Nylander: Boudreau "Told Me I Wasn't Good Enough"
by J.P. on Aug 3, 2009 3:17 PM EDT
in Translations
205 comments
[Huge thanks (or "tack så mycket") to Ice Warrior and HD89 for translating from the original Swedish a couple of interesting reads on Michael Nylander. The first is an article from Aftonbladet (HD89's translation), the second a blog post from Swedish hockey writer Marie Hallman (Ice Warrior's translation).]
Nylander on the outside looking in, with Capitals
"He told me I wasn't good enough"
The Coach doesn't want him. And he doesn't want to stay. But no other team wants to take on his salary.
Michael Nylander finds himself in quite the pinch with the Washington Capitals, a team that just two years ago made it one of their top priorities to get the 36-year old Swedish-born center signed to a 4-year deal worth $18.5 million (dollars). The Capitals explained to Nylander they wanted him to be a big part of their plans moving forward and they were willing to give him a long-term deal to ensure that fact.
His time with the Caps though, hasn't turned out as expected. Nylanders first season in Washington was cut short due to injuries, and he only played 40 games. Last year the slick Swede got into 72 games, but in a much more diminished role under head coach Bruce Boudreau, who replaced previous coach Glen Hanlon just a few months into Nylanders tenure with the Caps.
According to Nylander, coach Boudreau has made his opinion clear;
"He told me he didn't think I was good enough. That's pretty straight-forward to me." [Ed. Note: Ice Warrior translated the same line as "He has told me that I am not good enough. A pretty clear message."]
What happens now is anybodys guess. The deal with Washington extends for another two seasons and Nylander has a right to refuse any move he doesn't like from GM George McPhee. The trouble is, no team will even take on Nylanders high salary. A salary that isn't changed by the fact that he's not playing.
"I want to switch teams, but it's not exactly easy. My deal is signed, I can't lower my salary. It'll be hard to fit in within the salary cap of some teams, and I want to make sure I'd fit in with the team as well. We'll see what happens, but at this point, I don't know."
Jagr has been in touch
For Nylander, there hasn't been any talk about being sent down to the AHL so far though.
"Haha, no. The clause in my contract prevents me being sent there, so I wont accept that."
One option that's been talked about a great deal lately, has been going to Russia - where former NHL star Jaromir Jagr is currently playing. Jagr has been in touch with Nylander on several occasions. Nylander and Jagr were teammates on the New York Rangers and formed a formidable one-two punch for the Blueshirts.
"He's called me many times to check on my progress. But I can't just break the deal with Washington, says Nylander."
***
Michael Nylander: "I could consider playing in Edmonton"
Here's talk number two from the Swedish Olympic Committee's NHL meeting. There has been a lot of talk concerning Michael Nylander and where he's going to play next season.
I took the opportunity to talk to the former AIK player (AIK a hockey club in Allsvenskan one level under the Swedish Elite League-ed.) and got this response:
"I have a contract for two more years with Washington but I want to get traded and I've discussed the situation with the club. It isn't difficult to understand that I won't play there any more. It's a mutual decision that both I and the club understand."
So what happens now?
"I don't know, it's difficult to get a trade. The salary cap will probably drop next season and then it will be very difficult for many clubs to fit me in. But I have a "no move" clause, which means that Washington can't trade me to another club without my approval. So I have some say in the matter."
It's been rumored that you are going to the KHL?
"It's not currently of interest-- I want to play in the NHL. We'll see where, but I can't stay in Washington in any case, not with the role that I have been in. With the role they've given me a change is necessary if I'm going to continue to play there."
What role do you think that you have now?
"Nah, I hardly played at all in the end. My coach is of the opinion that I am not good enough to play for the team in Washington. I have to play elsewhere. Until then, you just have to make the best of the situation."
Are there any dates that you need to keep track of? Any type of trade deadlines?
"No, not when you are under contract as I am. So it's no problem."
Is it hard to start the season like this?
"Ah, but I am already used to it. It's hockey. I know how business is over there. Sure, it's always better to know where you are going to play but I have the advantage that I have a "no move" clause. I can wait until I find something that feels good, I'm not particularly worried about it."
Any club that is high on your wish list?
"Uh ... hmmm .. I can't say that I have a dream team like that and it will be difficult to get into most of them now, given the salary cap. But it would have been fun to try Edmonton. Now, of course, I said no to them before. Instead I chose Washington because we had more friends and knew more people there. And it was perhaps a little better socially. But I would have liked to try Edmonton. I think that it would be fun now. I would like to try that now but it will probably be difficult for them to get me under the salary cap" concluded Michael Nylander.
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I actually feel sort of bad for him. It sucks to know your team doesn’t want you.
"My face is my mask."
by jakeshapiro on Aug 3, 2009 3:24 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Yeah me too… I can’t help but feel like he deserved better than this.
by Murshawursha on Aug 3, 2009 3:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
What I can’t figure out is how he was a success in Boudreau’s first month. PP time maybe?
by red army line on Aug 3, 2009 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
More icetime, a less rigidly implemented system, and less competition. I’m sure part of it was mental too.
by brs03 on Aug 3, 2009 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I assume you guys don’t go Nylandering then
by red army line on Aug 3, 2009 4:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Back when I lived in Centreville, there were some teenage kids that would practice Nylandering in their Civics in the parking lot every now and then.
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by winterion on Aug 3, 2009 4:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nylandering makes me think of gerrymandering.
"My face is my mask."
by jakeshapiro on Aug 3, 2009 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Really???
Re: " I can’t help but feel like he deserved better than this."
He’s got one of the best contracts in the NHL right now, his first season the team got 40 games out of him, last season it’s clear he was and is unwilling to adapt to a new style of play and game plan, and even if he sits in the press box every game he makes over $4M this season.
How’s he being mistreated? He’d get more ice time if he would work on his game and try and fit more into the new system. Look at the changes all the other forwards have made since Boudreau came in. He’s a talented guy with fair skills, if he adapted his style of play to be more agressive (and I didn’t use the word physical since he’s not a huge guy) and headmaned the puck more he’d be a bigger part of this team. At a $5M cap hit and an NMC that basically makes him untradable, I’ve got to believe there would be some give and take and some allowance for a period of adjustment.
I don’t feel sorry for either side, Nyls is well compensated, even for what he could do with a career year, and nobody twsted management’s arm to give him the deal they gave him. As a fan sur I’d love to see the team I root for get more out of that much Cap space but I don’t feel either deserve that much better – they both knew this could happen.
by markbona-capsfan99 on Aug 6, 2009 10:32 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Contract notwithstanding, it’s unfortunate that a guy who has had a solid career and been a consummate professional virtually the whole time is now having trouble finding his way into an NHL lineup.
by David M. Getz on Aug 6, 2009 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He sort of brought it upon himself though. It’s not like he’s playing balls to the wall every night. And as you can tell, he sort of enjoys his position of power.
by Laich on Aug 3, 2009 3:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
What makes you say that? He’s consistently been considered one of the hardest-working guys out there.
His style seems lackadaisical, but that’s not a question of effort.
by brs03 on Aug 3, 2009 3:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That’s what I was saying, my opinion is one man’s opinion. :)
by Laich on Aug 3, 2009 4:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ahh, gotcha… Misread that, my bad.
by Murshawursha on Aug 3, 2009 4:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No worries, I was fairly ambiguous about it.
by Laich on Aug 3, 2009 4:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I want to feel bad, but a few things prevent this from happening. He agreed to a deal and he’s contractually obligated to make far more than he’ll make ANYWHERE.
I’ve been in a similar position where I’ve been doing nothing and gotten paid for it (not millions) and sure, it sucks, but the dude has options still, and he’s raking it in.
I don’t even want to state the conditions that would make me feel sorry for him…none of them are humane.
by snowburnt on Aug 3, 2009 5:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I disagree. I think this was a fairly classy way to put things. He’s not really badmouthing anyone. I guess what I really mean is that he could have said much worse. There was no “they haven’t given me a fair chance,” no “they’re intentionally destroying my career.” Just some resignation. It’s a tough situation, and he was straightforward about it.
by Gould Old Days on Aug 3, 2009 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I really don’t have anything against Nyls. He doesn’t fit our team and our system and I hope that there is a team out there that wants him.
by PKLords76 on Aug 3, 2009 3:27 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
The pic looks like he’s holding a video game controller…
IS PAĐŻTY NOW
by Your Nation's Capital on Aug 3, 2009 3:28 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I thought he was munching on a couple of Hostess chocolate cupcakes
by Cluster on Aug 3, 2009 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Here is a guy two years removed from an 80+ point season, a guy who played through injury as long as he could the season before last and was coming off major reconstructive surgery last year. I also feel terrible for him. It’s not as if he suddenly forgot how to play hockey, and he seems to me a hard working type in terms of getting himself ready to play.
I hope something got lost in translation here and that the real communication was more nuanced — that he doesn’t play the sort of style of hockey that the Caps play (which seems closer to the truth). I’m sure he could contribute somewhere, but that contract — and he signed it, too — is killing his chances of catching on with another NHL team.
He’s in part the victim of what he helped negotiate and cruel circumstance — a coach who plays a game he wasn’t signed to play.
If you've read this far...seek help.
by ThePeerless on Aug 3, 2009 3:29 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
I hope something got lost in translation here and that the real communication was more nuanced
This is, in part, why we wanted to get two separate and independent translations on the line. But they’re nearly identical, so the chances of it being mis-translated are slim.
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by J.P. on Aug 3, 2009 3:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
To be fair, it could easily be a mistranslation between Bruce and Nyls, or something similar. There’s no reason Bruce had to literally say “you’re not good enough” to him, rather than him just reading between the lines.
by brs03 on Aug 3, 2009 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Very true. I don’t think the reporter is claiming to be reporting that Bruce said that to Nyls verbatim, but rather that Nyls said to the reporter that Bruce had said that to him.
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by J.P. on Aug 3, 2009 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
after reading all of the interview and what else we all know of Circles and separately BB, i believe Nyls definately embellished that comment.
by bigity b on Aug 3, 2009 3:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Perception can be reality….The Caps went out and signed Morrison to be the #2 center, if the team thought Nylander is good enough (or good enough fit) to play, the obviously wouldn’t have done that.
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by Hooks Orpik on Aug 3, 2009 3:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
very true. The four centers that will probably be out on the ice on Oct. 2 are Backstrom, Morison, Steckel, and Gordon.
by RedBirdie on Aug 3, 2009 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not to mention last year’s playoffs when Hershey call-ups were in the line-up while a healthy Nylander sat.
Players have often said that Bruce tells it like it is and you always know where you are with him. So really, whether those exact words were said or not, I have no trouble believing Bruce made it pretty clear.
by Ames on Aug 3, 2009 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Along those lines, this may have just been Nyls relaying the jist of what BB told him. In any event, it’s clear he’s done as a Cap.
by grapejoos on Aug 3, 2009 3:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wouldn’t be surprised if BB and/or GM told Nyls either at break-down day or some other private meeting that his playing time with the Caps was over.
by Scott in Shaw on Aug 3, 2009 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
BB could also have told Nyls that he wasn’t good enough to play for the Caps in, um, less polite terms. Nyls could have been explaining it to the reporter in the nicest/most publicly acceptable manner he knew how.
by Fehr and Balanced on Aug 3, 2009 5:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You don’t need to understand Swedish to know that he’s done in DC. Like I mentioned in the Morning Clips comments, I really believe the KHL negotiations are for real and Nyls will land there in November if McPhee can’t find a home for him in the NHL by October. Either way, I think the Caps are going to be free of his $4.5 million hit sometime this season.
by b.orr4 on Aug 3, 2009 3:35 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I think a KHL team will agree to pay the Caps 2.5 Million or so for the rights to him for this year and next year. And then the Caps will sign a loan agreement and he’ll come off the Cap. And Leonsis will eat what’s left of Nylander’s salary (which was front-loaded anyway).
by Gould Old Days on Aug 3, 2009 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nyls for 2.5 mil plus Orlov?
IS PAĐŻTY NOW
by Your Nation's Capital on Aug 3, 2009 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
for him to come off the cap, he’ll have to be waived, assigned to hershey, then loaned, correct? a direct loan will not remove him from the cap, if i understood the older discussions on this
by renstar on Aug 3, 2009 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I find it somewhat laughable that he thinks Edmonton would even consider giving him another shot after he screwed them.
I dunno what happened between Nyls and Bruce, but at the beginning of last season, the team was very high on him and very confident that he would return from injury as an important and even integral part of the club. He started off well. But then it all fell apart.
by RedBirdie on Aug 3, 2009 3:35 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Well, Lowe isn’t the GM in EDM anymore, so that suggests fewer terrible front office moves. But Lowe is still in the front office, and they did try to bring Heatley to EDM despite all his baggage; that suggests they could have more bad moves up their sleeve. They also signed Khabibulin to a 4 year (over 35) deal, when they could have gone after some younger goalies (Josh Harding would have been a smart choice to give an RFA offer sheet). It’s hard to know what is going on in EDM.
by Fehr and Balanced on Aug 3, 2009 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’m guessing the first rule for their new GM was “no RFA offer sheets.”
It’s hard to know what Edmonton is doing, but I am pretty sure one thing they’re not doing is pining for Nylander. It’s hard to think of an appropriately awful return for the Caps to take back, anyway.
by grapejoos on Aug 3, 2009 8:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
A bag of pucks?
"And next year it will be ours."
by Ovechwin on Aug 3, 2009 8:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’d be fine with that, but they need to shed some salary to take him on (though they could find other ways).
Who are we kidding, no team is going to take him with that cap number.
by grapejoos on Aug 3, 2009 9:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Isn’t Khabibulin a kid compared to Roloson? They went young!
But yeah, they were offering a lot for Dany. Do they need the star power to bring in tickets? The rumor mill would have me believe Heater is popular in the Great White North.
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by winterion on Aug 3, 2009 10:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Who is more screwed by the contract McPhee or Nylander? It sounds like the NMC isn’t really the issue unless they want to stash him in Hershey. Anybody else read this as a lobby for a buyout? He said he can’t play here again and he won’t leave for KHL so what other alternative is there?
by RED503 on Aug 3, 2009 3:38 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
He’s not getting bought out, that’s for sure. If he wants to leave it’s in his hands, but if he doesn’t well he can sit in the press box (assuming playing is no longer an option).
by brs03 on Aug 3, 2009 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It sounds to me (maybe this is my own hope talking) that he wants to try to find a place in the NHL, and if he can’t he’ll consider the KHL (which presumably could be worked out). I think b.orr4 is right on this one.
by grapejoos on Aug 3, 2009 3:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Jagr has been in touch with Nylander on several occasions….“He’s called me many times to check on my progress. But I can’t just break the deal with Washington, says Nylander.”
Notice that he doesn’t say he won’t go to the KHL, just that he can’t unilaterally leave and go there. That tells me they’re trying to figure out a way to get it done in case the NHL falls through.
by b.orr4 on Aug 3, 2009 3:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes but it also says…
It’s been rumored that you are going to the KHL?
“It’s not currently of interest— I want to play in the NHL. We’ll see where, but I can’t stay in Washington in any case, not with the role that I have been in. With the role they’ve given me a change is necessary if I’m going to continue to play there.
To me that says he wants to stay in the NHL.
by Yoshietree on Aug 3, 2009 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Don’t disagree. Like I said, it’s clear his first choice is to play in the NHL, but if a trade isn’t worked out and he’s sitting in the press box, I’m betting he wants to play somewhere. And that somewhere could be the KHL.
by b.orr4 on Aug 3, 2009 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed. I read him saying he wants to go to another NHL team, but bottom line is that he would rather play than not play. If no other NHL team will have him, he can go play with Jagr in Russia and still get paid. Sounds like he’d prefer that to sitting around where he’s not wanted.
by grapejoos on Aug 3, 2009 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Marie Hallman answers some comments in her blogg about the possibility that Nylander would consider playing in Sweden and her reply is that it’s not even on the map. And that he is all about NHL. She also ads that she will ask him again at Hovet ( a hockey rink in Sthlm) next week
by Ice Warrior on Aug 3, 2009 4:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The journalist that wrote the second article at the top of the post.
by Ice Warrior on Aug 3, 2009 6:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So your saying there’s a chance… </Floyd Christmas>
by RED503 on Aug 3, 2009 4:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
(Lloyd)
Because now I can justify browsing and commenting during the work day with the argument that I am promoting my business.
by Sombrero Guy on Aug 3, 2009 5:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Nyls: “Oh yeah, and go where? Where am I gonna go?”
Lloyd: "I’ll tell you where. Someplace warm cold. A place where the beer vodka flows like wine. Where beautiful women instinctively flock like the salmon of the Capistrano. I’m talking about a little place called Omsk.
by Cluster on Aug 3, 2009 5:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe Nyls’ game has declined because he’s wearing two pairs of gloves.
by Fehr and Balanced on Aug 3, 2009 6:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, I’ve always thought Nyls was a good guy, feel bad for him. I am hoping he gets a chance to play this year and somehow has a big comeback. Maybe last year was just a glitch.
by katzistan on Aug 3, 2009 3:39 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
It is kind of sad seeing it all spelled out like that. On the one hand, I can’t feel too bad for a guy getting paid millions to sit in the press box. On the other hand, it’s got to be frustrating to not play the game you make your living from and essentially not be able to play because you make too much.
I gotta believe he’d still be a good player in a system better suited to his style. But, it seems pretty clear that no matter what, the Caps will have $5M sitting out come October.
by Ames on Aug 3, 2009 3:41 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
What I hope, for the team and for him, is for Dubinsky to not work as Gaborik’s center and they trade for Nylander.
by red army line on Aug 3, 2009 4:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe the Rangers can throw in a couple first round draft picks too….
by David M. Getz on Aug 3, 2009 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And Callahan and Staal. And Lundqvist. We’ll throw in Varly, Theo, Morrisonn, and Juice.
by red army line on Aug 3, 2009 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
To get Lundqvist? In a heartbeat.
by Knee high to a duck on Aug 4, 2009 10:06 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
A 27-year old, three-time Vezina finalist
A prospect who is not even yet a “rookie” in the official sense of the term.
The concept of a bird in the hand being worth two in the bush might have relevance here.
If you've read this far...seek help.
by ThePeerless on Aug 4, 2009 10:13 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes. Proven vs unproven. Varly may turn out to be better, but chances are Lundqvist is better, and better now. And he doesn’t get injured as much as Varlamov.
by red army line on Aug 4, 2009 10:15 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Put another way, if Lundqvist was a Capital, they become the favorite to come out of the East.
If you've read this far...seek help.
by ThePeerless on Aug 4, 2009 10:16 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
if Lundqvist were a Capital, everyone in hockey would collectively shit themselves.
by RedBirdie on Aug 4, 2009 10:25 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Maybe, maybe not. Of course, it’s the Caps who can light him up. So, if he’s not playing for and not against us, you could be right.
by gfcaps fan on Aug 4, 2009 10:42 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Lundqvist frequently stood on his head to steal games for the Rangers (probably is going to have to do the same this year, too). With the current Caps, goalies don’t have to do that most of the time to win games. Lundqvist paying behind the Caps, wow.
Or imagine if the 1998 version of Olie got to play with the 2009 version of the Caps. oh boy, what a sight that would have been.
by RedBirdie on Aug 4, 2009 10:49 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I had that very thought last week while NHLNW was airing the ’98 Cup run of our Capitals… OYE!!
by war_capitals on Aug 4, 2009 1:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’m amazed you could respond to that messed up statement of mine. Looking at it now, I see
if he’s not playing for and not against us
and obviously it should say “playing for and not against us” .
by gfcaps fan on Aug 4, 2009 1:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Have to make the deal somewhat realistic (at least, realistic enough for a Sather)
by red army line on Aug 4, 2009 10:15 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
How in God’s name do the Rangers have enough cap space to do, well, anything really?
by Murshawursha on Aug 3, 2009 4:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
In my fantasies I can play out an entire Caps-Pens game, Caps-Flyers, Caps-Wings, but not Caps-Rags. I can’t even get past their top-4.
by red army line on Aug 3, 2009 4:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Naslund retired and they moved Gomez.
by Fehr and Balanced on Aug 3, 2009 6:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
gomez and gaborik’s salaries pretty similar if I’m not mistaken?
I thought after all their free agent signings they where back up against the cap?
by JustJeff on Aug 3, 2009 6:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
They are, and that’s just the way they like it.
They’ll be moving out Zherdev, so that frees up some space (which they’ll immediately use up of course).
by brs03 on Aug 3, 2009 6:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow, this is like a steak dinner when all you’ve had is pretzels for a month.
Good stuff. Nice work as always JP.
Edmonton… Come on George. You can get this done.
Talk to Tambellini, have him verbally commit that he’ll pick-up Nyls on re-entry waivers, and they get him at half-price.
by marks4java on Aug 3, 2009 3:43 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
part of me wants to see GMGM work something out with Edmonton (even if it’s just for a beer vendor since he would be no threat up there) just to call Nyls bluff…
by bigity b on Aug 3, 2009 3:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I thought this quote was telling:
“I want to switch teams, but it’s not exactly easy. My deal is signed, I can’t lower my salary. It’ll be hard to fit in within the salary cap of some teams, and I want to make sure I’d fit in with the team as well. We’ll see what happens, but at this point, I don’t know.”
Sounds like he just wants out and understands the reality of the difficulty in trading him. Hell, it even sounds as if he’d re-work his deal if the CBA allowed him to (which it doesn’t). And so everyone’s miserable. Damn shame.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
by J.P. on Aug 3, 2009 3:44 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
I agree with your comment, but what I’d give to be paid $67,000 per game (before tax) to not have to actually play a game this season.
Pensburgh.com -- it's like the Max Talbot of blogs*
*not just because we only work for 12 minutes a night
by Hooks Orpik on Aug 3, 2009 3:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’d take half of that to suit up and get my internal organs rearranged by an NHL player’s check, as long as they promise to put me back together afterwards.
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by winterion on Aug 3, 2009 3:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
For how many games?
I never thought the day would happen, but I’m kind of with Hooks on this.
by gfcaps fan on Aug 3, 2009 3:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Until the doctor says one more cannonball is going to kill me.
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by winterion on Aug 3, 2009 3:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
As long as I’m not getting the Thoresen treatment I could live with that.
by Fehr and Balanced on Aug 3, 2009 6:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, it’s tough to feel too bad for a guy who will make more in a year of sitting than I’ll make in a lifetime. Or a guy who owns $2.5 million house with a $9,500 mortgage.
by b.orr4 on Aug 3, 2009 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Must read listing correctly. That mortgage is if YOU buy it at the listed price with their proposed mortgage. He probably doesn’t have a mortgage is my guess.
But I get your point.
by gfcaps fan on Aug 3, 2009 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Good catch. That’s why I’m not in real estate.
by b.orr4 on Aug 3, 2009 4:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Though with a wife and 11 kids, it’s doubtful he went Randy Moss-style and paid “straight cash, homey”.
by Cluster on Aug 3, 2009 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Because my mind always focuses on numbers, I sometimes wonder what it must be like for a professional athlete to apply for a mortgage. Because, you know, they make a ton of money this year, but next year it could be zero. The bubble notwithstanding, usually they want to see that you can afford to make the payments, either by income or assets. And with that income, the interest deduction ain’t worth all that.
by gfcaps fan on Aug 3, 2009 4:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Knowing the drafting habits, what are the chances one finds their way into the capitals organization?
"And next year it will be ours."
by Ovechwin on Aug 3, 2009 7:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gross exaggeration on my part. I think he only has 5 or 6.
by Cluster on Aug 3, 2009 9:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hell, it even sounds as if he’d re-work his deal if the CBA allowed him to (which it doesn’t).
You have to hate a system that prevents a willing player and a willing team to agree to modify a contract. I understand the salary cap enforcement issues, but still — if everyone wants change, why does the system lock in the status quo?
by Gould Old Days on Aug 3, 2009 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You have to hate a system that prevents a willing player and a willing team to agree to modify a contract.
Ted will have his Exibit A when comes time to negotiate.
As will the NHLPA, I s’pose.
IS PAĐŻTY NOW
by Your Nation's Capital on Aug 3, 2009 4:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
my guess is that’s something the NHLPA fought for, to prevent teams from going to a player and saying “either re-negotiate your contract to something cheaper, or you won’t see any playing time.” Or some such.
by RedBirdie on Aug 3, 2009 4:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Which would make sense. You don’t want any subtle arm-twisting. I could see young players being victimized by that from less scrupulous owners… the Peter Angelos’ of hockey, if you will.
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by winterion on Aug 3, 2009 5:31 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Peter Angelos’ of hockey, if you will
Might as well invoke Voldemort. I just made the sign against the evil eye.
IS PAĐŻTY NOW
by Your Nation's Capital on Aug 3, 2009 5:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Who would the Peter Angelos of hockey be? Charles Wang over on Long Island? The ownership group for the Maple Leafs? ….Dany Heatley?
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by winterion on Aug 3, 2009 6:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, and it also prevents players from signing a 4 year deal at 3 million per season, having a career year in year one and then demanding a renegotiated contract at 5 million a season.
Because now I can justify browsing and commenting during the work day with the argument that I am promoting my business.
by Sombrero Guy on Aug 3, 2009 5:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’d like to see some really punitive holdout provisions (like the player forfeits money he’s already made if he holds out during a contract). Same goes for any shenanigans pulled by the team. You need some strong disincentives to break the contract (or even the spirit of the contract).
With that said, if the situation is untenable, there needs to be a better way out for everyone.
by Gould Old Days on Aug 3, 2009 6:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think they need to allow teams to trade salary with the player. I can understand them not wanting teams and players to be able to renegotiate contracts, but I don’t understand why the Caps can’t trade Nyls and eat half the cap hit for a mid-round draft pick.
by Fehr and Balanced on Aug 3, 2009 6:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I can’t actually think of an argument that would be against that. Any ideas?
Seems reasonable to be able to eat the cash, to get a break.
by Sct112 on Aug 3, 2009 6:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t know the official reason for it (if any), but I suspect it was to make all the GMs/Owners pay the price for their bad contracts. If it’s harder to move a guy because you can’t split the salary then fewer deals are going to get done. Then you’ve got a wasted roster spot and dead cap space instead of letting the rich owners pay their way out of a bad contract. It also wouldn’t surprise me if it’s as simple as NHL couldn’t figure out a good way to allocate the cap space.
by Fehr and Balanced on Aug 3, 2009 6:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wasn’t it more so that the rich teams couldn’t circumvent the cap by renegotiations (ala NFL) or eating the cost of a trade?
by gfcaps fan on Aug 3, 2009 7:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The NFL thing is the reason teams and players can’t renegotiate contracts. They could protect against rich teams just trading off bad contracts if you just make some of the cap hit go against the rich team. If you pro-rate the cap hit by who is paying the contract then you still punish the rich teams for signing bad contracts.
by Fehr and Balanced on Aug 3, 2009 7:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
but isnt that what a buyout essentially does? Team gets stuck with part of the cap hit, but doesn’t get anything in return via trade
Because now I can justify browsing and commenting during the work day with the argument that I am promoting my business.
by Sombrero Guy on Aug 3, 2009 10:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I guess but it also limits player movement. Nyls won’t get bought out because the Caps don’t want the dead cap space so instead he sits in the pressbox and nobody is happy. If the Caps could move him and some of his cap space then I think he would be happy, the Caps would be happy, and presumably the team getting “discounted” Nyls would be happy.
by Fehr and Balanced on Aug 5, 2009 10:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You mean like, “accept the trade, or we’ll put you on waivers, and you could end up in Atlanta?”, as happened to this guy?
If you've read this far...seek help.
by ThePeerless on Aug 4, 2009 3:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hopefully the next cba will contain some NFL style contract restructure language so that if two parties want to work out a situation like this, they can.
by Direction 87 on Aug 3, 2009 5:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I feel bad for Nyles. I really liked him in Boston, as well as here in DC. That being said…I don’t know why he can’t adapt to BB style. He deservs better than this.
by j3rockstar on Aug 3, 2009 3:45 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I think he likes being in control of the play, and more often than not, it’s the wingers who rush up the ice in BB’s system, not the center.
by red army line on Aug 3, 2009 4:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He doesn’t really “rush” anywhere. He meanders. BB isn’t a huge fan of the meandering offense.
by Fehr and Balanced on Aug 3, 2009 6:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You’re just using meander instead of amble for the potential rhyme. I see where this is going.
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by winterion on Aug 3, 2009 6:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well I set it up, so go ahead and knock it down.
“Don’t just stare at it, [finish] it.”
by Fehr and Balanced on Aug 3, 2009 6:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Obligatory Finnish-Swedish pun.
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by winterion on Aug 3, 2009 10:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I feel bad for him, too, but it really reads like he’s pushing for a buyout, that by all accounts is too expensive for the team to consider. Which confuses the heck out of me. I went to route of trying to read the pertinent section of the CBA (and I have a headache, now, if anyone cares). I work with numbers for a living, and I don’t seem to be coming up with a number as large as the last time I read a post about it (I was getting something over 2 million). Can someone show how I’ve bungled the math? Help?
by gfcaps fan on Aug 3, 2009 3:51 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
sk84fun_dc has crunched the numbers over on hfboards (reply #7, the math is organized in a table).
The relevant values:
Buyout this summer: cap hits of $0.7916, $3.292M, $1.41667M,$1.41667M
Buyout next summer: cap hits of $2.875M, $1M
Basically, it’s not happening.
by brs03 on Aug 3, 2009 3:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
brs03 beat me to it
so here is my abridged version, trusting his numbers since I didn’t get to that part yet
— 26 or older at the time of termination, the buyout amount is 2/3rd the remaining value.
1. Take the actual salary due for each remaining year.
2. Take the Averaged Player Salary (cap hit) for the current contract
3. Calculate the buy-out amount (as described above)
4. Spread the buy-out amount evenly over twice the remaining years of the contract
5. Take the number in #1 and subtract the number in #4. This is the "buyout savings".
6. Take the cap hit from #2 and subtract the buyout savings from #5.
Because now I can justify browsing and commenting during the work day with the argument that I am promoting my business.
by Sombrero Guy on Aug 3, 2009 3:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
To further piggyback, here’s a website that’ll let you play around with it (cap geek)
Pensburgh.com -- it's like the Max Talbot of blogs*
*not just because we only work for 12 minutes a night
by Hooks Orpik on Aug 3, 2009 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not mine, sk8’s. Which makes them at least 30% more trustworthy.
by brs03 on Aug 3, 2009 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Looks like I actually understood it, but because I figured is there wasn’t a problem this year, there wasn’t a problem. Silly me, not thinking about next year.
Muchas gracias.
by gfcaps fan on Aug 3, 2009 4:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
According to to those numbers, yeah.. not a shot. Wow.
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by winterion on Aug 3, 2009 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I do believe it’s too late now anyway.
by Langway on Aug 3, 2009 4:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thx for the credit. In this case, the credit goes to Langway, too, we both ran the numbers as a check and we created that thread together to capture as much info. as we could to help people out in the salary, cap hit, and contract discussions.
About the overall topic, I posted some of my thoughts in the earlier thread. Just skimmed the comments here and all I will say now is: Peerless, well said.
by sk84fun_dc on Aug 3, 2009 4:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
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by J.P. on Aug 3, 2009 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes from what I recall after some feedback/teamwork from posters the info. posted was correct.
As many of us have noted for awhile, the key if he is still a Capital next summer is the NMC expiring after this season.
by sk84fun_dc on Aug 3, 2009 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And then smacked my forehead when CapGeek rolled out a month later. That was difficult, and I still got it wrong. It’s nice to have a program to do it for us now.
by Gould Old Days on Aug 3, 2009 6:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Re. buyouts, I have been running the numbers for a few years now. Figuring out the buyouts just requires reading through the rules and looking at the examples in the CBA as a double check.
Also, CapGeek isn’t perfect, while I do reference it, I have seen mistakes in the past and I know of mistakes still on the site, at least one specific to a player in the Capitals organization.
by sk84fun_dc on Aug 4, 2009 9:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t like some of the things he said in that interview. They are just not very professional to say – especially while still on the team. I suppose he can just pull a Semin and say that those really weren’t the words he used.
With that said, I agree with the others here that it looks like he is very aware of the situation and it’s really a terrible situation for all parties involved. It seems like he is just fine with waiting it out and not playing.
I know there have been many of us talking about how he would want to just play which may have been a motivation for the KHL but that doesn’t look to be true now.
He’s not getting any younger though – flushing a whole season down the toilet seems like a waste compared to alternative of playing in Russia for a season or two.
by zephyr on Aug 3, 2009 4:00 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
We’ve got room on my inline team for a playmaking center, and the rink is a quick shot down 66 from DC.
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by winterion on Aug 3, 2009 4:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’m not inferring from this that he’d rather sit out than play in the KHL – quite the opposite. Seems more like he’s willing to go anywhere in the NHL, although it’s not totally clear. He does mention his right to veto any trade, but then he also says things like “I have to play elsewhere.”
It seems to me like once the whole league has passed on him due to his cap hit, Jagr’s phone calls might be a little more compelling.
by grapejoos on Aug 3, 2009 5:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I got the impression he wants to go anywhere in the NHL and nowhere in the KHL. It’s all reading between lines though at this point.
by zephyr on Aug 4, 2009 12:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I saw nylander spin circles, half ass a pass or shot and barely try to get back into the play far too often to feel sorry for him now. I got the impression that in bb’s “you have to earn it” line up, nyls thought he could walk through games and be guaranteed a spot. just an idea.
by Hunky Dory on Aug 3, 2009 4:50 PM EDT via mobile reply actions 0 recs
I got the impression that in bb’s "you have to earn it" line up, nyls thought he could walk through games and be guaranteed a spot.
Maybe he got that impression from watching Flash.
by Fehr and Balanced on Aug 3, 2009 6:11 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
haw. +1
from the house that Red Jesus built
by bigonetimer on Aug 3, 2009 9:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
ha! he’s here all.. the time ladies and gentlemen.
: )
by Hunky Dory on Aug 3, 2009 9:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, this just got interesting. I imagine that was just Nyls relaying the substance of the conversation (“you’re not playing”) and filling in the gap in motivational fashion (“you’re not good enough”), but he shouldn’t say BB told him that to the press. Unless the gloves are off, which they may be at this point.
by grapejoos on Aug 3, 2009 8:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The literal truth is probably somewhere near the middle
I appreciate the Swedish posters who have graciously aided translation. Somehow, I can’t envision Coach Boudreau being quite that blunt with Nylander. I would suggest the conversation was closer to a suggestion by Boudreau that Nylander’s style was NOT compatible with the current Caps uptempo style. Boudreau knows Nylander is a skilled NHL player; there is no refuting this fact.
Furthermore, I would imagine that Nylander is very upset about the whole thing. I can’t believe Boudreau outright told Nylander he wasn’t good enough; rather he told Nylander his style was not compatible and that he (Nylander) would likely be in the press box most of the year.
by Dougeb on Aug 3, 2009 8:08 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
As jolly and friendly as BB always is in the media, he’s still an NHL coach. I can imagine some private moments when BB was a little less jolly with Nyls and let him know quite honestly what he thought of his game.
by Fehr and Balanced on Aug 3, 2009 8:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed.
As of right now, there’s one thing I’m sure of – the Aftonbladet reporter says that Nylander told him that Boudreau said he wasn’t good enough (i.e. the translation of the quote is solid).
I’m slightly less sure that Nylander used those exact words, but it’s not like this is a fly-by-night gossip rag we’re talking about, so I’m pretty confident that Nyls told the reporter what the reporter, um, reported.
Anything beyond that is pure he said/he said as to what Bruce actually did tell Nylander. Would I believe those words came out of Bruce’s mouth directed at Nylander? Sure. Would I believe that Nylander had a creative memory of a conversation? Yep. Would I be surprised to see Nylander circle back-peddle away from this quote? Not at all.
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by J.P. on Aug 3, 2009 8:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Does all this mean I have to rename one of my favorite bands the Nylander Jerks now?
"The passion of our supporters cannot be contained by clothing."
by Bald Pollack on Aug 3, 2009 8:55 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
As stimulating as all this is, I just can’t get out of the threat-down mode with Nyls quite yet. But he sounds pretty resigned and beaten, and okay with it… Training camp should be interesting for him if this drags through.
from the house that Red Jesus built
by bigonetimer on Aug 3, 2009 9:07 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
it sounds like he was told he wasn’t playing good enough to stay in the lineup. The added drama is how he’s taken it. he’s the victim as far as he’s concerned. He’s letting the team know that he’s not fucking around and he’s more than happy to collect his paycheck if they can’t move him. “I’m not playing for them, my contract is too high for other offers, so I’ll take the money until they figure something out. I’m not going to the AHL and I ain’t going to any scrub team.”
The rub here is that its Nylanders ineffective play (for whatever reason) that have kept him from being traded. As we’ve seen, some GM’s will do dumber things than trade for Nylander.
Maybe he should have gone where he wanted to be rather than where he had more friends.
by Hunky Dory on Aug 3, 2009 9:21 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Man, I would be so happy to see the situation change Mike’s outlook, one of these “I’ll show him who isn’t good enough!” things, where he became a workaholic and put 110% into his game, really earned his keep and sold himself as good enough to be traded at the deadline.
The problem is, even if he did, where would he go? The center situation seems to be Backstrom / Morrison / Steckel / Gordon. The only scenario is Steckel taking a fourth-line position alongside (what, say, Bourque and Bradley? That line actually sounds pretty awesome..) and making the third line Flash, Nylander, Fehr?
Sorry, I shouldn’t start a “lines” conversation. That’s got the potential to start going in Nylanders.
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by winterion on Aug 3, 2009 10:30 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Put BreMo at 3C (w/ Flash and Knuble/Clark perhaps).
Move Stecks to the 4th line; have him and Gordon alternate faceoffs (whichever side), have him work the boards as a winger would.
It wouldn’t be easy, but it could be done. Of course once Fehr’s healthy and ready for full-time minutes again things get even more complicated.
by brs03 on Aug 3, 2009 10:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
How can Sather dump that Gomez contract, but George can’t dump this shorter-term, lower cap-hit one, for arguably the same kind of player? Mind you, Gomez is younger, but Nylander has got to have something else left in the tank in the right situation, right?
by marks4java on Aug 3, 2009 10:47 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
You forget that Scott Gomez is the former MVP (of the ECHL).
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by winterion on Aug 4, 2009 1:26 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Sather got to Gainey first. He probably runs faster…
by brs03 on Aug 4, 2009 8:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Their performances were worlds apart – 58 points for Gomez was disappointing, but Nylander being scratched in favor of an AHL player in the playoffs is a disaster.
by David M. Getz on Aug 4, 2009 10:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I had hoped to give Nylander another chance after one injury-shortened season and another season spent recovering from injury without much results — just like I’m willing to give to Brendan Morrison and Chris Clark.
But now, clearly the difference is heart. If you don’t have the heart to show the team you’re playing for that you’re good enough for that contract, then you’re going to disappear into hockey abyss after fans rip your work ethic and attitude to shreds. Clark and Morrison clearly have intentions of showing people what they can do healthy.
I’m surprised we haven’t heard a similar line from the Caps about Nylander like they were saying with BMo — the season was an aberration due to recovering from injury.
Credit to Nylander because it seems that he at least discussed trade and other options with the team instead of pulling a Heatley by telling the media first, in addition to everyone seeing that coming.
And hey, maybe the Caps are willing to be the third wheel in a proposed three-way trade that TSN reporting to send Heatley to the Sharks, perhaps packaging a defenseman in the trade as a sweetener. This interview could help spark that now that it’s in the open, though it could have the opposite effect like we’ve seen with Heatley, but at least there’s a well publicized partner.
by chockster on Aug 3, 2009 11:55 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I don’t think that lack of heart is the problem, just because he isn’t the Matt Bradley type of player who will drop the gloves at any time knowing that he will probably lose, and bleed a lot, doesn’t mean he don’t have heart he just show it differently.
by Ice Warrior on Aug 4, 2009 5:45 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
This notion of Nylander not giving full effort is, to me, a load of bovine excrement. Nylander plays the game at a different pace been the same kind of player over the stretch of his career. You can almost see him going through his progressions every time he has the puck, not unlike a quarterback making reads — carry the puck down the dots, enter the zone, check for cutter to the net, if that’s not open curl back and look for third man coming late, if that’s not open cural again and look for open teammate, if that’s not open send puck deep. He plays a very mechanical, deliberate game, and the Caps do not play, at least at the casual level of observation, a mechanical game. They certainly don’t play a deliberate one. It has nothing to do with Nylander’s level of effort. He was a good fit for Hanlon, a bad one for Boudreau.
And for those who would say, “well, change,” it would be like a slugger in baseball comfortable with a manager who liked three-run homers now playing for a manager telling him to play hit-and-run, slap the ball to the opposite field, give up an out to get a base. Think that’s going to work?
If you've read this far...seek help.
by ThePeerless on Aug 4, 2009 6:18 AM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
Recd for two reasons: Peerless as usual writes exactly what you think but can’t quite pull out of your brain and down on paper like he can. (That is of course when he’s not writing something brilliant that you never would have thought of.) And he actually got me to understand a baseball metaphor, I never thought that day would come. I still don’t understand the rules though.
by Ice Warrior on Aug 4, 2009 6:57 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
When I was in college and living in a dormatory, I was watching a baseball game in the common area. An exchange student from Germany sat down next to me and after watching for a couple of minutes asked if I could explain this game to him.
I’d been a baseball geek since I was five years old, but I don’t think I helped create a baseball fan that day. It is not an easy game to understand if you didn’t grow up with it. But if you did, then it’s pretty simple and best explained by the legendary (if fictional) ball player, Crash Davis, who said, “This is a very simple game. You throw the ball, you catch the ball, you hit the ball. Sometimes you win, sometimes you lose, sometimes it rains.”
If you've read this far...seek help.
by ThePeerless on Aug 4, 2009 7:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
and the Caps do not play, at least at the casual level of observation, a mechanical game. They certainly don’t play a deliberate one.
I am not entirely sure I agree with this, tho the baseball analogy is apt. The opposite of “mechanical” and “deliberate” being what? Haphazard? Slipshod? Sloppy? Poorly-planed? Slapdash? Free-form? Extemporaneous? On-the-fly?
I suspect not. Nicky doesn’t strike me as Mr. Improv. I suspect the difference between the Caps’ game and Nyl’s game boils down to, not so much a lack of structure and planning, but to just a matter of speed of execution.
by Uncle C on Aug 4, 2009 8:40 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Caps do a lot more damage on the rush. It is quick, opportunistic, and spontaneous. When given the opportunity, they strike. They don’t usually take a long time setting things up or “manufacturing” offense (to go back to the baseball analogies).
by Fehr and Balanced on Aug 4, 2009 8:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The PP also is not mechanical, but creative. Creative doesn’t always = flashy
by red army line on Aug 4, 2009 9:02 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
“improvisational”
Now I’ll go to a football analogy. There are some clubs, college and professional, that employ an offense based on on-the-fly reads. Receivers run a “tree” – if the DB does this, then I do that…if they do something else, then I do this. The Caps not named Nylander seem to play a similar kind of game (freedom within structure). Nylander is “structure within structure.”
If you've read this far...seek help.
by ThePeerless on Aug 4, 2009 9:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Caps not named Nylander seem to play a similar kind of game (freedom within structure). Nylander is "structure within structure."
This is an August kind of hockey nuance, but yes - I will agree with you here. In my enfeebled mind “deliberate” = “structure”. So, yeah, okay.
In any event, this whole thing is quite the awkward situation. Particularly for GMGM. Do we blame him for this horrendou$ $igning? I’ve a mind to.
by Uncle C on Aug 4, 2009 9:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
With 20/20 hindsight it’s easy to. But remember that Nylander was signed a) coming off a great year b) to a team without a proven playmaking center c) that finished in the lottery the year before, d) played a much more passive game (i.e. coached by Glen Hanlon), and e) had a young Swede coming over to North America for the first time who could probably use some mentoring in his acclimation.
The deal made sense at the time. Maybe a little long, maybe a little much, maybe the NMC wasn’t the best idea… but at the time it was a good deal. Live and learn, I suppose.
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by J.P. on Aug 4, 2009 9:35 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I echo this. There is no success without risk. This one didn’t work out, but other risks McPhee has taken have worked out quite well.
by Gould Old Days on Aug 4, 2009 9:46 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
There probably isn’t a team in the NHL that doesn’t have a player on its roster about whom it could be said, “wish we had a do-over on that contract.”
Nylander is the Caps’.
If you've read this far...seek help.
by ThePeerless on Aug 4, 2009 9:49 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
PIT and DET don’t. I wonder what to draw from that…
by Fehr and Balanced on Aug 4, 2009 10:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, to a lesser degree. Miro Satan and Marian Hossa.
by red army line on Aug 4, 2009 1:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
there were probably moments of Detroit asking themselves “Why do we pay Osgood to look like crap during the regular season?”
The Satan signing was such a disaster for Pittsburgh. what a waste of money and a roster spot. (and what a terrible job of figuring out what sort of winger would play well next to Crosby)
by RedBirdie on Aug 4, 2009 1:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Satan was a one year deal and wasn’t a ton of money. He didn’t really preclude anything from happening like Nyls and other bad contracts do (though you could say they wouldn’t have had to give up Whitney to make room for Guerin; counter: it’s better to have Kunitz than Whitney so that trade is moot). Hossa had a great regular season for DET. I don’t know who they would have used that money on to make them a better team. Neither are bad deals.
by Fehr and Balanced on Aug 4, 2009 3:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Satan ended up being a waste of money. But looking at the big picture, Detroit was the favorite to win the Cup. Hossa got a big contract but couldn’t help the Wings win it.
I did say “to a lesser degree.”
by red army line on Aug 4, 2009 4:16 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
at the time it was a good deal.
Excellent points, all. I forgot about the level of Caps’ suckitude and the identity of the coach. (Jez, it was that long ago, eh?) And the mentoring of Nicky. How soon the pupil leaves the teacher behind. Whooosh!
by Uncle C on Aug 4, 2009 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He signed the guy that had the best offensive production to his name the previous year (of the “big 4”) to by far the cheapest/shortest contract, and it worked spectacularly at first.
If Nyls hadn’t been injured and Fedorov not brought in, maybe he and Boudreau learn to work together more easily. Can’t blame GMGM for that unless he’s specifically fuelling this disconnect.
The NMC hurts, but Nyls took less to come here. The signing was good at the time, especially if you figured Nylander would get time with Ovechkin. You can’t look back on it and say it was a bad deal because of sweeping changes that happened after the fact, not really. Best you can do is say it was handled poorly later on, or it was just bad luck.
by brs03 on Aug 4, 2009 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I can apparently just understand one American sports metaphor a day; Run a tree? If football isn’t soccer I’ll get strike/struck? out.
by Ice Warrior on Aug 4, 2009 9:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Some football playbooks require a degree in celestial mechanics to figure them out (the Redskins had just such an offensive coordinator not long ago). Football is a simple game, too… “you kick the ball, you run the ball, you throw the ball. Some times you win, sometimes you lose, sometimes… you tie.”
If you've read this far...seek help.
by ThePeerless on Aug 4, 2009 10:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Clarification and semi tangent-o-rama
I don’t think that lack of heart is the problem, just because he isn’t the Matt Bradley type of player who will drop the gloves at any time knowing that he will probably lose, and bleed a lot, doesn’t mean he don’t have heart he just show it differently.
I think what I was trying to say was misinterpreted due to my unfortunate use of a cliché.
Nylander is now emotionally checked out. I wasn’t questioning his effort or “heart” at all in his prior work with the Caps — it’s pretty hard to show what you can do when you’re injured. Who knows what his mental state was then, but it showed that he was trying.
I’m looking at this more of the timeline of the interview moving forward.That now he’s recovered and raring to go, he can prove he can produce like he did, as I said, similar in the vein that BMo and Clark want to prove they can contribute now that injuries are behind them.
But that likely won’t happen in Nyls’ case because Nylander wants a change of scenery for whatever reason — whether it was Boudreau’s alleged comment or chemistry with him as a person and not systems wise, or just the frustration of what he’s gone through with injuries and a sub-par time or who knows.
I’d love to see him come in this season and just light it up and dish some crisp passes that get put away. Then there’s a better hard decision — keep him or trade him now that his stock is higher because he’s producing again — as oppose to keep him and watch him wilt or trade him for low value.
Peerless is right — he can’t just change. That’s like telling Mike Knuble that because him crashing the net doesn’t actually work with the system, well, he’s just going to have to score from more than 6 feet out.
But he can adjust. Or others adjust to him.
Playing with Nylander, like Uncle C says, is about execution. From what I see, it takes a bit more thought about where Nylander is and where he’s going to pass to than most players. Jagr and Nylander shared a common hockey sense to know where the other was. Some of our players haven’t quite figured it out as opposed to the other way around.
by chockster on Aug 4, 2009 6:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’d love to see him come in this season and just light it up and dish some crisp passes that get put away. Then there’s a better hard decision — keep him or trade him now that his stock is higher because he’s producing again — as oppose to keep him and watch him wilt or trade him for low value.
Don’t we all.
by Ice Warrior on Aug 4, 2009 6:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Jagr, despite me intense and undying hatred for everything he is and stands for, is a ridiculous talent. He could control the puck like few others, he was incredibly smart in the offensive zone and knew how to find the smallest of spaces to get himself open, and he knew what to do when he got the puck. Nylander can hold onto the puck forever and make slick passes (usually of about 5-10 feet). We don’t have anyone like Jagr. AO is an amazing, but different, talent. Same for Semin. If Semin had either a) the strength of Jagr or b) the hockey sense of Jagr, then he could do something like that. He doesn’t. Looking at his performance with Jagr just isn’t a realistic way to try to project what he can still do in the NHL.
by Fehr and Balanced on Aug 4, 2009 6:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’ve got to think this is going to be settled before camp. I have a hard time thinking Nylander would even be at camp otherwise. This kind of “he said…no I didn’t” in the context of Nylander’s have little or no role on this team is going to be the daily distraction and the story leading off every day (was Nylander on the ice?…wasn’t he?…why not?…what do you say Mike?…Bruce, why isn’t Nylander skating with the team?…George, is there a trade in the works?…Ted, is there a SnagFilm coming out about this?).
If you've read this far...seek help.
by ThePeerless on Aug 4, 2009 3:57 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Theres a SnagFilm about almost everything it’s seems, so I’m sure It’s in the works. I got tired hearing about Nylanders spot on the team last season. Please not another year of this.
Nylander says that is a mutual decision that both he and the club agree on. Let’s hope that is true and that some trade magic can happen.
by Ice Warrior on Aug 4, 2009 6:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Here’s one possible scenario:
Nylander: Why am I not playing?
Boudreau: Because when you were playing, you weren’t playing good enough
I could see Nylander coming away from that exchange with “You aren’t good enough”
by Gould Old Days on Aug 4, 2009 9:52 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Here’s another:
Nylander: Coach, have a taste of my coq au vin and this here souffle. I’m thinking of retiring from hockey to become a chef and open up my own restaurant, serving only the finest French cuisine.
Boudreau: Damn, Michael, that’s a tasty bird, but the souffle is a disaster. Can I ask how many eggs you used? As for opening your own restaurant, based on these two dishes, I don’t think you’re good enough.
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by J.P. on Aug 4, 2009 10:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And another…
Nylander: Coach, I really think I could contribute if I got more minutes.
Boudreau: Stick it in your flygplatsen… I guess my Swedish is not good enough.
If you've read this far...seek help.
by ThePeerless on Aug 4, 2009 10:03 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well I could teach you the right word but as often in life I’ll leave it to Brooks Laich
He use the PG version though.
by Ice Warrior on Aug 4, 2009 10:25 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Can I ask how many eggs you used?
That’s just asking for someone to question his manliness.
by red army line on Aug 4, 2009 10:13 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So, how does this all end?
What are the options?:
* Nylander and Bruce hug it out, and Nyls finds a role.
Nyls sits, and cleans-up (Mr. Clean reference here), happily collecting his cash.
Nyls is moved “legally” off the Caps roster (waives his NMC for Hershey demotion or to be claimed by another team, or is traded)
Nyls breaks his contract “illegally”, and signs in Russia.
Nyls retires.
* The Caps buy him out.
Am I missing anything?
by marks4java on Aug 4, 2009 10:35 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Sorry, the bolding and “bullets” didn’t format correctly…
by marks4java on Aug 4, 2009 10:35 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
My bet? It ends with Nylander playing hockey for someone other than the Capitals by the end November – I’d say the odds are 25% it’s an NHL team and 75% it’s a KHL team under a loan agreement (Nylander’s probably not going to break his contract with the Capitals because he’s probably not going to get as much money in Russia).
by David M. Getz on Aug 4, 2009 10:41 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t think it will go so far as November. I suspect this will be settled by Labor Day.
Now, if I knew just how it was going to be settled… (insert dopey emoticon here)
If you've read this far...seek help.
by ThePeerless on Aug 4, 2009 10:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Now, if I knew just how it was going to be settled…
But that’s why we keep tuning into our favorite soap opera: As The Nylander Circles
by Gould Old Days on Aug 4, 2009 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think sometime into the season, a team cough*Rangers*cough will be desperate for a #1 C and try to trade for Nylander.
by red army line on Aug 4, 2009 1:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Rangers have Drury, Dubinski, and a dearth of cap space. I don’t see that working out.
by David M. Getz on Aug 4, 2009 1:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
They also have nobody to make plays. If they can unload Rozsival at some point this season, they’ll likely be in the market for a center, unless Dubinsky takes a big step forward and Anisimov has a larger-than-expected impact.
Not necessarily Nylander, but they’re probably not done making move.
by brs03 on Aug 4, 2009 2:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Drury is their #3, and Dubinsky is a #2 trying to be a #1. They have what, $2.5 million in space when they round out their roster?Enough space IMO to make a move.
by red army line on Aug 4, 2009 4:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Drury is their #3, and Dubinsky is a #2 trying to be a #1.
And what are the odds they assume Michael Nylander will outplay either of those guys?
by David M. Getz on Aug 4, 2009 4:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Drury is really #3 C? I still have flashbacks of that ridiculously sick goal he scored with the Avs during their cup run in the Bourque year. He seems like a year in, year out, no questions asked 50 points, 5 GWG guy, and has a history of being nothing but clutch in the playoffs. Hard to believe he isn’t higher on the depth chart than the third line.
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by winterion on Aug 5, 2009 11:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Steinberg says trade Nyls to the Pirates!
It’s So On …: Gabby v. Nyls – does Nylander get healthy-scratched for training camp? Or does GMGM take care of this by trading him and a bag of money for a ham sandwich (although I guess he’d still take a bite out of the salary cap regardless)?
Dan Steinberg: No no, for a bag of Swedish meatballs.
I mean, this situation seemed untenable last year, and somehow it just tenabled all the way through to the end. And now we have to go through another year of this? No chance. Just trade him to the Pirates, they’ll take anything.
by RedBirdie on Aug 4, 2009 12:09 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Bobby Carpenter anyone?
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/article/magazine/MAG1065620/1/index.htm
A brief passage from the article:
“…Though Carpenter denies it and Poile refuses to comment, Murray says that when practice began, a member of the Caps organization overheard Carpenter repeatedly muttering, “I’ve got to get out of this bleeping organization.” “Had I heard that,” says Murray, “I would have thrown him off the ice…”
Ahh, the memories!
by MetalCapsFan on Aug 5, 2009 1:59 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
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Southeast Standings
| GP | W | L | OTL | PT | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
Washington
|
59 | 41 | 12 | 6 | 88 |
|
Tampa Bay
|
57 | 25 | 21 | 11 | 61 |
|
Atlanta
|
57 | 25 | 24 | 8 | 58 |
|
Florida
|
58 | 24 | 25 | 9 | 57 |
|
Carolina
|
58 | 21 | 30 | 7 | 49 |
(updated 2.9.2010 at 12:41 AM EST)
Certain photos copyright © 2010 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
