm not speaking of yours personally, but the whole genre of the rock and roll."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Mar 15, 2010 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions
Gotcha, I just think it’s irrelevant. If he hit him cleanly it wouldn’t matter to me if the puck was in the air or in his feet.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
Right, either way the location of the puck does not affect the legality of the hit. A hit from behind is a hit from behind, which is what I mentioned in my first comment about Ovechkin’s hit vs. Lapierre’s. GOD then mentioned that perhaps the fact that Nichols was trying to play the puck “makes it OK.” I took that to mean distinguishes between a cheap hit and a poorly executed hockey play. I never argued that it wasn’t a penalty.
"We are such fans of your music and all of your records. I'm not speaking of yours personally, but the whole genre of the rock and roll."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Mar 15, 2010 3:51 PM EDT up reply actions
Looks like suspend him just got a bit more likely. It’s been a rough month for the captain. Perhaps out for the southeast swing against Florida, Carolina and Tampa. Um, maybe he needed some rest for the playoffs. Yeah, I’ll keep telling myself that.
erskine has scored...now i can die in peace
by souldrummer on Mar 15, 2010 10:44 AM EDT up reply actions
What!?!?!?!?
I thought he was milking it? That link must be false. Surely he’s playing in the next game.
Campbell doesn’t milk it. He’s as tough as they come.
Let's go Caps!
by MikeL-Pivonka on Mar 15, 2010 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions
If they don’t suspend him, they will be a laughing stock for the double standard for superstars. If they do suspend him, they will be a laughing stock because Matt Cooke got zilch just a few days ago.
Gaaaaah! Matt Cooke got superstar double standard protection!!!! How can you possibly write those two sentences in a row? The NHL discipline just sucks. End of story.
And that MS Paint was brutal. What a freaking joke. I’m not even trying to defend the hit but that’s the worst way to condemn it. How can you actually call yourself a hockey fan and not understand the idea of “finishing a check”?
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
That MS Paint thing is running as a slideshow on the Chicago Bleacher Report so it looks all professional-like.
Now helping to keep an eye on all things Gr8 at Alex Ovetjkin.
Way to elaborate. I’m not talking about the boarding, which I clearly said I wasn’t defending. I’m talking about the “and Campbell clearly doesn’t have the puck!” crap. Or “Campbell moves the puck, the puck is not in play.” It’s the NHL, people finish checks and you get hit even after you move the puck. They are big boys. Any fan who has a clue can understand that part. If you want to have a discussion, let’s have a discussion.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
Sorry my bad dude
Not my intent to troll. But I was getting a terrible vibe reading the game threads and recaps yesterday from this site. I’ve lurked here for a while since the articles here are amazing. And I’ve read a bunch of your posts on FTR and your solid dude.
But that quote your picking is sort of unfair. You know what the writer meant. This situation is far from ideal as Cooke and thugs like him sully the act of hitting in the NHL. Cooke was fortunate that there was no explicit rule against his hit. Sure there is an intent to injure rule, but I fail to see how it can be exercised without it being blatantly obvious. There is a way to weasel your way out with a disingenuous explanation to the NHL wheel of justice wizard Colin Campbell.
Yet, Ovechkin threw a terribly timed push/check/nudge whatever you want to label it. Everyone knows he didn’t intend to injure 51, but its was a board. And when you play fast and loose (which makes him such an exciting player) you have to pay for the consequences of your actions. Unfortunately, for Ovechkin, there is a rule in the NHL rulebook against boarding. Adding to his misfortune is that his type of play results in him being caught in situation like the Gonchar, Gleason and Campbell ones. Although these situations were indeed unintentional, they provide a history of reckless behavior.
So does the NHL suspend a superstar who plays hard exciting hockey instead of a jokes like Cooke and Koci (He was on the Blackhawks, I am familiar with no-skill hackness)?
It’ll be a PR nightmare but he definitely should be. He fits the criteria worthy of a Campbell suspension:
1. He injured the checked/pushed player
2. He’s a repeat offender.
3. The "hit" was well publicized
4. Illegal hits are in the news
Obviously this position isn’t popular with the members of this blog, but he has a prior record of acting irresponsible. Luckily for 8, the NHL will never make an example the #1 or #1a face of the NHL.
You look around and guys like Toews, Datsyuk, Heatley, Iginla etc. play exciting phsyical hockey too without the boneheaded behavior of Ovie. That statement may sound unfair to you but I firmly believe it.
I’ve said it was a boarding PIM all along, I have no problem with him being called for that. I’ve also said he’s reckless in the past, so that’s not what I took issue with. My main problem with the Committed Indian post was that the still frame shots are misleading in that you lose the live-action context. I think the screen capture that “proves” it was a hit directly from behind is misleading. I’ve watched it several times and the full clip looks like AO gets Campbell on the back and side of the left shoulder, not square on the numbers. It’s a bad hit, but not as bad as the Lapierre hit, IMO. I also think the fact that Campbell toe picked is hugely important. Yes, AO should not have thrown that hit, but 99 times out of 100 (at least) nothing happens. Campbell’s skates stay flat on the ice and he just rides the momentum out and maybe puts his shoulder into the glass. And again, saying that the hit was illegal because Campbell didn’t have the puck is just stupid. AO was coming in hard on the forecheck and tried to finish his check. That’s what players are taught to do. We’ve all seen players get hit after moving the puck, and I’m sure Committed Indian has as well. If it was Dustin Brown, Cal Clutterbuck, or Ryan Callahan nobody would be as worked up about this. But it’s AO so the haters come out of the woodwork (not saying you’re specifically a hater, but the haters have fanned the flames on every one of his hits so now the ones like this get really blown out of proportion).
If they suspend AO on the heals of the Cooke and Gonchar decisions, that’s absolutely absurd. AO was at least attempting to make a legitimate hockey play. He didn’t throw his shoulder directly into a guy’s head. He didn’t leave his position to throw an elbow at a guy’s head (who didn’t have the puck). It went wrong, and he was punished. I think that’s enough. You may disagree, but I think it’s easy to say Cooke intended to injure. I actually think it’s much harder to say he didn’t intend to injure. He’s a pro hockey player who had a guy lined up and vulnerable; a guy that wasn’t looking so he wouldn’t dodge. He is trained to hit center mass but instead he squarely puts his shoulder on Savard’s head. That’s intent to injure. Nobody can convince me otherwise. Then you throw in the fact that Cooke has a long history of dirty play, and that he’s thrown basically an identical hit twice before, and it’s a no-brainer. I see AO play reckless sometimes, but I’ve only once seen him throw a hit that wasn’t an attempt at a legitimate hockey play (the one on Briere in his first or second season), or that was an attempt to take a guy’s head off. Basically the line I draw between AO and Cooke is that I still think AO is an honest player, while I have no doubt that Cooke is not an honest player, if that makes sense.
Toews, Datsyuk, Heater, Iginla are all great players and can be very exciting. But none of them are even close to as physical as AO. That’s one of the big problems with the whole debate. There isn’t another superstar that is as physical as AO. Chara? Pronger? Neither of those guys skate like AO so they don’t get into those high-speed collisions. They rack up their PIMs with dirty stick work and elbows in the corners. It’s just less sensational than how AO plays. Plus, D are supposed to be “mean crease-clearers” so it’s more acceptable. Maybe Phaneuf if you count him as a superstar (I don’t). AO plays the physical game like Callahan and Brown. Those guys all hit anything that moves, and that’s why they are exciting and fans love them. AO just happens to be a much better hockey player than those guys, so he gets much more attention. It’s just the reality of the situation. I’ve seen Brown and Callahan throw some brutally bad hits before, but I still love them as players and would do bad things to get them on the Caps.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
by Rob Parker on Mar 15, 2010 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
Two games.
Gaah. At least it’s only two, and it’s the Panthers and Hurricanes…
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Amazing how the two suspensions just happen to ensure that Ovechkin misses games against Florida, where Colin Campbell’s son plays… I’m not paranoid, but this has happened twice?
Just sayin’
Let's go Caps!
by MikeL-Pivonka on Mar 16, 2010 8:57 AM EDT up reply actions
I don’t know where else to post this, so I’ll try it here.
I haven’t seen anyone bring up the hit on Semin with 11:15 left in the 3rd.
It happens on the exact same spot on the ice. You can easily argue that Semin doesn’t see Brouwer coming to hit him from behind. He was leaning forward, at the goal line. Then Brouwer pushes him from behind, in the lower back. Semin crashes in, then gets up when he sees the refs aren’t going to call it.
I don’t know if you guys saw that, but I was furious in front of my computer while watching it, and watched it several times. They didn’t show the replay, so I didn’t get the chance to see different angles and slow-mo, but to me it was much worse than the Ovechkin hit, on the same spot, in the same game!
I’m actually surprised I didn’t see any big discussion on it (I haven’t gone through the almost 2000 comments though, and only finished watching the game an hour ago), so if you guys have the chance to see it again and tell me if I’m being too Caps-centric, and if how the hit on Semin is different. I don’t have the video of it, so if somebody can extract it and post it, the discussion will be easier.
I’m genuinely very interested to see if you guys saw this the same way I did.
I saw it live and didn’t like it but still haven’t seen a replay. I think that is exactly the problem. These kinds of dangerous hits happen all the time but only draw attention when someone gets hurt. I’d love to see a replay if anyone has one available.
Killer_Carlson and Steckel Me Elmo are like brothers to me. And when I say brothers I don't mean like actual brothers. I mean it like how black people use it, which is more meaningful, I think.
I’m sure it can be found on YouTube somewhere… someone has to have TiVo’d it…
Let's go Caps!
by MikeL-Pivonka on Mar 16, 2010 8:57 AM EDT up reply actions
Anyone mention this disturbingly awkward takedown of Crosby by Downie?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vsJtvXPhqXE
I’m sure cases could be made for both sides, intentional and unintentional, since it’s kind of hard to see full replays coming head on for the entire sequence. It seems to me like an intentional takedown that could have put Crosby out for the rest of the season, at least, but it turns out he was OK and I don’t think he embellished it. I haven’t heard a single mention of discipline on that play; I don’t even know if a penalty was called since it could have been interference at the very least. An intent to injure here seems quite apparent compared to OV’s hit, and Downie has more of a “repuation” than OV, I believe.
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Southeast Standings
| GP | W | L | OTL | PT | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
Florida
|
51 | 24 | 16 | 11 | 59 |
|
Washington
|
52 | 27 | 21 | 4 | 58 |
|
Winnipeg
|
54 | 24 | 24 | 6 | 54 |
|
Tampa Bay
|
51 | 23 | 23 | 5 | 51 |
|
Carolina
|
54 | 20 | 25 | 9 | 49 |
(updated 2.7.2012 at 3:17 AM EST)
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