Alzner Re-assigned
"The Washington Capitals have assigned defenseman Karl Alzner to the Hershey Bears of the American Hockey League (AHL), vice president and general manager George McPhee announced today." - Press Release
about 2 years ago
J.P.
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They could put Lidstrom with Erskine and they’d have to reassign Lidstrom to Hershey of the AHL.
by TylerG on Jan 6, 2010 2:43 PM EST reply actions 11 recs
hmm… per JP last week up/down posting, does anyone else think Alzner’s play is regressing? I just hope we don’t give him the Kolzig treatment and either play him in the NHL or flip him for a big fish.
No. This is what you should expect from a guy who’s learning the NHL, and learning to play it more aggressive.
Playing him more in the AHL accomplishes nothing wrt teaching him to read things at an NHL speed.
This is why I don’t like the Sloan signing. Further fucking reason to keep messing around with prospects who are NHL ready.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
by Whiter Mage on Jan 6, 2010 2:49 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Everyone:
Take a step back from the keyboard and consider the fact this won’t hurt him one bit. He’ll be back soon.
I am easily satisfied with the very best
The problem is it doesn’t help him, and they need to be accelerating his growth for the playoffs as much as they can.
Every game he spends in the AHL is a game of development lost, because at this point his development is learning how to react to NHL plays.
If George McPhee thought that this move wouldn’t help him, he wouldn’t have made it.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
For some reason I doubt that, at least partially. This could be the curse of the waiver exemption striking, at least temporarily.
The proof will be the circumstances of his next callup I suspect.
Well, obviously Pothier getting healthy has everything to do with the move. But his play has been suspect and perhaps they want to send him out west for some big minute/big responsibility games.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
That would make a whole lot of sense.
He’ll get top pairing in Hershey, with the requisite minutes.
I need a snappy signature...
He’s already done that. He has nothing left to prove there; and I’m not sure he has much left to learn from or grow there.
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
Then he can come back in 7 games when a D gets banged up.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
Maybe the D that are going to get banged up should be the depth guys, not Alzner.
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
That wouldn’t tear me up. Off topic, does the AHL play while the Olympic break is going on? If so, I’d rather see Alzner in Hershey while that’s going on, as well.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
He can always show up the Moose.
This is a big matchup for the Bears, a replay of last year’s Calder Cup finals. It may be seen by some in the League as a portent of things to come…
I need a snappy signature...
Last I saw Holtby was still in Hershey
by Doncosmic on Jan 6, 2010 8:34 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
His play has been suspect in what way? I can accept that maybe it has slipped a little from when he first came up (but I’m not even convinced that’s true) but I can’t accept that he’s not still one of the top 6 D the Caps have.
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
Badly misplayed a puck in San Jose, made a terrible decision last night. Not saying he’s making more bad decisions than his colleagues, but couple it with his moveability and it’s justifiable.
Don’t get me wrong – I’d rather see him here, now, full-time, etc.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
I don’t remember what play you are talking about last night, but the two goals that went in the net were on 1) Flash and 2) Poti. So it couldn’t have been that bad.
The play against SJS was not a good play, but let’s not ignore that Torry Mitchell is one of the fastest guys in the league. Sure, Alzner looked bad, but Shamo/Erskine wouldn’t have even been in the screen and that’s a breakaway goal.
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
He pinched in the neutral zone and it led to a two-on-one. Trust me – it was atrocious.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
If he’s not going to be allowed to make those kinds of rookie mistakes now, when will he be allowed to make them? He’s literally never going to develop at this rate.
Yeah, but unless it’s a confidence thing that doesn’t really give him anything he doesn’t already have. He’s already done what he does against AHL competition.
His play has been suspect, but it hasn’t come close to being as suspect as Erskine’s, and his decision making has still been better than Sloan’s on the whole I’d wager.
It’s just so darn confusing. If there was a roster spot left, then there’s little reason not to play him a bit more if only to keep Erskine and Sloan out of the lineup. If there wasn’t (due to the 3 goalies perhaps) then my confusion is somewhat quelled.
Unless one of those 3 goalies is on LTIR (not), then yes, it’s a roster spot thing to do with Pothier, more than it has anything to do with Sloan.
I need a snappy signature...
Regular IR, which Varly maybe couldn’t be on since he was assigned to Hershey, would do the trick. Cap space isn’t an issue here.
Just for reference, section 16.11.d of the CBA:
Once a Player is placed on the Injured Reserve List, the Club may replace said Player on its NHL Active Roster with another Player, and during such period of his designation as an Injured Reserve Player he will not count against the Club’s Active Roster limit, provided, however, that the Injured Reserve Player’s Player Salary and Bonuses and his replacement’s Player Salary and Bonuses are each included in calculating a Club’s Actual Club Salary and Averaged Club Salary, and the Players’ Share…
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 3:29 PM EST up reply actions
Alzner’s been overly aggressive in the past few games (including leaving Erskine and Neuvirth out to dry late in last night’s game); I originally thought maybe that was something Boudreau wanted. But coming into this year’s training camp, Alzner was talking about being more aggressive to make the NHL. So…
1. The Capitals want Alzner to add elements to his game, and he’s shown poor judgment at the NHL level, so they’re sending back to Hershey to concentrate on improving those elements at a slower game pace.
or…
2. Alzner has gotten it into his head that he has to play a specific way at the NHL level, when he’s been successful being Carlson’s safety net in Hershey, and he’s added too many hitches to his game to work out at the NHL level. The guy’s own worst enemy is the amount of over-thinking he does (remember the pregame rituals)?
Are we sure this isn’t another paper transaction? Otherwise he and carlson can compare gold medals in Manitoba.
IS KEPTIN NOW
Know what would help Alzner? Not pairing him with John fucking Erskine.
Of all our iniquities ignorance may be the worst
by Killer_Carlson on Jan 6, 2010 2:53 PM EST reply actions 11 recs
I can promise you that he won’t be paired with Erskine in Hershey.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
Not really. It’s not Erskine’s fault that Boudreau is throwing him out there in situations Erskine can’t handle any more than it is Erskine’s fault that Alzner is being sent down here. JE4 has NOTHING to do with this move except for his contract status compared to Alzner’s, and with Pothier coming back, BB and GMGM decided they wanted to keep Erskine in the line up. Also, I don’t think JE clears waivers.
I’m with you guys sending down Alzner is some shit, because there’s a guy named Sloan who’s been a fucking healthy scratch who should have been sent down first, but oh look, a new contract. Fuck Sloan.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
I wouldn’t say Erskine has nothing to do with the move, but it’s not his fault. I can’t help but think that Alzner’s development and play would be aided much more by not having to play with Erskine every night, but that is BB’s fault.
Of all our iniquities ignorance may be the worst
by Killer_Carlson on Jan 6, 2010 3:01 PM EST up reply actions
Alzner/Schultz is the best shutdown pair this organization can put together right now.
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
by Rob Parker on Jan 6, 2010 3:02 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
That’s my problem more than anything else. Boudreau knows how to coach, no doubt, but there’s been situations that he’s handled extremely poorly, most given to him by his GM (who you think would be on a constant line of communication). I’d include this ongoing Alzner saga, how to pair and scratch his d-men, the Nylander saga, the Kolzig saga, and the goaltending situation now. We’re winning, so it’s ok, but if we were struggling, I’d point the finger at Boudreau first.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
That last sentence is subject of a FanPost I’m working on, but for whatever reason SBN won’t let me post links in it.
"I know it holds 17 1/2 beers."
Why won’t it let you post links? It should work the same as linking in a comment.
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 3:11 PM EST up reply actions
It wasn’t letting me yesterday (or today), but I tried it at work, haven’t gotten the chance to do it from home yet.
"I know it holds 17 1/2 beers."
Strange. I would shoot support a quick email and let them know.
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 3:17 PM EST up reply actions
I don’t have a problem with the Kolzig saga. Kolzig wasn’t good enough to win us games and we needed to replace him to make the playoffs.
The Nyls thing is also not all on BB. He didn’t fit and we couldn’t unilaterally move him. Oh well.
Some of the goaltending stuff, and the D stuff for sure, pisses me off.
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
I’m not giving him the blame alone on the Nyls issue, and the Kolzig at the end saga was not his fault at all (How can you not play the hot hand). It was just stuff coming to mind all at once.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
I’m just trying to clarify what is and what isn’t BB’s fault.
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
You know what would help Alzner stay in the NHL? Being good enough to play with whatever partner he’s given.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
He’s been better than Erskine. Is that not good enough? That’s the issue. “Good enough” isn’t good enough when he’s waiver exempt, which means it’s not about the best team. That’s the problem.
If you wanna get on that train, Green > Schultz > Alzner > Pothier > Poti > Morrisonn > Erskine > Sloan. We can play the game all night, but contract wise, personnel wise, it makes zippy sense to waive Erskine. And who gives a damn about the best team right now when we can bank cap room, since the only time it matters to have the best team starts in April.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
Yeah, but Alzner making mistakes now makes him a better player in the playoffs. If they use that extra bit of cap room, fine. If they don’t this is wasted development time all because they can’t risk losing Sloan.
We wouldn’t lose Sloan, though. I’m almost positive you can send him down right now and he’s waiver exempt, and if he’s not, oh no, we’re going to lose SLOAN? And if we’re worried about how Alzner’s current development will significantly impact our playoff team, we’re fucked anyway.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
To further the point, the Caps are going to be Stanley cup contenders perhaps for the next decade. They will need to bring numerous rookies into the fold and develop them while doing so. That means allowing for mistakes here and there without sending them down every single time they do something wrong. Alzner’s development has been horribly handled thus far IMO.
He is good enough to play with whatever partner he’s given. What people take issue with is Alzner being punished for his partner’s mistakes. Can you really argue that Alzner isn’t one of the top 6 D in this organization?
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
No, but I can argue that Alzner and the Caps aren’t going to regress or be hurt in any way by him going back to Hershey for a couple weeks.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
It’s not regression. It’s progression. Alzner isn’t going to progress in the AHL like he will here. Playing Manitoba won’t get him more ready to play in the NHL playoffs than playing in the NHL (even if he makes mistakes) is going to do.
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
Right, but the team feels that the guys they have on the roster right now also need to play. I don’t know why we’re all brick-shitting over this shuffle. Kid will be back in two weeks probably.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
We’re all brick-shitting because that is what we do here on Japers’ Rink. Everything is a tragedy, and the world is coming to an end!
I need a snappy signature...
Oh no, something we don’t like! Let’s overreact! Welcome to Japers’ Rink.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
I really take exception to that. This isn’t CI. It’s adults talking… until someone makes it something else and then gets beaten down for it.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
You can, but it happens all the time. Pointing fingers at Erskine without bringing anything else into discussion about why it’s his fault bugs me, and it’d bug me if we were doing it to Sloan or Poti or anyone without bringing stats/facts into it. That’s the problem I have, and it happens more than I’d like.
Also if someone doesn’t have an avatar.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
But I was backing that up with Sloan can clear waivers and is the worst d-man on the roster. I was mad at people saying “Play with Erskine, get sent down” which has no real basis. And I’ve no love for someone who is a 14th forward and an 8th d-man and at the peak of his NHL career.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
I agree with this. We’re passionate but not ridiculous. People have guys they like, others disagree. We have awesome debates about it and that’s what makes this place great. To say we are just overreacters sells this place short.
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
by Rob Parker on Jan 6, 2010 3:30 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I think I’m overreacting to some people overreacting. I’m backing down.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
And this time you can’t hide your shame behind the ol’ “I’m just the coach” canard.
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
Hey, no. And honestly, while I do think it happens rarely, you don’t see me running away, and in the end, level headed conversation returns.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
Alternate tagline? Japers’ Rink: Where Level Heads Prevail.
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 3:36 PM EST up reply actions
I take what I say back. I’d like to change it to “Japers’ Rink – we can find something wrong with this, and debate it dead into the ground.”
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
I say if people want to debate it, let them debate it. If you don’t like it, duck out of the thread. The day after the Ovi-Gleason knee incident, this place went nuts. I got tired of it all, so I took a break from the Rink for a day. No harm, no foul.
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 4:46 PM EST up reply actions
I’m fine with people debating things dead to the ground. Hell, I do it. I’m not trying to be patronizing with that at all.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
Gotcha.
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 4:54 PM EST up reply actions
Been a weird day. Stress is a killer, and I sometimes I have no inhibitions to putting my foot in my mouth.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
Happens to all of us. There have been plenty of times where I wish I just wouldn’t have opened my mouth.
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 4:57 PM EST up reply actions
Happens to me most days around lunchtime.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
Nice to have you back in form. I was getting worried that you went all serious on us.
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 4:58 PM EST up reply actions
I have to get serious occasionally so that the squares can’t call me out for contributing nothing of substance to the board.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
Yeah, but when you do, it crashes the entire SBNation website.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
Not really. It’s largely reasonable discussion about something we all care about.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
I think we all are, because I [we] don’t think it is.
by DrinkingPartner on Jan 6, 2010 3:31 PM EST up reply actions
I think Alzner is a little bit like Erskine with far more upside. Both have gone from brilliant to culprit. I think he might fair well having a limited stint down in the AHL while the NHL lines get situated. I think Sloan will now need some ice time on account of his new contract and there are a lot of other questions in the defensive lineup. I’d prefer it if Alzner is down getting the most ice time possible in the AHL rather than being on the 3rd line up here getting zippy time.
Alzner is nothing like Erskine.
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
I can’t think of a time when I would even have considered Erskine to be brilliant. Well… there was that experimental phase in college…
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 3:14 PM EST up reply actions
Alzner is like Erskine in that both have an e,r, and n in their names. After that…
"I know it holds 17 1/2 beers."
They’re both Canadian too.
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 3:43 PM EST up reply actions
Alzner is like Erskine like 1 is to 6.75.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
by Whiter Mage on Jan 6, 2010 3:43 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
You know something is wrong with your post when six people replied and none of them told you to get an avatar.
by sixsevenfiftysix on Jan 6, 2010 3:33 PM EST up reply actions 8 recs
Manitoba?
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 3:43 PM EST up reply actions
Was actually shooting for Hershey, didn’t take in account the next opponent they had.
"That's hockey. You never know what's going to happen. It's a tough sport. No tooth, a broken nose, but I'm looking good [laughs]." - The GR8
Yeah I know. Just messin’.
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 7, 2010 7:45 AM EST up reply actions
This is Bullshit
The only possible way to quell my current outrage is to bring up a True American Hero. I still would probably disagree, but at least I’d do it with a beaming smile. But in reality this is just going to get Ty Sloan and John Erskine into the lineup more often. Ridiculous.
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
… and Pothier. Which is actually good. But yeah.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
Right, but Alzner wasn’t keeping Potsy out, the broken rib was. I have no problem with Potsy playing (until he needs his inevitable benching) but even with Potsy Alzner shouldn’t be the odd man out.
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
Alzner’s the one who can be sent down without being subjected to waivers…
I need a snappy signature...
But Sloan is still on the squad. That says a lot right there.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
this actually is when Sloan is valuable. Stick him in the press box for nights on end. If Alzner isn’t going to play for whatever reason, send him down.
But the team is better with all defensemen healthy having Sloan in Chocolatetown with Erskine in the press box and Alzner playing, sitting Pothier against the big bruising teams.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
One night he drinks diet coke in the press box, the next day Mountain Dew …
by Fehrskine on Jan 6, 2010 3:02 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
Must be trying to get erskine and shamo in the lineup more so he can move them? But with pothier back best case they sit every other night. Can only hope that alzner is back soon so he can resume moving up the NHL learning curve.
by realityczech on Jan 6, 2010 3:10 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
sitting back and thinking about it, i would have to agree with this theory. That is; 3 of the 6 defensemen we’re playing now are probably being showcased. This theory also gets my mind spinning that there will be a move sooner than later to not want to leave Alzner in Her too long? Go get Neidermayer already!
That is; 3 of the 6 defensemen we’re playing now are probably being showcased.
Which three? Mo, Erskine, and Pothier?
Those are three d-men who are hard to shop, even if you want to make a trade of one of them. All three really make a bit more than their skill sets are worth in the NHL, and the one who looks like he has the most upside has the downside of he’s one big hit away from his NHL career being over. I agree that we may need to move another d-man, but it’s going to be hard to do.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
I think you keep Pothier unless you are ready to bring up JC. He’s played decent this year and we need a puckmover aside from Green. I think you try to shop Shamo and Erskine, but at somepoint you have to give up on this. You don’t waive them b/c might as well keep them incase of injury, but you got to get the Karlzner up to continue learning.
Playing time!!
I think it comes down to the fact that there are still 8 Dmen, including alzner, up and playing for Washington. With pothier coming back, why are we benching him when he can play all he wants in the ahl, even though i think he should be playing up here and it is doing him absolutely no good playing for the bears. The bottom line is though; Alzner is the only one that doesn’t need to clear waivers.
Stop it, George. Just, seriously stop doing this. Are you trying to make it possible for him to qualify for rookie of the year in 10-11? Are you trying to force the other D-men (6 of whom Karlzner is better than) to step up their game to see who he doesn’t replace? For God’s sake, stop sending him down and keep him on the freaking team! You lost nights of sleep and finally unloaded Nylander so you could keep him up here for good, so STOP SENDING HIM DOWN. I don’t care if ShoMo or Tom Poti don’t clear waivers. Poti can’t clear the puck to save his own life, so why should we care if he doesn’t clear waivers? Let some other team have him knocking own-goals in, just stop it, George! Have I made my point!? Oh, and bring Carlson up and have him wear a big American Flag cape.
by thebigfoist on Jan 6, 2010 3:15 PM EST reply actions 6 recs
I like the passion behind this comment.
Game-Over Green? Canada-Over Carlson!
by Scott in Shaw on Jan 6, 2010 3:20 PM EST up reply actions
Poti is one of the mentors that’s going to help the two young guys learn how to play the game at this level.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
Which explains the continuing lack of discussion about acquiring defensive help.
"I know it holds 17 1/2 beers."
Put it this way, if Poti is that effective mentor to the backliners, then why get ANOTHER defenseman, like Niedermayer, or Hamhuis, or Seabrook?
Or the alternate question could be why is Poti a mentor when neither of the two guys mentioned are even up here to learn right now?
"I know it holds 17 1/2 beers."
Because he’s also a good player.
And we want those other d-guys because they’re fucking great players that could help this team as well.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
It must be his awesome penalty killing or his solid health over the last two years, but as a Poti fan, I’m losing faith by the month.
"I know it holds 17 1/2 beers."
Then fire Bruce for giving him the most PK time of any defender, and fire McPhee for signing him.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
You’re building this up pretty high. You might fall victim to expectations. :)
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
Then I’ll get sent down to Hershey when a veteran gets extended.
"I know it holds 17 1/2 beers."
by Bald Pollack on Jan 6, 2010 3:59 PM EST up reply actions 4 recs
the most PK time of any defender
More like the most PK time of any player on the team by far.
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 3:55 PM EST up reply actions
Wasn’t positive, went with the safe bet.
It’s hard to work and look up stats and Z through three posts.. heh.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
I’ve actually looked at the PK BtN stats a good deal, so it’s just something I remember. Sadly, I can’t lobby for Juice’s PK production anymore.
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 4:05 PM EST up reply actions
It’s interesting… playing what is supposedly the “same system,” Hershey’s PK is quite successful, while the Caps’ isn’t. And yet the same people (Steckel and Poti), keep getting all the PK ice time.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
NHL offenses are better than AHL ones? Possible explanation, who knows.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
Yeah, but AHL PKers and goalies should be worse than their NHL counterparts.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
But I’m saying a system could enhance an AHL PK more than an NHL one due to the strength of opposition. It makes sense in my brain, but maybe not through my texts.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
I’m not really following your logic. I guess all I’m saying is that Boudreau keeps playing the same guys over and over again, using the same PK system, then we all wonder why our PK is mediocre.
If the system seems to work down in Hershey, or if we can’t play a more aggressive PK because of the limitations of our PK personnel, perhaps it’s time to rethink our PK personnel?
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
See below comment: I think it’s the system, not the personnel.
by DrinkingPartner on Jan 6, 2010 4:09 PM EST up reply actions
See F&B’s PK breakdown.
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 4:10 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
IIRC the point was that the Caps don’t pressure enough on the PK, but I inferred that it was unclear whether this was purely BB’s system, or whether it was partly influenced by personnel limitations.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
Right, I threw it out there because it was topical.
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 4:17 PM EST up reply actions
Pretty much. Very passive, hesitant to use skill players. To the extent that we have skill players that can do it I blame BB but I do think that we have a limited supply of guys with defensive hockey sense and offensive skills so there is a personnel limitation aspect.
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
i argued this the other day when we were talking about BBs kill. I wanted tighter points because NHLers are a shit-ton faster than AHLers. In the N, even Ovechkin is going to have trouble getting to the point to make a play if he’s starting from around the hash marks. If they play tighter, they’ve got less space to make up and therefore have a better chance of actually stifling a play from the point.
But BB don’t play dat way.
by DrinkingPartner on Jan 6, 2010 4:08 PM EST up reply actions
But how much of that is determined by playing Steckel and Laing on the PK?
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
I fucked up. I meant even up. i don’t like BBs standard 5-on-5 staggered Point thing that he employs. It seems to depend on superior speed in his wingers, which, while true, isn’t enough to eclipse NHL speed on the other side of the puck.
My bad.
by DrinkingPartner on Jan 6, 2010 4:21 PM EST up reply actions
Our PKers are lower quality compared to the rest of the league than Hershey’s are compared to theirs.
We don’t have anyone with Joudrey’s mobility and defensive prowess (if only Boyd were healthy and had more upside).
Poti a mentor
= SCARY
Keep Carlson the hell away from that guy! His propensity to suck at clearing the biscuit from the dZone is like cancer. Remember last year when the Caps went through that phase of giving away free PPs to their opponents via delay of game antics? I call that the Poti effect. Shit, there were more than a few moments during last night’s WJC gold medal game when I felt Poti’s disturbing presence … specifically when Yanks started playing like the man himself late in the third period. I’m pretty sure Killer_Carlson, F+B and anyone else that watched the game live can attest to that.
"Bobby. Can you fly, Bobby?" -Clarence
"Clarence, no!" - Bobby
Ugh. So we have a decade of failed PK clears and bad pinches to look forward too. Awesome.
On second thought, maybe we should keep our American Hero in HER until Tom Poti is far away from here.
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
The only thing I can think of is that there’s no roster spot left. Varly obviously wasn’t on IR while in Hershey, and maybe they don’t want to put him on in case he’s ready to play soon.
That’s all I got.
ooooo, you might be on to something. Maybe the Caps want Varly and Alzner to be roomates forever so if one is down in Hershey, the other must go for comfort.
As was discussed in the Sloan thread, he is very much protected in waivers by his spanking new contract.
Send Sloan down, keep Alzner up and give him tomorrow off. Then this weekend give Erskine the night off and rotate through that way. You don’t have to scratch the same guy every night. If Karl is suffering with the NHL game, practicing against Ovie, Semin, Backis is better than him getting 26 minutes in Western Canada.
Sounds completely logical to me. There should be no fear of putting Sloan on waivers. I doubt he gets claimed, and if he does, I wouldn’t be too concerned.
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 3:21 PM EST up reply actions
Should be fun when Mackan is getting sent back and forth in three years because keeping him on would expose Quentin Laing to waivers. Gah.
by Kolzilla on Jan 6, 2010 3:22 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
That’s assuming Laing is still here in three years.
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 3:32 PM EST up reply actions
And Fehr gets some candy and a gift certificate to Bennigan’s.
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 3:38 PM EST up reply actions 2 recs
I can’t wait until Alzner is subject to waivers…
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
by J.P. on Jan 6, 2010 3:25 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
Why do we (maybe i’m putting words in your mouth) care less about possibly losing Sloan to waivers than losing Ray Smith’s son? Is it as simple as saving an asset from waivers is less important now (Sloan/Alzner) than it was when Bourque was subject too it?
Because he’s younger, more upside, and downright better in some respects.
It’s the perception of one as a prospect and the other as a utility man that’s not actually that useful. Maybe it’s an unfair perception, but it’s one that many probably shared at the time (if not still have).
I agree with this. At the time, CBo seemed to have not gotten enough NHL opportunities or maybe not the right ones. Plus, he is/was still a kid.
And it was the fucking Penguins.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
I think that last part was really key. I would have cared a lot less if it was Edmonton, or even Tampa. But Pittsburgh?
Although the sheer hilarity of the anti-CBo ranting on Penguins blogs made it all worth it.
The Swedish equivalent of Tom Poti should feel shame.
I don’t know who this “we” is but I wasn’t/am not one of them. I didn’t care about the waiving of CBo and I’d feel the same way if Sloan were to be waived.
A man gotta have a code
I think there was a reasonable backlash to the outpouring of Bourque-love after he was waived. However, to claim that he’s equivalent to Sloan is pushing it a bit far. He’s still young and he’s put up impressive numbers down in Hershey. Plenty of players don’t stick during their first few cups of coffee in the NHL. . . sorta like Karl Alzner. :)
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
Bourque is a significantly less-young (read: older) player to still not be sticking after his cups.
by DrinkingPartner on Jan 6, 2010 3:57 PM EST up reply actions
Wait. If I could delete a comment, I would. I have no idea what I was getting at, there.
by DrinkingPartner on Jan 6, 2010 3:58 PM EST up reply actions
The fact that there was a backlash itself seems to be unreasonable for a guy, who even his lobby have to admit, will amount to at best a 3rd line winger in the NHL. A position that isn’t exactly hard to fill relative to other positions in the league. Then again rationality and logic are not strong suits of the CBo lobby IMO.
A man gotta have a code
I find that the people who most frequently denigrate Bourque are also people who never saw him play in Hershey. The kid was an absolute buzzsaw down there, particularly in the playoffs.
Also, if speedy 3rd-line wingers who play aggressively were so easy to come by, why’d we just trade our captain and a decent defenseman for one?
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
Giroux is a buzzsaw in hershey too. Doing it in the “A” is one thing, but not everyone who does it there can make the jump. He did little up in DC and even less with the Pens.
Speedy, small 3rd line winger I might add. We just trade our leftovers for Chimera, a much larger guy, not 2 good players. Had Chimera been a stay at home d-man, scorer, decent center, etc. he’d have cost much more.
A man gotta have a code
I don’t think you’ve ever seen a Bears game if you’d describe Giroux as a “buzzsaw.” Giroux is the exact same player in Hershey that he is in DC – big and slow with a decent eye for offensive positioning. The difference for Giroux is that in Hershey, his shots beat the crappy goalies and his lack of speed is exposed less often.
The qualities that Bourque displayed in Hershey (skating speed, ice vision, defensive responsibility, tenacity, “hockey smarts,” and a quick release) are all qualities that translate well to the NHL.
Yes, 3rd-line forwards aren’t terribly hard to come by, but cost-controlled 3rd-line forwards are much more valuable.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
Yes, 3rd-line forwards aren’t terribly hard to come by, but cost-controlled 3rd-line forwards are much more valuable.
I’ll concede on the cost controlled part. A guy like Bourque you can get for half the cost of a similar vet assuming Bouque can actually hack it and produce, which I don’t think he can.
The qualities that Bourque displayed in Hershey (skating speed, ice vision, defensive responsibility, tenacity, "hockey smarts," and a quick release) are all qualities that translate well to the NHL.
Well it hasn’t done so yet. What makes you think more time in the AHL is going to make it do so?
A man gotta have a code
I saw him play in Hershey. I denigrate him all the time. But you’re right, he was an absolute buzzsaw…in Hershey. Among AHL players. He could evolve, he’s still young, but I’ve never seen him be able to take that same energy and attack and make it effective at the NHL level.
Plus, he’s not meant to be a speedy 3rd-line winger. He’s not skilled enough to play on the top two lines of this skill level (as he proved in Pitt) but it’s where he should be on teams with less skill.
Or, you know…in the AHL.
Pens system <> Caps system. Bourque earned a spot in the lineup these past two preseasons and never got a shot to show whether there was something there. Very tough to judge what he actually has either way.
He got a sweater in reg. season games for both teams and did nothing to distinguish himself. I normally understand why people like guys who I don’t think cut the mustard or won’t down the road. This is one I’ll never get. I swear its his name.
A man gotta have a code
Yeah, but those were late in the season with very limited minutes/crappy linemates.
I would have loved to see him get a stretch in the role that Chimera now has (speedy 3rd liner). There were times when it would have made sense (Clark deserving to be on the 4th line) but now it’s less likely.
Yeah, but those were late in the season with very limited minutes/crappy linemates.
He’s going to be a 3rd or 4th winger. That’s what he’s going to get many nights – limited minutes and linemates who aren’t the cream of the crop. He’s not going to get paired with Ovi and Baks.
A man gotta have a code
Yeah, but that doesn’t give you much from an evaluation point of view.
You want to see something from him, try him on the 3rd line. Give him a game or 3 and see if anything translates.
It may be that they don’t care either way at this point.
Caps and Pens gave the kid a shot. Not sure what you want. He’s not going to take time from players who are better than he is. NHL is not a developmental league.
A man gotta have a code
As I said, there were times when it would have made sense to try him in that role if we’d had him at the time. Heck, any game Giroux played could have gone to Bourque. Those times appear to be past those since Chimera’s here (although if he proves to have less O than we thought, maybe…)
I’m not saying they should have bent over backwards for him, I’m saying he earned a better look with this team/this system than he got.
The Caps gave him about the same NHL shot than Fleischmann had in 05-06. Flash put up 2 assists and was -2 in 14 games that year. Would you be OK had we waived him then?
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
I think Flash would have been waiver exempt back then.
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 4:51 PM EST up reply actions
Heh, yeah. The point remains valid.
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 4:52 PM EST up reply actions
Would you like to have Scott Walker from 4 years ago on the roster? Or what about Chad LaRose? Or what about a guy like Alex Burrows? Or Vernon Fiddler?
All undersized guys who did very little in the NHL until someone gave them a chance. Now they’re all pretty valuable pieces to their teams. I’m sure I could find more examples given time, but you get my drift. Losing someone that could potentially become that kind of piece for nothing is just silly.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
Understood. I feel there are a ton of guys you could put in that category. That was my point. 3rd line grit guys with some scoring ability are easier to find than other positions.
I’d take Fiddler out of that mix because his skill set is a bit different. His faceoff skills are excellent.
Trust me, I love smaller guys who make it. I’m shorter than Chris. It’s one of the reason I always followed Cliff Ronning’s career.
A man gotta have a code
I guess I defend him more stridently in part because we’re of similar stature, and in part because I think he can be a valuable contributor in the NHL if given the right role. The guy’s skills ought to translate to the NHL. That they haven’t yet is mildly surprising to me.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
I love it when people trot out the name argument. If Bourque were the exact same player in every respect, but 6’2" instead of 5’8", he’d be in the NHL by now.
His name doesn’t help him nearly as much as his stature hinders him.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
Not disputing his size hurts him. I mentioned it above. But how else do you explain the love around here for at best a borderline NHL player. His charm?
A man gotta have a code
His speed and hockey sense. When I watched him in Hershey, it wasn’t just that he was faster than the other players, it was that he knew where the play was going a full second or so before everyone else around him. He had an uncanny knack for being where the play was going before it got there.
He also has a very, very hard shot which he gets off quickly. Unfortunately, it’s inaccurate as all hell, but that’s why Hershey used him on the PP point last year.
Also, despite his size, he plays a physical game and isn’t afraid to take the body against bigger players.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
I find that the people who most frequently denigrate Bourque are also people who never saw him play in Hershey.
Most people never saw him in HER, so the people that support him probably mostly didn’t even see him in HER I’d bet.
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
I didn’t really care either to be honest. I thought of Bourque as the player he proved himself to be in his time with Pitt. The issue I took with having to waive Bourque was that is was lousy asset management, they essentially were forced into losing someone because they didn’t have another choice.
This smacks of the same poor asset management, only in the exact reverse. Rather than keeping a guy up that would benefit from NHL exposure, they hang onto the guy who has to clear waivers (seemingly) to protect him from it.
The problem with this line of reasoning is that it would lead to waiving/giving up on all sorts of players who turn out to be valuable. If Boudreau had 1/4 the man-crush on Bourque that he has for Flash, the guy would probably still be here and would be skating a minute or two on the PP every night.
Maybe Bourque turns into nothing, maybe he becomes a serviceable 3rd-liner. But deciding that, at age 23 with all of 12 NHL games to his credit (pre-Pens) that he wasn’t worth anything is a bit premature.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
I agree with you.
Losing Bourque wasn’t giving up on him, it was lousy management because they lost him for nothing and wanted to keep him. While they risk losing Sloan on the waiver wire, from my perspective, that seems like a worthwhile risk in order to keep Alzner playing with the big club, if only in a limited role and during practice.
It makes me laugh that people are still talking about the “poor asset management” after McPhee was vindicated, and the Caps ended up not actually losing anything after all.
Atta dinnin stick a who!
by Gould Old Days on Jan 6, 2010 4:46 PM EST up reply actions
I think vindicated is a stretch, since Sloan didn’t really prove to be that much more valuable either way.
You could equally argue that he got lucky (if you wanted to play devil’s advocate that is) /ducks
I prefer to think he accurately assessed Bourque’s talent.
Atta dinnin stick a who!
by Gould Old Days on Jan 6, 2010 4:51 PM EST up reply actions
That’s all ex post. Sometimes GMGM is vindicated, sometimes he isn’t. Before the move it’s just poor form to lose a guy that you spent 5 years developing for nothing. This one worked out alright. So far Angus hasn’t. Thems the breaks. What’s important is establishing a consistent and reliable pattern of asset management that maximizes the talent on your team. Losing CBo for nothing certainly did not do that.
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
I still think losing a UFA who can’t cut in in the NHL on a waiver claim in his walk year isn’t “poor asset management”
the alternative was keeping Bourque on the roster or trading him. Knowing what you know now, would you have kept Bourque on the NHL roster from September until now? Do you know anyone who would have given anything for him in a trade?
Losing nothing for nothing ain’t bad asset management.
Atta dinnin stick a who!
by Gould Old Days on Jan 6, 2010 7:22 PM EST up reply actions
Right or wrong, Bourque was a 2nd round draft pick that the organization had spent years developing and was, at the very least, a key cog for their AHL franchise. The team certainly intended to start the year with him in Washington. This was a mistake on the part of the GM and the Caps’ salary-cap guru(s).
The proof of their goof is the fact that they snatched him right back up again the instant Pittsburgh put him on waivers.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
I still simply don’t get this line of thought.
What value should McPhee have preserved? Who would have traded for him? What would the Caps have gotten? How was an NHL asset damaged? How would this year’s playoff roster be better if Bourque hadn’t been waived when he was? How would next year’s roster be better?
The team got in a salary cap crunch. Looking ahead, they knew they’d be adding a forward off injured reserve in the near future, and they had to waive someone. They picked Bourque over Sloan. In retrospect, I’m not sure either choice would have been much better than the other, but more than anything I don’t see how either of them is all that much of an “asset” to be “managed.” We’re talking about players who were due to be UFAs this coming summer…
Atta dinnin stick a who!
by Gould Old Days on Jan 7, 2010 12:02 AM EST up reply actions
Even a mid-round pick is better than nothing. If they could get that for Lepisto they could get it for CBo. The problem with CBo was that they miscalculated and thought they’d be able to keep him, then got backed into a corner with no leverage.
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
Even a mid-round pick is better than nothing. If they could get that for Lepisto they could get it for CBo. The problem with CBo was that they miscalculated and thought they’d be able to keep him, then got backed into a corner with no leverage.
I think you’re all crazy.
McPhee waived a non-NHL caliber player in his UFA walk year to get him to the minors (where he currently belongs). Y’all would have preferred that he’d traded Bourque for a 5th or 6th round pick, so we could have another Brett Flemming in the org. Fine.
I think they took the right risk at the right time, and history proves it. The Pens held a non-NHL caliber player on their roster for a couple of months, paid his salary for us, and then the Caps got him back. And now he’s back where he belongs. (Caps also waived Aucoin and Giroux, two other AHL UFAs at around the same time, but nobody’s screaming “asset management” about that.)
OK, so we disagree about whether McPhee handled it optimally. But the bigger question is, “who the fuck cares?” It was an AHL-caliber UFA in his walk year! That ain’t much of an asset…
Atta dinnin stick a who!
by Gould Old Days on Jan 7, 2010 9:36 AM EST up reply actions
Pop Quiz
Everyone always bitches about the name recognition factor. Fine. Here’s another pop quiz:
Player A was a top-35 draft pick who put up 17 points in 63 games as a 23-year old. His team didn’t offer him a contract and let him walk.
Player B was undrafted, and put up 26 points in 25 games as a 23-year old. After a mediocre 18 points in 56 NHL games the next year, his organization also let him walk.
Player C was a top-35 pick, and put up 73 points in 69 games as a 23-year old, but struggled in limited NHL stints. His team lost him to waivers, only to pick him back up again.
Tell me, of A, B, and C, which would you feel worst about losing for “nothing?”
First person to guess who each player is gets. . . my undying admiration.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
Well C. is obviously C-Bo.
A. I was guessing was Eminger. But it doesn’t fit your 63 games.
B I don’t have a clue on.
Not only is the universe stranger than we imagine, it is stranger than we can imagine.
Yeah, C’s pretty easy. The other two will be harder. I’ve gotta hold off until F&B gets a chance.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
Funny thing is Eminger fits all you other qualifications except the ammount of games.
Not only is the universe stranger than we imagine, it is stranger than we can imagine.
Perhaps I should have included him…
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
Eminger, drafted 12th overall, 17 points as a 23 yo in 68 games, organization basically let him walk and disregarded him.
Not only is the universe stranger than we imagine, it is stranger than we can imagine.
Yeah, but they traded Eminger. When I say, “let walk,” I mean they didn’t sign the guy as a free agent.
That’ll probably narrow A&B down somewhat.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
BAH!! I just noticed an error of omission:
All stats are AHL unless otherwise noted.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
No, but you’re getting closer. Also, Brule was traded, not let go as an FA.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
Like I said to Zeph, gotta give F&B a chance.
I’ll give you one hint – Caps fans are intimately familiar with both players.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
You could at least look it up before throwing a name at the wall =]
Not only is the universe stranger than we imagine, it is stranger than we can imagine.
Ok, nobody got it.
Player A is David Steckel, who the Kings let walk and we signed.
Player B is Martin St. Louis, who the Flames let walk and Tampa picked up.
Think both those teams would like to have a “do-over” on those moves?
Sometimes its OK to give up on younger players – we’re all fairly sure that not signing Sasha Pokulok isn’t going to haunt us – but giving up on a 23-year old player putting up more than a point per game in the AHL, just because you couldn’t fit him under $75k of cap room (so you could keep Tyler Sloan), is bad asset management.
Bourque Player C could yet turn into a useful player. Tyler Sloan is Tyler Sloan.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
I was going to say St. Louis, but it seemed way too obvious.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
Chris Bourque ain’t Marty St. Louis.
Atta dinnin stick a who!
by Gould Old Days on Jan 7, 2010 9:29 AM EST up reply actions
The point is, NOBODY IN CALGARY THOUGHT MARTY St. LOUIS WAS MARTY St. LOUIS when they let him go.
You keep comparing Chris Bourque to older AHL vets. The kid is 23. When Flash was 23, he sucked at the NHL level. Bet you’re glad we didn’t give up on him. Steckel was a scrub that couldn’t break onto the Kings’ roster. The Kings SUCKED when they let him go. For nothing.
Even if you don’t think he was ever going to do anything in the NHL, there were likely opportunities to trade him for something, anything, in return. For example, coming off his good season and post-season last year, I could see the Caps making a Lepisto-like trade of Bourque during the summer. I’m guessing he fetches. . . maybe a fourth-rounder. Some fourth rounders turn into nothing, but a decent percentage of them turn into something.
A chance at something, even if low, is still better than nothing. Even if you think that Bourque had no future in the organization.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
A is Dave Steckel. B I’ll guess Brooks Laich but I don’t think that’s right.
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
Yeah. A was Stecks. I just think it’s silly to give up on players at age 23 because they “haven’t produced” in a handful of NHL games. The cost of keeping them is so minimal…
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
I don’t know who this "we" is but I wasn’t/am not one of them.
I’m confused as to where you are getting this “we” from. I didn’t use that word anywhere in my post.
The Swedish equivalent of Tom Poti should feel shame.
It’s a sweet sig.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
F&B said it in regards to some poor junior from Sweden. I found it strangely funny.
The Swedish equivalent of Tom Poti should feel shame.
Great, now I gotta see the blind Poti hate every time you post.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
I’ll change it in a couple of days. mostly the way it was phrased was amusing
The Swedish equivalent of Tom Poti should feel shame.
Easy. Sloan is a player who has probably reached the peak of his NHL career. He is cheaply replaced, and easily is the worst defenseman on the team, and has been sitting in the press box for some time. Bourque was lost because we weren’t able to keep him due to a salary cap issue, and losing him because we were against a salary cap wall with 4.5 million just kind of chilling, it was horseshit. If we’d have lost Bourque because it meant we could put th best possible team on the ice, tough, but that’s a better reason.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
NO POTI IS THE WORSET D MAN
/Rink’d
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
Again, half-joking. This is a reasonable place, I just think Poti’s getting unfairly skewered a hell of a lot lately.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
Agreed to some degree; last night was arguably one of his better ones since the Colorado/Alberta trip.
"I know it holds 17 1/2 beers."
Easily one of his better ones. He was bebopping and jiving all over the place.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
It was probably one of his single best games during his entire Washington tenure.
The Swedish equivalent of Tom Poti should feel shame.
Poti hasn’t been the same since he injured his shoulder. He’s not taking slap shots really anymore, and he’s just not winning puck battles like he could. I don’t think his shoulder healed all the way, and I’m not saying he’s still hurting, I’m just saying it’s changed him.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
I haven’t seen Poti take a slap shot in ages. When did he hurt his shoulder? Last year?
by DrinkingPartner on Jan 6, 2010 4:05 PM EST up reply actions
I thought it was his first year here. Didn’t he score in his first game (or one of his first) here on a slapshot?
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
Poti didn’t score for over half the season that first year, unless you’re talking preseason (in which case I don’t remember).
The Caps don’t use the D very much for point shots during 5-on-5 play, I think.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
Really? That’s not something I’ve noticed. I’ll have to keep an eye out for it.
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 4:12 PM EST up reply actions
I don’t know if that’s a team thing or it’s just that nobody on the Caps can shoot effectively from the point.
Schultz doesn’t have the power, Erskine and ShaMo are too inaccurate, Poti has these issues, Alzner doesn’t have power and would rather look for a bounce off the boards. That leaves Green and Pothier.
I think Schultz is getting better slowly. He may even start hitting the net by next fall!
by DrinkingPartner on Jan 6, 2010 4:14 PM EST up reply actions
We don’t use our D for big slap shots from the point, except for Green that usually moves in before he shoots anyway. I would like to see some of our D, especially guys without great power, like Schultz, take nice, controlled, easily deflected shots just wide of the goal, so guys like Flash, Fehr, Laich, Steckel, and Knuble could redirect them on goal. We almost never see a planned redirect attempt unless it is just hitting someone who gets in the way while screening.
by HateOffSeason on Jan 6, 2010 4:35 PM EST up reply actions
I would like to see some of our D, especially guys without great power, like Schultz, take nice, controlled, easily deflected shots just wide of the goal, so guys like Flash, Fehr, Laich, Steckel, and Knuble could redirect them on goal.
Agreed. This is one of the things I liked about Alzner’s game. He seemed very willing and able to put the puck on net and get it through.
I think Schultz is getting better slowly. He may even start hitting the net by next fall!
Of the six Caps defensemen who’ve played at least 20 games on D (seven if you count Jurcina), only one gets more shots on net per miss than Schultz.
Highest Corsi among blueliners as well. No doubt because of Green.
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 5:05 PM EST up reply actions
Speaking of which, Karl had an absolutely phenomenal point shot 5v5 last night, to go along with a couple of great outlet passes. Maybe that’s why they’re demoting him?
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
They should do this more. And actually, I think I saw a few more last night than usual, and was happy about it.
Game-Over Green? Canada-Over Carlson!
by Scott in Shaw on Jan 6, 2010 4:19 PM EST up reply actions
You rang?
"Oh, the usual. I bowl. Drive around. The occasional acid flashback."
by The Ghost of Bebop on Jan 6, 2010 4:03 PM EST up reply actions
The guy is an NHL vet that gets paid 3.5 million a year because of his offensive prowess, then he gets an up arrow because he had a two assist week. Yeah, that’s living up to expectations.
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
I won’t go so far as to say the guy sucks, but clearly, with what he’s making and with his expectations, he’s certainly not been the player we thought we were getting.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
And just like I hold Semin to high standards because of his skill and salary, I’ll do it with Poti.
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
you’re jut biased against Poti! You’d be a much better commentator I you presented each “bad” Poti fact with a “good” Poti fact, no matter how many shitty clearly attempts he has each game.
The Swedish equivalent of Tom Poti should feel shame.
I’m just trying to get him all fired up and increase his post count. ‘Cause I’m a nice girl like that.
The Swedish equivalent of Tom Poti should feel shame.
It’s the midwest in you.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
Wild-ass theory: Caps call up John Carlson within the next few days to reward him for clutch play in WJC. Carlson sticks on the roster for a week or two. And then he’s back in Hershey and Alzner heads back to DC. And in the meantime, the Caps bank a few more dollars against the cap.
Here, check this out:
http://www.capgeek.com/tracker/
See any legitimate Cup contenders with more cap space than the Caps? The Kings for sure. The Avalanche, maybe. Every dollar matters, and come March we may be praising the $9000 a day saved here and there when it brings us some serious players.
Atta dinnin stick a who!
I don’t think they’re Cup contenders, but they might make it to the second round. (heck, and I don’t even like ‘em, but they’re good this season)
The Swedish equivalent of Tom Poti should feel shame.
I’m not buying the Kings as a legit cup contender while they sit in the same division as San Jose.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
Offense? Kopitar, Smyth — check.
Defense? Doughty, O’Donnell, Johnson, Scuderi, Greene — check.
Goaltending? Quick — check.
I think the Kings are two forwards (or one Kovalchuk) away from contending. Their D is certainly better than the Caps’ D, and their goaltending is no worse than the Caps. And they’ve got tons of cap space to make it happen.
Atta dinnin stick a who!
by Gould Old Days on Jan 6, 2010 3:36 PM EST up reply actions
Not buying the check on Quick.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
I’m not buying Quick’s check, and I’m not sure on anything involving Kopi and Doughty in the playoffs until they’re there. Also, they’ve only really got one scoring line, and the rest I’m not buying.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
I don’t buy the Kings as a Cup contender, but it has nothing to do with being in the same division as San Jose. You can have more than one contender in a division and San Jose has its own shit to prove in the playoffs.
Of all our iniquities ignorance may be the worst
by Killer_Carlson on Jan 7, 2010 2:30 AM EST up reply actions
Absolutely, correct, once SJ can prove they can make it past the #8 seed they might become a contender
"That's hockey. You never know what's going to happen. It's a tough sport. No tooth, a broken nose, but I'm looking good [laughs]." - The GR8
Making room for Special Nieds. He’s a Devil to win a cup with his brother.
I’m hoping that the Olympics ride Marty into the ground and he can’t finish out the year because of exhaustion.
That still doesn’t really excuse the merry-go-round that is the Caps blueline. GMGM et al seemed to make it clear Alzner had made his final destination for the year once Nylanders status was resolved. So his demotion for salary cap purposes is BS. If the motive is to reward Carlson, let him bank the big minutes in the AHL like Alzner did last year.
by ThreePingPost on Jan 6, 2010 3:35 PM EST up reply actions
Or just send Sloan down and let Erskine, Carlson, and Pothier fight/alternate the 6th d spot.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
let Erskine, Carlson, and Pothier fight/alternate the 6th d spot.
Master Blaster disapproves of this plan.
"I know it holds 17 1/2 beers."
I don’t get it! But that’s ok. My logic is healthy competition doesn’t hurt anyone, and if/when you decide Carlson isn’t NHL ready, you send him down.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
I’d prefer to hold off on advancing Carlson’s contract unless it’s absolutely necessary.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
by D'ohboy on Jan 6, 2010 4:04 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Agree, but if he’s NHL ready, he’s NHL ready.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
Yeah, but with Carlson there are big time cap implications.
Alzner’s next contract isn’t going to be a big increase capwise. Carlson’s, if he is what we think he is, will be. Bigger incentive there even though you’re right.
Also there’s something to be said for not having two rookies in the linup on the same blueline, but that’s secondary to it all if they’re both good.
I’m hearing Alzner has been sent down to Hershey.
by Kolzilla on Jan 6, 2010 3:34 PM EST reply actions 3 recs
Diet Mt. Dew is Mountain Dew with no soul.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
No, it’s just the difference between the skinny skateboarding chick who gets the guys and the one who doesn’t.
by DrinkingPartner on Jan 6, 2010 3:43 PM EST up reply actions
If you’re into skateboarding chicks (I am not).
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
Only skateboarders drink Mt. Dew. I thought everyone knew that.
by DrinkingPartner on Jan 6, 2010 3:45 PM EST up reply actions
Blizzard Disagrees
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
Red, actually pretty good. Blue, not awful, but not bad. I’m still a big fan of the winner of Dew-mocracy and the Livewire.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
Whereas I preferred Blue to Red, and thought Voltage wasn’t bad at all.
Winterion Game Studios
Visit us online at : http://winterion.com
Skateboarders and computer nerds. I drank my fair share in college.
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 3:48 PM EST up reply actions
You know. . . Dustin Byfuglien.
He’s going to be here to. . .
Give you some good pointers. . .
Maybe.
Still sore...
by D'ohboy on Jan 6, 2010 3:37 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I’m hearing Alzner has been sent to the OHL for 4-5 weeks.
"It's like, how much more black could this be? And the answer is none. None more black."
by Laich It Or Lump It on Jan 6, 2010 3:37 PM EST up reply actions
I was going to post this last night but it was way too late to have my name logged by:
In the realm of who cares defensemen/having your Chimera and eating it too: Jurcina was +2 in a 7 to 3 blowout loss last night. He was one of only 3 players on his team to have a positive +/- (Clark was not one of the other two)
But unlike many he was mostly limited to ES TOI.
The grass is still Green-er here tyvm
I doubt it’s anything to get worked up over. With Pothier coming back, they may have wanted let Alzner sit a game or two as a scratch, if only to get him some rest. So why not let him sit in Hersehy and save us some cap dollars in the proccess. He’ll be back soon.
by crafty on Jan 6, 2010 3:50 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Given that Sloan/Erskine are the ones not getting scratched….
Well, thus the entire tone of the post.
by DrinkingPartner on Jan 6, 2010 3:54 PM EST up reply actions
Someone came with a great point yesterday, saying now is the time for any experimentation that we need done. I’m ok with it if the mindset is when the break’s over, shit’s for real.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
I’m ok with it if the mindset is when the break’s over, shit’s for real.
Only problem is that when the break’s over, the trade deadline’s (practically) over.
True, but the teams glaring needs are already glaring, and experimenting to see what does and doesn’t work within the system is a luxury not everyone in the NHL has. We have 4 guys who can play Center and have at an NHL level routinely – Backstrom, Morrison, Steckel, and Gordon. In addition to that, we have Laich and now Flash, who while it’s not their natural position, they can jump in there. We have Ovechkin, Semin, Flash, Fehr, Laich, Knuble and Chimera as top 9 wingers, and most of those guys play scoring or playmaking roles, and in the case of Beast, Knuble and Laich, can adapt to a scoring/playmaking role. With that in mind, you wanna roll three scoring lines, I’d imagine, and so Steckel and Gordon are off the third line.
At a point like that, you need to figure out if any of those wingers can jump to play center, because one of them is moving to a fourth line or the press box if you can’t (7 wingers for 6 spots, effectively). Now, testing to see how well Laich and Flash fit into a center role determines how glaring the need is for a scoring center at the deadline, and trying out Beast and Laich and all of these different line combos determines whether we have a strong need for a better winger.
Meanwhile, testing out all of the different goaltending (Neuvirth, mostly) options while testing the d-pairings is going to help determine how much we need a better vet like Conklin as a back-up, provided Theodore is movable, or if we need to pick up a strong veteran d-man. That’s more of what I mean by that, and after the break, you don’t get this chance.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
If you really really want a vet backup, you don’t have to move Theo. Just Johnson his ass.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
You could do that, depending on what the CAP situation looks like at that point.
Familiar Rapports: Bald Pollack, F&B, Gould Old Days.
Lobbies: Osala, Perreault, Erskine, Pothier, Neuvirth, Flash.
Fan of: Mean Lars Backstrom, Line Mashing, Cake.
You can also just send him to Hershey. Or better yet, South Carolina.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
He’d have to agree to SC I think I read somewhere, but yeah it’s possible.
Though I always wonder about what kind of reputation a GM gets for doing stuff like that to vets.
“Winner,” hopefully.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
The Flyers and the Sharks have both stashed NHL vets in the “A,” and their franchises seem none the worse for wear. It is something to consider, though.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
The thing is, I feel like NHL players mostly have a teenager’s attitude: “it won’t happen to me.” “I’ve got gas left in the tank, I won’t be an anchor.” I dunno though, maybe they do consider that.
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
sloan and erskine may also be more accustomed to the physical grind of an NHL season. They may simply want to let Alzner rest and re-focus before coming back into the lineup
Erskine, maybe, Sloan definitely not. And Alzner played a, what 72-game season (i don’t remember the length of the AHL) incl. his 30 games in the N. He can take the grind.
by DrinkingPartner on Jan 6, 2010 3:59 PM EST up reply actions
My Take
For the first time in ages, the Caps’ defense looked pretty good last night. ShaMo looked like a guy wearing his favorite pair of jeans skating with Green. Poti looked 1000x better playing with Schultz.
So that leaves Alzner and Erskine, neither of whom played spectacularly yesterday. Pothier is coming back tomorrow, and Pothier and Alzner have a history together, both here and in Hershey. They’ve made a good pairing before. Instead, we’re keeping Sloan and Erskine, the latter will probably play with Pothier tomorrow.
I said it in the last “Alzner to Hershey” thread – if Alzner is going to be a third-pairing guy in DC, I’d prefer him to be a first-pairing guy in Hershey. I’d rather he skate 22 mins a night with special teams play in Hershey than 14 mins a night all at even strength. I don’t agree with it – primarily because I think he’s better than Erskine at this point and that he needs to develop in the NHL so that he’s ready come playoff time – but I prefer it to him riding the pine.
Still, I think the constant yo-yo-ing is going to mess with the guy. My true preference is that hey stay here and play 20 mins/game with lots of PK time.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
by D'ohboy on Jan 6, 2010 3:52 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Did he get 20 last night? I don’t think he’s going to get 20 here as a 3rd pairing. So, maybe it is better if he’s getting 20+ in HER, instead.
by DrinkingPartner on Jan 6, 2010 3:55 PM EST up reply actions
The other thing is that during the playoffs last year, Pothier-Erskine was probably the most solid defensive pairing for the Caps through two series. Considering that Pothier had just come off more than a year on LTIR, their chemistry was pretty surprising.
There’s a couple of issues with the third pairing—Erskine is not the kind of guy who should play every game, and Alzner isn’t the kind of guy who can be rotated in and out (he overthinks things way too much). Unless Alzner is playing better than Pothier, he’s not going to be the hinge on that rotation. Bouncing him in and out of the press box might have a longer, worse effect on his development than sending him back to Hershey for the first time since the Nylander Cap Issue went away.
My guess is that the Capitals probably view Alzner as part of the playoff roster, but they want the other players to get their ice time before the Olympics so the organization can figure out who they can spare in a deadline deal come March. Poti’s surprising play with Schultz needs to be assessed more; Pothier’s health needs to be tested; Morrisonn reclaiming his spot next to Green needs to be solidified.
I agree with D’oh that yo-yo-ing him is going to mess with Alzner’s head, especially in the way Karl tends to misuse it at times. But the flipside to the “but he’s paired with Erskine” is that the Caps realize that, but they also don’t have confidence that Alzner has the stamina to pull down second pairing minutes with a more important defenseman. If he doesn’t have chemistry with Erskine and he’s struggling at 13-15 minutes a night, doesn’t that hurt his development more?
by Forsch31 on Jan 6, 2010 4:08 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Maybe we take a long look at Carlson?
V is for Varlamov!!
by V_is_for_Victory on Jan 6, 2010 4:35 PM EST reply actions
even if we play him less than 10 games?
V is for Varlamov!!
by V_is_for_Victory on Jan 6, 2010 4:45 PM EST up reply actions
It’s not a very long look then, is it?
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
more than we have seen so far….from what BB said, he was in the running to make the team out of camp
V is for Varlamov!!
by V_is_for_Victory on Jan 6, 2010 4:47 PM EST up reply actions
yea, just don’t get this move, finally we are all clear for him, and poof, back to chocolatetown.
V is for Varlamov!!
by V_is_for_Victory on Jan 6, 2010 4:51 PM EST reply actions
I’m jumping straight to the bottom on this because I just got home from spending the day in a continuing education class, so I’ve been out of the loop.
Has Capsland gone crazy? I figured I’d check Tarik’s blog first because it would condense everything and then I’d come here. My first thought on the Sloan signing was they maybe had a trade lined up. Why else would they sign a guy for two years who just sits on the bench? Then I see Alzner assigned. O-K. I don’t get it.
Alright, now I’ll go read the thread. Venting on hold for now.
"The Caps fan doesn't say, 'is the glass half full' or 'is the glass half empty'. He wonders when the glass is going to spill."
Trophy Talk
Thought I might bring it up if no one had seen this article yet:
http://www.nhl.com/ice/news.htm?id=512581
Recap and thoughts:
From NHL.com they give out awards for performance at the halfway mark and even have some predictions of other front runners in each trophy. Ovie gets bumped off of MVP just by a smudge for Marian Gaborik because, as Phil Coffey pointed out, the Rangers would be a serious trouble if not for Gabby’s 27 goals(NYR only have 109 on the season thus far, without gabby they have 82 and would be, theoretically, 17 goals behind Carolina in dead last) . Ovie however still appears to be the favorite for another Richard trophy(and with due cause as he still have the best games to goals ration in the league). Mike Green is still in talks for Norris leading the league for defenseman in goals and points, and Coffey even goes far enough to say he isn’t too shabby on D. Duncan Keith of the hawks is the nhl front runner on the Norris.
But not even a honorable mention for Varly in Calder talk as Tyler Myers and Jonathon Tavares lead that talk. Doesn’t help he’s hurt but Varly’s numbers are very respectable nonetheless.
People are stupid, a person is smart. This leads me to believe there must be at least one smart hockey fan in Philly.
Why all the surprise
It’s my observation that Alzer has not played well since the trade last week. I thought he was out of position an awful lot in the both the Carolina and San Jose games and he wasn’t strong with the puck or the body. He looked ok in the LA game but I saw him somewhat confused and late to position last night. I really think Karl could benefit from some more time at Hershey. I hope when he comes back up, he’s more confident.
When Hell Freezes Over
by dustyrustie on Jan 6, 2010 8:36 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
I think he looked fine against Carolina – it was his D partner who was out to lunch.
He has certainly had some shaky moments though. I think people’s general opinion (at least mine), is that ALL our defensemen have their shaky moments, yet Alzner is 21, while Poti, Pothier, Erskine and Sloan are all near or past 30. They’re not “developing” at this point. Karl has room to grow, and he needs to get his mistakes in now so that we can count on him come Spring.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
I still cannot understant why Alzner was sent back to Hershey
Ok, he has made a few mistakes. The way he has been handled by Caps management is nothing short of atrocious. If he isn’t going to be playing for the Caps, then we ought to trade him.
We’d regret that trade for years to come. We won’t regret sending him to HER for more than this year.
Now let's say you and I go toe to toe on bird law and see who comes out the victor.
Exactly. He isn’t quite being Eminger’d yet. At this point, less harm, less foul. Ultimately, I think it’s bullshit, but whatever – they must have their reasons.
by DrinkingPartner on Jan 7, 2010 1:03 AM EST up reply actions
they must have their reasons
All I’m sayin’.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
Still, that’s a pretty crap justification for anything. Churchill had his reasons for the Gallipoli invasion. Lee had his reason’s for Pickett’s charge. Henry Ford II had his reasons for the Edsel. . . .
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
But what if they’re GOOD reasons? You can’t argue with those!
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
Hey Georgie Baby....
….lend me your ear a second, ok?
What’s going on? First the Sloan signing for 2 years . Then you send King Karl packing down the Hershey highway. Are you depressed? You looked tired at the Clark-Jurcina-Chimera press conference. Not being sleeping well lately?
I mean you have Gabby playing the mad scientist and doing things like putting Flash at center and playing Erskine night in and night out. It worked last night but how long can those experiments last before we get a California road trip deja vu? Or Sha-Mo as a left winger.
Now’s the time to make some moves Georgie when we have time to gel…to do some coalescing before the trade deadline and before the playoffs. Atlanta will be shopping Kovy…we probably can’t afford him but try anyway. Don Waddell isn’t too bright. Offer him Giroux, Aucoin and a bag of Semin and Fehr’s broken sticks and that should do it. Then look west ward to Phoenix. They need money. Give them some of the moolah we saved over Circles Nylander and they will be grateful. Pilfer them for Ed Jovanovski. We need some help on the blue line.At times it stinks more than my incontinent uncle after a night at Taco Hell. We know this—you know this. Then get early 80s one season Cap Milan Novy out of retirement—I am sure he is doing diddly squat these days.. Sure he only scored 48 points in 1982-1983 but think about it ..a power play with Kovy-Novy-Ovie and Jovy on the point. The crowds will love it—Care Bears be damned. And Neuvy mach 2 in net. It can’t go wrong.
We also need a backup goalie. You know Varly is looking rather fragile these days and we need a veteran presence . And sadly Theo is not the answer. So let Theo go so he can go sell anti-balding products in Quebec or something. Then go get Ron Tugnutt out of retirement. I remember he made like 60-70 saves in a game once. Maybe he can repeat that shit—it’s cool stuff. But really the main I reason I think you should sign him is so we can have more masturbation jokes in the forum. I mean the name Tugnutt sells itself. Imagine a box score that reads Semin from Tugnutt. Oh yeah you know what I mean GM.
Are we cool Georgie? Like two little fonzies? Make it happen.
Signed,
Sean (Rather Bengt)
I lived with a blind guy for a while, then he figured it out and demanded back rent.
god damnit
i keep hearing about how this kid is great and can be a top for D man for us so why can’t ship out shamo or erskine to make room for him?
by Area 51 Forever on Jan 6, 2010 11:42 PM EST reply actions
Because a defenseman’s development doesn’t happen overnight. Relax.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
I totally agree. I just wonder whether their current behavior is helping or hindering that development. Right now, I’m leaning toward hindering.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
I would think it could make a player second guess himself, in which case it is not good. I just thought with Nylander gone, the cap space was there. Because before it sounded like the only thing keeping Alzner out of the NHL was cap room.
he can't be worse than erskine or shamo or poti!
that automatically makes him a top 4 D man on our team, and last time i checked you don’t send down a top 4 talent so you cripple his confidence in favor of guys who have failed us time and time again.
by Area 51 Forever on Jan 7, 2010 12:39 AM EST up reply actions
Could be getting sent down to improve his confidence in his abilities to play. We don’t know. We’re not in the room.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
and does this even happen if we don’t have to keep three goalies at the present time? probably not. i’d let this simmer for a few days and see what becomes of it.
Russian Machine very rarely breaks.
i dont know i'm just really pissed off because
i dont want eminger 2.0
by Area 51 Forever on Jan 7, 2010 1:13 AM EST up reply actions
Eminger was thrown into the fire before he was ready, which stunted his development. This is the opposite of what is happening to Alzner.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
but didn't they also bounce him back and forth before they threw him in?
by Area 51 Forever on Jan 7, 2010 1:18 AM EST up reply actions
Young players go up and down, it’s what happens in the NHL. Jason Demers is going through the same shit in San Jose. It’s not a unique situation.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
but at some point with a prospect of his magnitude you’ve got to give him some consistancy.
by Area 51 Forever on Jan 7, 2010 1:21 AM EST up reply actions
Jason Demers isn’t A) quite the player Alzner is supposed to be, and B) being blocked by the likes of Erskine.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
I meant PURELY about the up-and-down.
And he’s being held back by the likes of Kent Huskins and Jay Leach.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
Yeah, but Demers is a former QMJHL defenseman, which means that he’s about as defensively responsible as Maxim Afinigenov. :)
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
He’s not that bad. I’ve watched a few Sharks games this season specifically to watch him. He’s like Green in that he skates his ass back hard when he gets caught cheating.
What are his BTN stats like? I’d pull them but I haven’t jumped into those waters much.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
I’m just kidding. It was more a slag on the Q than anything else. Demers has seemed like a talented young offensive defenseman on the few occasions I’ve seen him. However, he’s stuck behind a lot of talent out in SJ, Huskins notwithstanding.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
i still don't like it
its not like he is supposed to be a 3rd or 4th line grinder, he is supposed to at least be a solid top 4 D man, if not much more. you treat a guy like that differently and don’t just waffle with him so much.
by Area 51 Forever on Jan 7, 2010 1:28 AM EST up reply actions
Potential solid top 4 D-men don’t become that in one season in almost every case.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
yeah but hasn’t this been a little bit on going from last year?
by Area 51 Forever on Jan 7, 2010 1:31 AM EST up reply actions
How long did it take for Mike Green to blossom? He’s not even a strictly defensive defenseman, and it took him a while to adjust. Defensive guys take longer in most cases. Just have patience and it’ll be great when it all works out.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
i don't it
what blossoming does he have to do? he already is less mistake prone and cleaner than half of the defensemen on our nhl roster
by Area 51 Forever on Jan 7, 2010 1:34 AM EST up reply actions
That’s because he uses Irish Spring.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
no seriously
what else does he have to do other than be better than all of our defensemen except for green and schultz?
by Area 51 Forever on Jan 7, 2010 1:37 AM EST up reply actions
Become more experienced as a professional, which includes in some cases paying your dues in the AHL and playing with less-than-stellar partners in the NHL and doing whatever your org says with a smile on your wide Canadian face.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
idk that just seems dumb to me. you should play your best players and alzner is one of our best D men. whatever…
by Area 51 Forever on Jan 7, 2010 1:40 AM EST up reply actions
Believe me, I’ve been down this rabbit-hole.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
what rabbit hole? the list of qualifications jordandc laid out seems more like a hazing list than an actual list of things that would make him any better. i’m not disagreeing with what you said jordandc i just find it dumb the way the institution works
by Area 51 Forever on Jan 7, 2010 1:43 AM EST up reply actions
I understand it can seem that way when it’s happening to a guy that we’re really excited about, but you just have to trust in the organization’s ability to develop players. Looking at guys like Green, Flash, and Schultz and their paths to the NHL makes it easier to do so.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
i see your point, but it just pains me everytime poti fails to clear a puck and when some forward just skates circles around erskine.
by Area 51 Forever on Jan 7, 2010 1:52 AM EST up reply actions
I’d agree I’d like to see him on the team full time, or Carlson, but I’m not going to stress over a second-year pro splitting time in the AHL.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
it just seems to me that the only reason they are not playing him is because he is young, which makes noe sense. if he is good enough he is good enough and you play him.
by Area 51 Forever on Jan 7, 2010 1:47 AM EST up reply actions
It comes back to “they probably know better than we do.” Frustrating, but overwhelmingly the case.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
i guess so, but i’m just tired of us having “defensive depth” which in reality is just a large collection of mediocre and marginal defensmen outside of green and schultz that continually make defense a glaring weakness of ours. time to get more players of substance in our defensive ranks
by Area 51 Forever on Jan 7, 2010 1:51 AM EST up reply actions
i dont want eminger 2.0
Being Eminger’d means being thrown into the NHL as a teenager and then, when the team gets good, being a healthy scratch every night in the NHL. One of Eminger’s biggest problems is that he got no time in the AHL at all.
Mike Green got sent up and down quite a bit. And he looked pretty good with the Caps every time he was up. Doesn’t seem to have hurt his development much.
Atta dinnin stick a who!
by Gould Old Days on Jan 7, 2010 9:41 AM EST up reply actions
got no time in the AHL at all.
By which I mean, not enough time in the AHL, not none.
Atta dinnin stick a who!
by Gould Old Days on Jan 7, 2010 9:43 AM EST up reply actions
he can't be worse than erskine or shamo or poti!
that automatically makes him a top 4 D man on our team, and last time i checked you don’t send down a top 4 talent so you cripple his confidence in favor of guys who have failed us time and time again.
by Area 51 Forever on Jan 7, 2010 12:37 AM EST reply actions
The thing is that he’s still a kid, and he still has more to improve and more to learn. If it means staying in Hershey so that we can “continue to showcase” the rest of our expendable D corps, then whatever. I do think it would be a grave mistake if he’s not back by March.
by DrinkingPartner on Jan 7, 2010 1:05 AM EST up reply actions
Mike Green may well have been better than all but two or three D-men on the Caps the first time he came up. And they still sent him down again.
Right call with Greener, for sure. He needed more seasoning.
Atta dinnin stick a who!
by Gould Old Days on Jan 7, 2010 9:43 AM EST up reply actions
BREAKING NEWS: Caps sign Chuck Norris to play D
^ reason for Alzner’s reassignment.
"That's hockey. You never know what's going to happen. It's a tough sport. No tooth, a broken nose, but I'm looking good [laughs]." - The GR8
NORRIS FOR NORRIS!!!!!
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
by D'ohboy on Jan 7, 2010 1:10 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
LOL, I never even thought of that. I should’ve though since that’s who the award is actually named after.
"That's hockey. You never know what's going to happen. It's a tough sport. No tooth, a broken nose, but I'm looking good [laughs]." - The GR8
I sincerely hope you’re joking.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
Yes, of course I am.
"That's hockey. You never know what's going to happen. It's a tough sport. No tooth, a broken nose, but I'm looking good [laughs]." - The GR8
It can be tough to tell, what with the internets and all the new-to-hockey Caps fans.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
Lol, I understand but for what reason would the NHL name an award after Chuck Norris.
I’m not even in to this craze of “Chuck Norris is greater than everything”, my cousin just had his book that he wrote called the Official Chuck Norris Fact Book or something like that.
"That's hockey. You never know what's going to happen. It's a tough sport. No tooth, a broken nose, but I'm looking good [laughs]." - The GR8
Yeah, I don’t really get Chuck Norris, but whatevs.
The NHL has a few trophies named after 19th-century British nobility. Is that any weirder than Chuck Norris?
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
I dunno, I think I read somewhere about an out-cry to rename trophies of not only the NHL but MLB as well. I kinda understand that but at the same time I don’t. You become a fan of a sport, you learn the trophies and their names and if you’re curious as to why that person has a trophy named after them you can look it up.
"That's hockey. You never know what's going to happen. It's a tough sport. No tooth, a broken nose, but I'm looking good [laughs]." - The GR8
I like the old names, but I also think they should think about instituting a defensive-defenseman award (The Langway as some have called it). . . just so Green can win the offensive-defenseman award every year.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
Until then, he’ll have to settle for the ig-Norris.
My ability to post is only surpassed by my ability to pinch pennies.
Ugh. Not another pun thread. :)
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
Yea, I agree with that. Like a Rocket Richard trophy for defensemen. Wonder if they would name it after a player or someone else though.
"That's hockey. You never know what's going to happen. It's a tough sport. No tooth, a broken nose, but I'm looking good [laughs]." - The GR8
You could call it the Bobby Orr trophy, or the Paul Coffey trophy if you wanted to be more specific. Or you could keep the Norris the way it is, and have the Langway for the strictly defensive guys like Doug Murray.
You're the future of this team's defense Karl. . . Now get your ass to Manitoba!
I didn’t even think about creating a defensive award, I was just thinking offense, since it seems the Norris is already focused on defense much more than offense, as it should be.
"That's hockey. You never know what's going to happen. It's a tough sport. No tooth, a broken nose, but I'm looking good [laughs]." - The GR8
rename trophies of not only the NHL but MLB as well.
How swapping the names? I think it’d be awesome if Varlamov were to win a Cy Young, and Tim Lincecum a Vezina.
Atta dinnin stick a who!
by Gould Old Days on Jan 7, 2010 9:46 AM EST up reply actions
No I meant there was an out cry to change the name of trophies in both leagues, supposedly because nobody saw Cy Young pitch those who want to rename the trophies feel they should name it after someone people can relate to.
Same with NHL, people who want to change the name of trophies feel instead of the Hart it should be someone like the Gretzky award.
"That's hockey. You never know what's going to happen. It's a tough sport. No tooth, a broken nose, but I'm looking good [laughs]." - The GR8
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Southeast Standings
| GP | W | L | OTL | PT | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
Washington
|
53 | 28 | 21 | 4 | 60 |
|
Florida
|
52 | 24 | 17 | 11 | 59 |
|
Winnipeg
|
55 | 25 | 24 | 6 | 56 |
|
Tampa Bay
|
52 | 23 | 24 | 5 | 51 |
|
Carolina
|
55 | 20 | 25 | 10 | 50 |
(updated 2.9.2012 at 9:25 AM EST)
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