Draft Disappointments
by hockeyman33 on Jun 28, 2009 9:51 PM EDT
47 comments
Over the draft, the Caps got a two way center and an offensive defenseman with their picks in the first two rounds. That's not my disappointment though. There was much anticipation to whether the Caps would address their 2nd lin center and 1st line winger problem through a trade during the draft, but nothing happened. Pronger was a possibility to make the Caps a true contender, but GMGM again turned away as Anahiem asked for too much (if you didn't hear, it was one of the goalie prospects, Carlson, a roster player, and something else). He went to Philly in which i thought was a lopsided deal favoring the Ducks. Not many other players were on the trade block that gave the Caps great interest. But the few that could have were Bouwmeester and Kaberle. A Dman isn't a need for the Caps, but it is necessary to win the Cup. A group of great prospects isn't going to cut it. The Caps either need a rough and tough guy to clear the crease (Hal Gil comes to mind) or a skilled one, like Bouwmeester.
Nylander and Theodore are still in the Caps roster, to the disappointment of many fans. They would be more of a giveaway to a team, because the Caps definatley dont want Nylander, and Theodore isn't even guarenteed, a starter spot and he is taking up $4.5 million in the cap.
Free agency could prove to be the answer, but it poses big problems. Players who sign as free agents often want long term, high paying deals. This is a problem to the Caps because they are up against the salary cap and because Backstrom and Semin both need new deals after this season as RFAs. Backstrom needs to be locked in, as a great partner for Ovi, and it would be great to keep the secondary scoring threat with Semin.
Who do you want to leave the Caps, and who do you want to pull on the red, white and blue uniform over the next few days? Would you rather make a trade or make a signing?
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I feel like next off-season will be great if GMGM can buyout Nylander and trade Theodore. That would leave alot of cap room for either building in some good, solid players in the roster. Or signing some powerhouse to play on the first line with ovie.
by kingzman264 on Jun 29, 2009 3:29 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Yes, but that’s a fantasy on both counts. Let’s deal with what is realistically possible.
"It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees." - Delores Ibarruri
by gotsparkly on Jun 29, 2009 6:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The front loaded nature of Nylander’s contract makes it almost a guarantee he’s bought out next offseason. Theo’s contract is up after this year, so that won’t be an issue.
by David M. Getz on Jun 29, 2009 8:57 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t think he’s going to find a suitor for Theo, and I kind of have a inkling of hope that Nylander steps in as a second line center and shuts everyone up. Also, I think Theo is more than likely trade dangle bait at the deadline.
I'm so sick and tired of the refs explaining the calls like this is the NFL.
by Whiter Mage on Jun 29, 2009 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The off-season is not over yet my friend, there is a lot of time left. Personally, I’m elated we didn’t get Pronger. It looks like we aren’t going to be able to move Nyls or Theo. So Nyls might end up being the much needed 2nd line C, yikes.
by JSchon on Jun 29, 2009 6:30 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I’m not sure moving Theodore is a good idea anyway. It sounds great on paper, but Varlamov hasn’t played a full season in the NHL yet, and there are still questions about his conditioning and proneness to injury. Same with Johnson. Varlamov needs a veteran workhorse at his back to take plenty of starts so that he can be fresh for the playoffs and when he is needed. That workhorse is Theodore, like it or no.
You’re right, though. The off-season is just getting started – it’s far from over. There’s a lot more that can happen, and I’m not in favor of big-name trades or signings. This isn’t a fantasy league, and there are locker-room issues to think about (like not creating a prima-donna party). Look for up-and-comers. The Ryan Clowe suggestion was really interesting if we can manage it; Marc Savard’s another interesting idea if we can afford him (which I’m not sure we can).
I still think that the issue of clearing the crease is a coaching thing more than a player ability thing. Consider that Hershey doesn’t share that problem, and a lot of the same guys played there that played for us this year. It’s part and parcel of the getting one’s nose dirty and playing with a mean edge thing, because you have to be a bit of a jerk to be an effective crease-clearer.
"It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees." - Delores Ibarruri
by gotsparkly on Jun 29, 2009 6:40 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Caps just need to reconnect with that Dealer in FL…If they can get Sarge, Juice, and Erskine on “the juice”, well here comes your big, strong, aggressive, crease-clearing D-men. No trades needed, save for the illicit ones.
by radhghlndr on Jun 29, 2009 6:55 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Minus one million. Leave the ’roids out of it.
"It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees." - Delores Ibarruri
by gotsparkly on Jun 29, 2009 7:47 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The off-season is not over yet my friend, there is a lot of time left.
Agreed. The issues/holes the team has need to be filled this offseason, not necessarily on draft weekend. I’m not disappointed in anything yet.
by David M. Getz on Jun 29, 2009 8:58 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Two good quotes by McPhee in his video interviews on the Caps’ website. 1) Season starts in October. He’s got plenty of time. 2) He currently considers Brooks Laich to be the 2nd line center on the depth chart. If they can’t make a reasonable deal, that’s how the season might start. He made no mention of Nylander.
by Gould Old Days on Jun 29, 2009 9:24 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i know its not over. im just saying that nothing big happened at the draft, which is when the big stuff usually happens. and im happy we didnt get pronger too. he is a nasty player and wouldn’t be worth what we would have given up. would be good for a one year run, but gmgm is trying to build a team that can win multiple cups
by hockeyman33 on Jun 29, 2009 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i know its not over. im just saying that nothing big happened at the draft, which is when the big stuff usually happens.
Historically, I don’t think that’s true. Top six forwards and top four defenseman always have a number of suitors and you generally have to wait and see how the free agent market shakes out to get things moving, even more so now that the salary cap is in place.
by David M. Getz on Jun 29, 2009 10:53 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
anyone find out what GMGM and Boudreau were talking to Boston about??
by ns on Jun 29, 2009 9:18 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I would imagine they were talking about talking later about talking about Savard and Kessel.
by JSchon on Jun 29, 2009 9:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
My guess (and others have raised this) is that GMGM was trying to extract a pick to swap draft position if Boston really wanted a guy other than Johansson and wanted to move ahead. There’s a video somewhere on the tubes of him doing the same thing right before picking Backstrom a few years ago.
But then again, who knows.
by grapejoos on Jun 29, 2009 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Not going to Sugar-coat it...
but anyone who thought Nyls or Theo would be moved on Friday/Saturday was delusional.
Nobody’s going to take Nyls contract. Period. Our only hope is that he clears waivers and we can loan him to KHL.
Dealing Theo and going into the season with BJ and Varly is probably not the best idea. I’ll say it again, Theo’s best value to this team is as trade-bait at the deadline to a team in desperate need of a goalie upgrade.
Remember also, Theo’s in a contract year and with strong competition behind him, he’s bound to perform and make BB’s life hell having to choose between SV40 and JT60.
by FFSEnough on Jun 29, 2009 9:29 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Can’t waive Nylander without his consent. No movement clause. Should he consent, I sure wish he doesn’t clear waivers, because that would mean that someone claimed him.
by Gould Old Days on Jun 29, 2009 9:42 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He would be in on any loan, though, so consenting to waivers probably wouldn’t be an issue if he’s already agreed to join Omsk.
by brs03 on Jun 29, 2009 10:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Rec’d. THANK YOU for saying that.
Except that Nylander can’t be waived without his consent either. We’re stuck with him this season, folks. Deal.
"It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees." - Delores Ibarruri
by gotsparkly on Jun 29, 2009 9:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
trade-bait at the deadline toa team in desperate need of a goalie upgradethe Flyers
Fixed that for you.
"It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees." - Delores Ibarruri
by gotsparkly on Jun 29, 2009 5:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I can’t imagine the Caps and Flyers being trade deadline partners. It’s pretty rare for teams that are battling for playoff position to trade with each other.
by Fehr and Balanced on Jun 29, 2009 5:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That was intended as a joke :) But you’re right. They’d have to be desperate.
"It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees." - Delores Ibarruri
by gotsparkly on Jun 30, 2009 7:26 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Pronger and Such
The Flyers gave up a lot of depth to pick up Pronger, and it may come back to bite them on the butt during the season. Pronger is an effective player, but there are diminishing returns with him. He’s obviously past his prime and is on the downside of his career. They gave up Lupul, a decent depth guy, as well as Sbisa, who is going to help Anaheim for quite some time. On top of that, the Flyers gave up their first round choices for the next 2 years. They better win something soon, as they’ve spend a lot of their future on this one player.
Of course, Pronger could get hurt (it happens) in which case…whoops.
As for the Caps, if the cost for Pronger was a goaltending prospect, Carlson, and 2 players… that’s too much. Admittedly, it’s better to trade folks to the other conference, but it’s still too much. The Caps do need to find a second line forward (preferably a center) and perhaps another NHL defenseman with a physical presence, and there will be some available.
There is a lot of talent in Hershey and South Carolina to draw from as well, either in trades, or on the Caps roster. This is still a very deep team, and it’s possible the building blocks are already here…
Let's go Caps!
by MikeL-Caps on Jun 29, 2009 9:39 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
and its my understanding that Philly still has some roster positions to fill, and its either going to be with cheap and likely sub-par guys, or they’re going to have to dump even more salary to find some marginally effective players to fill the roster. And then the cap is going down next season and Pronger wants a hefty contract at 35……yikes. Its salary cap hell for our dear friends up I-95!
by RedBirdie on Jun 29, 2009 10:11 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
its my understanding that Philly still has some roster positions to fill
Like “goalie”…
by Gould Old Days on Jun 29, 2009 3:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
what, you mean Ray Emery isn’t going to play 82 games?!?! Damn, there goes Philly’s gameplan….
by RedBirdie on Jun 29, 2009 3:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
but the question is are these building blocks nhl-ready? caps can be a cup contender this year, and i wouldn’t want to put that on having a lot of rookies on the team. i agree in that the caps can have a terrific team with their players in the nhl and the minors, but that is still a year or so off in the distance. if they want to win a cup this year, they need some outside help.
by hockeyman33 on Jun 29, 2009 10:41 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Very good questions… maybe we can go through them a bit:
1) Alzner – He proved he was NHL ready for most of the games he played for the Caps last year. He still had some learning to do, but I suspect he is ready for prime time.
2) Bourque – Looked ok in 4th line/spot duty last year. Would love to see what he can do if paired with Ovechkin and Backstrom. I bet he’d be ok.
3) Carlson – Could crack the line up as the 5th or 6th defenseman, but should he be playing 12-14 minutes in DC or 20 minutes in Hershey every night?
4) Neuvirth – Definitely ready, looked good in his games for the Caps.
The question is how do the Caps go about filling in the gaps, improving the team, and getting quality minutes from guys without running into the cap ceiling. A buyout of Nylander isn’t the issue (Although a loan to the KHL if they want him would be great. I don’t think the waiver clearing will be an issue.) So far, since 2003-04, when the Fire Sale began, I don’t think George has made too many mistakes (the only one I think he’d like to have back is the Mike Grier for Jakub Klepis trade…)
Let's go Caps!
by MikeL-Caps on Jun 29, 2009 12:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think your assessments are a little optimistic.
Alzner looked great at the start in DC, but he was the team’s worst defenseman by the time of his demotion. I would think that he’s good to go after a full pro season and another offseason of conditioning work, but he certainly shouldn’t be handed a job.
It’s hard to comment on Carlson, but when we saw him in Hershey, he wasn’t on the ice for a single defensive zone draw. They’re probably going to want to see him get extended time at the professional level before he’s in Washington.
Neuvirth did a heck of a job in the AHL but in the four games he played in Washington he only had one where his save percentage was over .875 and I thought he looked overwhelmed. You have to happy with his progression but I think he’s far from “Definitely ready”.
by David M. Getz on Jun 29, 2009 1:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Are you suggesting Varlamov and Neuvirth as the rostered goalies next season? Scary, scary stuff.
by Moonage Daydream on Jun 29, 2009 7:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yikes, no. No way.
"It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees." - Delores Ibarruri
by gotsparkly on Jun 30, 2009 7:27 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Let’s look at this from another perspective. I’m a Hershey guy looking to move up into the NHL. The Caps buy a bunch of guys, and there’s no roster space for me. Do I sign again with the Caps? No. I sign with a team that will give me a shot to move up. Farm talent is use it or lose it, just like muscle.
"It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees." - Delores Ibarruri
by gotsparkly on Jun 29, 2009 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Okay, so maybe I ended that a little early. Problem is, you’ve got to move these guys up or their going to rot where they are. you could trade a few, but not all. You’ve got to keep moving guys up – buying out of free agency all your guys just plain isn’t an option in this era, and it’s not even a good idea.
"It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees." - Delores Ibarruri
by gotsparkly on Jun 29, 2009 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Somewhere, Sami Lepisto is proving a point.
I'm so sick and tired of the refs explaining the calls like this is the NFL.
by Whiter Mage on Jun 29, 2009 4:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree with you in principle…but if, in order to be a true contender, the team needs to fill a couple (or few) spots with legitimate NHLers…the GM MUST do so in a responsible way. The key to the salary cap era, IMO, is to take advantage of cheap labor while they are on initial contracts and utilize the RFA period. If another team outbids you, grab the picks and bring up the AHLers to fill the cheap labor role.
Bottom line is the Caps have a definite need for a RW, C and a D…all of which cannot be filled from within right now. So do you wait until they are or do you go out and try to fill atleast 2 of those gaps?
by Yoshietree on Jun 29, 2009 5:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I utterly disagree that we need a D, Yoshie. Think back to Hershey’s Calder Cup run, if you watched that at all. Despite playing with a ton of the same guys that were callups in Washington earlier in the year, Hershey does not have the issues with the crease getting crashed that Washington does. That points me to a coaching issue rather than a player ability issue, and it strikes me that that goes back again to the playing with a mean edge problem. To keep your goalie clear and keep the other team from crashing the crease, you have to be a bit of an asshole and be willing to get your nose dirty, and be willing to work at it – something we had issues with all year. We’ve got plenty of NHL-ready defensemen, and with Woods in charge of the D, we might just be able to fix that issue without throwing our cap space down a stupid hole.
I’m also not convinced that the RW has to be filled from outside, at least not in the offseason. Both Chris Bourque and Oskar Osala may be able to step into that role, and Osala’s a big enough body to be that crease-crasher we want. If that’s not enough, moving at the deadline is an option, too, and one we want to leave open. But give ‘em a shot and see what they’ve got first – if Boudreau hadn’t taken a risk on a Hershey rookie in April, we’d’ve been on the golf course in the first round, not the second.
The only one I really agree has to be filled from outside is the second-line C.
"It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees." - Delores Ibarruri
by gotsparkly on Jun 29, 2009 5:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t think Osala is ready to step up to the NHL. I think that entire rookie line needs at least one more year in Hershey, preferably in a role where they are relied upon for scoring. Fehr is more likely to fill the 1RW right now. He’s a better skater, better in his own end, and has much more experience playing at the NHL level.
I’m also not convinced that Hershey’s crease being clear for their run was the result of coaching and D skill. It may very well be the case that Woods was better at coaching the D to clear the crease (I hope so) but I think it could also just be the result of 1) lower skill level of the opposition and 2) Neuvirth has much better rebound control than Varlamov. Fewer loose pucks in the crease will make it look like the crease is being cleared better.
by Fehr and Balanced on Jun 29, 2009 5:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The team can’t count on Nylander or Clark, or even Fehr due to his injuries. If none of those three show up able or ready to play, the team is looking at:
Ovechkin – Backstrom – Osala
Fleischmann – Laich – Semin
Bourque- Steckel – Aucoin
Bradley – Gordon – Beagle
Or something like that. Those lines definitely need an infusion of additional “talent,” to use McPhee’s words. On the other hand, if Clark, Fehr and Nylander are all effective, these lines look OK:
Ovechkin – Backstrom – Fehr
Fleischmann – Nylander – Semin
Laich – Steckel – Clark
Bradley – Gordon – Bourque
It all depends on the health and effectiveness of the guys already under contract. Maybe the “wait and see” approach ain’t crazy.
by Gould Old Days on Jun 29, 2009 7:32 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
While I get your point, the 2nd line of your more experienced lineup scares me more than the one where people are hurt does. Fleischmann/Nylander/Semin scares me with lack of defense, grit, and someone to go into the corners or in front of the net. Looks like the ultimate carebear line to me…yuck. Would like to maybe see some combination of those lines.
by HateOffSeason on Jun 29, 2009 7:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
How’s this?
Ovechkin – Backstrom – Semin
Fleischmann – Nylander – Fehr
Laich – Steckel – Clark
Bradley – Gordon – Bourque
I could honestly see the 3rd line with more minutes than the second line in that scenario. And that wouldn’t be so bad — not given the workhorses on the 1st line who will double-shift most of the game.
by Gould Old Days on Jun 29, 2009 8:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ugh. I hate Semin and Ovechkin on the same line. They like each other too much, and look for the pass.
by RPI93 on Jun 29, 2009 8:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Honestly, wouldn’t mind trying a couple of these combo’s for the first 2 lines…
Ovechkin – Backstrom – Fehr
Osala – Nylander – Semin
or
Ovechkin – Backstrom – Clark
Fehr – Nylander – Semin
or
Ovechkin – Backstrom – Fehr
Laich – Nylander – Semin
As you can see, I seem to have issues fitting Fleischmann into any of the lines, which is a shame for his production for low salary. Maybe I’m being heritical here, but could this work for a first line?
Ovechkin – Backstrom – Fleischmann
We keep seeing that Ovechkin doesn’t need a guy in front of the net, and Flash could definitely keep up with those guys…although might be another way too much carebear again.
by HateOffSeason on Jun 29, 2009 9:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
these are some interesting combos. i have been disappointed with fehr over the past few years. he isn’t a tough guy who can grind in the trenches or a very talented scorer. if he wants to play on the top line, he has to be a grinder.
Ovi – Backs – Laich?
If the second line center spot is filled i think laich deserves a look for this spot.
by hockeyman33 on Jun 29, 2009 10:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
he isn’t a tough guy who can grind in the trenches or a very talented scorer.
This point has been debated relentlessly on this site and after all of the debate my feelings for Fehr haven’t changed. It really all depends on which Fehr shows up…if it’s the Fehr that isn’t afraid to work the boards and get the puck deep in the zone, then he’s a perfect fit for the top line (assuming he recovers from his injuries). But if it’s the Fehr that takes a wrister or snap shot from the top of the circles then he shouldn’t be seeing anything more than the 3rd or 4th line.
by Yoshietree on Jun 29, 2009 11:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The two are one and the same. The problem isn’t that Fehr only takes long shots, it’s the he shoots too much.
by David M. Getz on Jun 30, 2009 8:46 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think the lineup will not include Nylander unless it’s the last resort by the way GMGM was talking in that interview post-draft about filling the RW and C positions. Well, more like the way he wasn’t talking. He didn’t even mention Nylander when asked who could replace Feds. I wouldn’t count on Fehr being ready for the start of the season, not with surgery on both shoulders. I also think there’s a good possibility of Clark being on the first line with Fehr out. Occasionally, the Ovechkin-Backstrom-Semin line will work, but a lot of times they end up too cute and not selfish enough to just shoot. So maybe without Fehr and Nylander:
Ovechkin-Backstrom-Clark
Fleischmann-Laich-Semin
Bourque-Steckel-Bradley
Osala-Gordon-Aucoin
Then with Fehr, maybe:
Ovechkin-Backstrom-Fehr
Fleischmann-Laich-Semin
Bourque-Steckel-Clark
Bradley-Gordon-Aucoin
I don’t really know. Some of it might not make sense, but I’m just taking some guesses. I’m not too familiar with Osala, except that he’s a big body and it seems like most people believe he should stay in Hershey for another year. I saw a little of Bourque during Game 4 of the Calder Finals, and it seems like he’s got decent speed and good hands. Aucoin looked pretty good when he got called up and had those 96 points in the AHL. I just didn’t know about having two small guys on the same line together so I split them up on the third and fourth.
by letsgocaps on Jun 30, 2009 2:21 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It’s possible, but since we didn’t seem to have that problem when the Hershey guys made up half our blueline either last December, I’m not convinced it was just the opposition, either.
I can see how you could argue Osala. The answer might be in development camp just a couple of weeks away. I suspect that’ll provide a lot of the true answers as to who we really need to buy.
"It is better to die on your feet than to live on your knees." - Delores Ibarruri
by gotsparkly on Jun 30, 2009 7:25 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
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| GP | W | L | OTL | PT | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
Washington
|
16 | 9 | 3 | 4 | 22 |
|
Tampa Bay
|
14 | 5 | 4 | 5 | 15 |
|
Atlanta
|
12 | 6 | 5 | 1 | 13 |
|
Florida
|
14 | 5 | 8 | 1 | 11 |
|
Carolina
|
15 | 2 | 10 | 3 | 7 |
(updated 11.7.2009 at 9:10 AM EST)
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