Alex Ovechkin's Spin on the Wheel of Justice
by Becca H on Nov 27, 2009 1:04 PM EST
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PrintCatch-22 n. A situation in which a desired outcome or solution is impossible to attain because of a set of inherently illogical rules.
There’s always plenty of talk about the inconsistencies of the NHL’s disciplinary system – and it usually seems to be justified. The mere fact that one player can get a six-game suspension for saying something mildly offensive about an ex while another player gets nothing for a ridiculously dangerous hit just demonstrates how inconsistent the League can be.
And yet every so often they are put in the near-impossible situation of having whatever call they make be the wrong one.
This was the case after Wednesday’s Capitals-Sabres game. When Alex Ovechkin hit Buffalo’s Patrick Kaleta into the boards, drawing a bloody nose for Kaleta – and a five-minute major and game misconduct for Ovechkin – it created one of those lose-lose situations for Colin Campbell and friends.
Not moments after the hit took place, there were many advocating a suspension or predicting that the NHL's so-called "double standard" would take effect, while defenders of #8 who offered their own rebuttals were largely shouted down. It became the talk of the hockey world on the eve of Thanksgiving as we all awaited the league’s final word, overshadowing what was ultimately a great team win by the Capitals.
The verdict? No suspension.
So naturally the fact that the league once again "ignored" one of Ovechkin’s hits meant that they were letting him get away with murder simply because of who he is. If things had been reversed, the detractors said, Kaleta would’ve gotten five games. Ten games. Hell, they’d have drummed him out of the league for daring to bloody the nose of the great Alex Ovechkin. The league’s preferential treatment of its superstars continues on...and abandon all hope, ye who have the misfortune of getting pummeled by them.
And yet if the League had actually taken disciplinary action against Ovechkin, had wielded the hammer of justice and sat him for a game or two, it would have been equally bad – because it would have been the wrong call.
Fans around the NHL were treated to just one replay of the hit, the one provided by MSG (home of the Buffalo Sabres) for inclusion in the highlight package for that evening’s game. They watched the hit just as Rick Jeanneret’s voice, apoplectic as always, was informing them in no uncertain terms that this was a horrific, dirty, bloodying hit from behind. The visual and the audio just do not match – but it’s the impassioned squealing of Jeanneret that likely makes some think it was worse than it was. Take a look and a listen:
Watching it on mute gives the full story, without the assistance of Jeanneret and his noted homerism, without the aid of the Comcast crew and their much more forgiving audio.
Kaleta has the puck. He’s positioned just about a foot away from the boards, when he glances up and to the left. We can’t see him at home, but there’s no way Kaleta misses Ovechkin barreling toward him. And instead of getting rid of the puck quickly and moving away…he turns. He stupidly puts himself in a vulnerable position, and yet Ovechkin still manages to catch him with a shoulder – no hit from behind, no elbow to the head. Just speed, power, two inches and 53 pounds on Kaleta that propel him into the boards.
It’s maybe - maybe - a two-minute minor for boarding. We can't be so blind in our loyalty as to ignore the fact that Ovechkin often straddles the line between legal and illegal checks, and this was right in that gray area. Even giving Ovechkin a five-minute major for the hit is somewhat understandable (albeit wrong) given the fact that the referees had a split second to make the call, that there’s been increased pressure to crack down on borderline hits, and that Kaleta was injured on the play.
Worthy of a suspension, though? Not even close.
At some point we as fans have to stop taking everything as an all or nothing scenario. Whether or not the league legitimately uses restraint against superstars isn’t the question here - at least not one we can answer with any certainty. Its always seemed like more of an inconsistency than a bias towards or against any one group of players.
Even if there is that restraint, the league has never been afraid to at least levy a fine on Ovechkin when they thought he crossed the line - and they didn't do that here. We've seen worse hits get less, from superstars and fourth-liners alike; we've seen suspensions much too harsh on plays that were milder than this, as well.
And just as Ovechkin isn’t automatically innocent because he’s Ovechkin, he isn’t automatically guilty because of it, either.
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After watching the replay, I think the proper call should have been charging and not boarding because A.O. hit Kaleta from the side and not from behind. Though I think the five minutes were warrented because of the crackdown.
However, I’m glad that Ruff kept his cool and Golisano hasn’t felt the need to write another leter…
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I think 2 minutes for charging is the right call there. From where I was sitting I could see one of the Refs (not sure which one) make the charging signal right after the whistle was blown.
by Hammerfists of Doom on Nov 27, 2009 1:45 PM EST up reply actions
I don’t see the charging. He stopped skating before he hit Kaleta.
“Charging shall mean the actions of a player who, as a result of distance traveled, shall violently check an opponent in any manner.”
The NHL Rulebook is unclear about what exactly charging is, because a violent check is not always charging. My understanding is that charging is when a player continues to make strides when approaching the player they are about to check. Ovi doesn’t do that here, and by my understanding, (i’m not 100% sure that its right) there is no charging here.
You’re right that by the rulebook definition any hard hit could be called charging, but that the NHL only usually calls charges when players take two or more strides and continue skating through the guy they hit.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
I think charging might have been appropriate because he seemed to have come pretty far across the ice to make the hit. Then again, I could be making up my own rule, although I could have sworn I heard it described that way at least once.
The thing the league needs to look at is its officiating crew. That’s a marginal 2-minute minor, not a marginal game misconduct. Hits resulting in majors like that need to be reviewed while the game is still going, because there’s no way that Ovechkin shouldn’t have been back on the ice in 2 minutes (4 if they counted his blood).
The main reason I really don’t like this is the 41-game probation he’s now on. Ovechkin lays out tons of hits like that every game, most of which way more devastating. If Ovechkin encounters more bad refereeing like that, he’ll get a 1-game suspension for likely as weak a hit as that.
by DrinkingPartner on Nov 27, 2009 1:14 PM EST reply actions
Hits resulting in majors like that need to be reviewed while the game is still going, because there’s no way that Ovechkin shouldn’t have been back on the ice in 2 minutes (4 if they counted his blood).
I think that’d undermine the authority of the on-ice officials far too much to be a good idea.
I think that’s the point: the call was that bad. If referees don’t get punished or corrected, what keeps them from making these mistakes over and over again?
by DrinkingPartner on Nov 27, 2009 11:52 PM EST up reply actions
They get punished privately. The league definitely reviews their performance and working playoff games is a reward for refs.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
if they counted his blood
what blood? The three drops? Kaleta’s skating around in near hysterics like a 12 year old drama queen. I’ve seen high sticks that draw far more blood that go completely uncalled. Kaleta acted like every ounce of blood in his body was gushing out. Man up and stop your crying, Kaleta.
Do I have to go off for this?
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What blood, I thought that was sweat?
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by Christoph J on Nov 27, 2009 4:56 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
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Ref: “uh, no dude … that’s you’re blood … you’re gonna have get off the ice and back to the make-up room”
"wanna go, pretty boy?" -Mr. Carl Racki
by Christoph J on Nov 27, 2009 4:59 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Aww ... shit ... really?
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“damn … really? it’s like three drops right? you sure it’s not Kaleta’s?”
"wanna go, pretty boy?" -Mr. Carl Racki
by Christoph J on Nov 27, 2009 5:03 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
really? Please don't send me off ... they're going to laugh at me
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“It was no big deal. I regularly bleed, so it is nothing new,” Bradley said, according to The Wash Times. “It seems like my skin is pretty paper-ish, so a few stitches and no big deal.”
"wanna go, pretty boy?" -Mr. Carl Racki
Comment on Buffalo’s game today (I know it belongs in OT Hockey Thread, but it’s oddly appropriate here).
Kaleta got his own 5 minute major boarding call today against Philly for a much more egregious hit from behind.
by Steckel Me Elmo on Nov 27, 2009 1:26 PM EST reply actions
I saw that – I wonder how many people will still take a “told you so” approach if Kaleta gets suspended, even if the hit was much more egregious. Which is why I get annoyed with people using the superstar bias argument so much; every case is different.
This is what a 5-and-a-game hit really looks like and this is what a suspendable hit looks like. Right between the numbers, high speed, head right into the glass. What an asshole.
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 27, 2009 4:26 PM EST up reply actions
The hit isn’t as bad as I originally thought, but it is still far worse than the hit Ovechkin laid on Kaleta.
by Steckel Me Elmo on Nov 27, 2009 4:29 PM EST up reply actions
He doesn’t take off from the center line to hit someone behind the net, that’s about the only saving grace there is, as far as I can see.
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 27, 2009 4:31 PM EST up reply actions
Worse than the AO hit but not suspendable IMO. Ross saw him coming and turned into that hit. Kaleta was definitely going as fast as AO, and planted his shoulder into Ross’ numbers, but the fact that Ross saw it coming and didn’t defend himself makes it a no-suspension to me. The issue with hits from behind is taking advantage of guys that don’t see it coming. Both Kaleta and Ross saw it coming, though Kaleta probably had a higher duty to hold up because he got him in the back.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
What the hell is wrong with players nowadays that they’re putting themselves in the worst possible position for impact? Ross CLEARLY sees Kaleta and turns his back to him. I guess it’s instinct, but it’s dangerous as hell.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
The first time I saw the hit it looked to me like Kaleta just drilled Ross right in the numbers, but that’s because I only saw the tail end. I think the refs got this right, and there should be no suspension. There is responsibility on a player to not purposely put himself in a vulnerable position in the way Ross and Kaleta did, but there is also responsibility for the hitter to not make a dangerous play.
by Steckel Me Elmo on Nov 27, 2009 5:05 PM EST up reply actions
What I missed the first time is Ross glancing Kaleta’s way, then looking back down to play the puck and swing his hips parallel with the boards. Kaleta exploded into his numbers slightly after that, but I would now question his ability to stop in that reaction time. I’m with you in that I’m less enraged with that hit than I was to start with.
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 27, 2009 5:17 PM EST up reply actions
I obviously completely agree but it’s a tenuous argument to make because you open yourself up to the “so you’re saying the victim was asking for it?” accusations.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
Part of the thrill of hockey is watching the courage of guys holding the puck an extra split-second to make a great play, knowing that it’s going to cost them a big hit.
Hockey needs to not eliminate that. And it means hockey needs to not eliminate the big hit. If a guy chooses to let himself be vulnerable for the good of his team, then that’s his choice.
Atta dinnin stick a who!
by Gould Old Days on Nov 27, 2009 5:11 PM EST up reply actions
Exactly. “Take the hit to make a play” is a constant mantra in hockey. If you tell AO and Kaleta to pull up on these hits because guys turned their backs then every soft sack player that doesn’t want to get hit is going to put himself in vulnerable positions to try to not get hit. Talk about perverse results. The guy has to weigh his ability to make a play against his threat of getting destroyed. If he sees it coming and doesn’t bail on the play, good for him and his team, but you have no right to cry for a foul.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
Emery needs a talking too after that play. That play was like a QB that leads his receiver a bit high and a bit wide down the middle of the field. Ross had no chance, once he stopped (and he had too in order to avoid Emery) he was a dead man.
"I think the relentless negative coverage in The Washington Post is a real difference from previous years," Redskins general counsel David Donovan said. "But in terms of the way our actual fans are behaving, we don't see any difference."
True, but it’s a separate issue from the legality of the hit. I am often surprised by how poorly NHL goalies help their D out. You would think by that point they would have some of the simple stuff down; like putting the puck on the right side of their D’s body and not putting them in a position to get smoked by a forechecker.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
I agree that its entirely unrelated to the legality of the hit, but it does speak to Ross and his ability to defend himself. He’s forced to make a choice of either putting himself in a bad position to make a play, or defending himself and not making any sort of play. If Emery just wings that Ross is out free and clear.
"I think the relentless negative coverage in The Washington Post is a real difference from previous years," Redskins general counsel David Donovan said. "But in terms of the way our actual fans are behaving, we don't see any difference."
This conversation also ties in nicely with the trapezoid rules and the obstruction rules regarding D holding up the forecheck for their partners. As much as the new rules have made it easier to create and sustain offense, it has also made life much more dangerous for the D.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
Right. I didn’t mean that as exculpatory for Kaleta, but rather just generally that guys need to brace themselves and prepare for hits and not increase their own vulnerability – you’ve got enough to worry about with idiots like Kaleta running around without loading the gun for him and aiming it at your own head.
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Definitely. It’s not like these guys are being attacked in a dark alley or something. They play hockey and should expect and prepare to get hit – which means keeping your head up, not standing a foot away from the boards, not turning your back to it, etc. If someone still hits a guy who has done all he can (or can’t do anything) then we’ve got a hit worthy of suspension.
…also, that was probably the first comment on a hockey blog that ever used the word “exculpatory”. Nice, counselor.
See, that was my first thought too, but how else is the guy supposed to play the puck. It was his follow through that caused his shoulders to turn. I don’t think the hit was that bad, but I have hard time blaming the guy who got hit. He was just playing the puck.
Well that’s why you finish your checks. So players won’t make the right play with the puck. The goal of Kaleta is to make Ross make a half-assed pass so he can protect himself. Ross tried to make the full pass and put himself at greater risk. He didn’t have to play the puck in a way that turned him face first to the boards, he could have played it the other way and faced up to Kaleta. Just stupid on Ross’ part.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
The reason that OV got tossed was not because of the hit, but because it drew blood right?
"I think the relentless negative coverage in The Washington Post is a real difference from previous years," Redskins general counsel David Donovan said. "But in terms of the way our actual fans are behaving, we don't see any difference."
I posted a couple of other links that reference this topic in yesterday’s Clips thread. It was probably fortunate that this event occurred on Thanksgiving Eve when folks were about to be distracted by more pressing matters like food and in-laws.
The bad part is it adds to the List. The List that Don Cherry the haterz will refer to each and every time a call is made or not made.
If you want more reading on the subject of players with a ‘dirty’ rep, go here.
SO FЯIENDS, IS BATTLE NOW.
Yup, that’s actually where I started in my search for the anti-Ovechkin crowd :)
As I told the boys while writing the post, I just had a general sense from what I was seeing on Twitter and the snarky asides on blogs that I read that this was happening – appreciated the help on finding some links to back it up, thank you!
The listing I found for Kaleta had him at 180lbs; Ovie was listed at 233. Is it different elsewhere?
F = M x A
Ovi’s got a fair amount of M and decent A. The F is likely to be substantial.
SO FЯIENDS, IS BATTLE NOW.
Well, M x A is not really important here.
Assume that Ovi is moving with a constant speed, that is, A = 0. Would Kaleta anyway fly off? Of course he will, and this is really due to the energy/momentum conservation laws. To make a long physics/kinematics story short, the larger the difference in object masses, the better is the transfer of energy/momentum.
by fnralch on Nov 27, 2009 5:07 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Yep, it’s all about impulse.
Or put plainly, it’s not the drop, it’s the sudden stop.
by Knee high to a duck on Nov 27, 2009 7:15 PM EST up reply actions
From Die By The Blade:
The video is not very good and it is difficult to see the hit clearly. I thought the hit came more from the side and not from the back. It was a little bit late but was basically a clean hit. This is the type of hit that Kaleta throws all the time and this time he was on the receiving end
If even SABRES fans think its pretty much okay, it shouldn’t even be an issue.
Ron and Fez 11 to 3
by YvonLabresMoustache on Nov 27, 2009 1:31 PM EST reply actions
That’s just one particularly reasonable Sabers fan. I don’t think he’s representative. I do however, welcome any Slugs fans that wish to convince the Rink that AO is a headhunter or even that that was a dirty hit. Make my post-Thanksgiving Day.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
Wheel of Fish > Wheel of Justice
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Likely because you’ve got it cached. Tripod rejects most hotlinked image requests.
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Puck Daddy agrees.
Acknowledges the questionable nature of some of Ovechkin’s hits, but agrees that no suspension is necessary.
Does drawing blood result in an automatic ejection? or did he say something naughty to the ref?
I’m glad to see he’s back to his old self, careening around the ice like a drunken lunatic, most likely to score when he seems most out of control. Keeps the opposition paralyzed somehwere between shock and awe. Lovely.
In the game day thread, it was quoted from the rulebook that an injury (in this case, nosebleed) on a five minute major is an automatic game misconduct.
Grrrr!
Somebody please tell me when bleeding became the great, modern medical and officiating indicator of severity, something I can get from a paper cut is suddenly more serious than, oh I don’t know… What happened to Q, where I believe there was no blood.
Can’t we all agree it ISN’T really an indicator of anything other than… Bleeding. How many nasty high sticks have we all seen with no blood and yet the mildest brushes go for 4.
Ah NHL officiating, where logic is a baffling ordeal.
DC, where Hockey is a baffling ordeal.
by Chris meet Alex on Nov 28, 2009 2:50 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Here, bleeding will earn a 5 minute major but David Backes’ “infamous” cross-check of Semin in the back did not earn a penalty at all. Semin could barely walk the next day. (Backes also tends to get a lot of penalty minutes.)
Rocking the Red since 1975
That crosscheck may be infamous, but it was not all that bad. Knuble walks away from that crosscheck ten times again. What’s that saying? When you fall off, just get back on your My Little Pony?
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
Blood is objective, and objective > subjective when it comes to refs, IMO. I don’t love the distinction (and I remember Kozlov getting 4 PIM for a high stick when there was no blood because it was a pretty brutal high stick, so the rule isn’t in stone) but it’s better than asking the refs to determine “how bad it was” on a case by case basis. That leads to more ridiculous calls because of poor vision, and more guys diving and embellishing to get the 4. I have yet to catch a guy opening himself up to get the 4, though logic tells me it is almost guaranteed to have happened at some point.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
I wondered if anyone who easily bleeds, like a certain papery-faced Capital, had tried that as well, buy my guess is that these guys know there are always 5 cameras on them and they wouldn’t get away with it (and be forever branded).
Agreed, thus I am actually calling for even less subjectivity… take out the bleeding “clause” all together. I have been a long opponent of the leagues inconsistent and subjective officiating and punishment, and think this falls right in the same area. Rarely does the 2 or 4 actually seem to match the severity of the infraction. So in a league that is suposedly cracking down on shots to the head, go simple, high sticks are 4. Period.
DC, where Hockey is a baffling ordeal.
by Chris meet Alex on Nov 28, 2009 8:35 PM EST up reply actions
The Bleeding Claus is Rob Zombie’s upcoming Xmas/horror film about the lesser known Claus brother set to come out in time for the Holidays.
He’s a good filmmaker… a true arTeist!
DC, where Hockey is a baffling ordeal.
by Chris meet Alex on Nov 28, 2009 8:38 PM EST up reply actions
I didn’t think the hit was that bad, but it probably would’ve garnered a suspension had it not been Ovie. That’s the sad truth about the league’s discipline system.
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by Brad_Richards_Rocks on Nov 27, 2009 2:06 PM EST reply actions
Which is a problem because that hit wouldn’t have warranted a suspension no matter who threw it.
by Steckel Me Elmo on Nov 27, 2009 2:18 PM EST up reply actions
Somewhat related, do we think Ovie would have gotten a one-game suspension for the Briere hit if it happened now, after his “history” of questionable hits? As I recall that was dismissed with just a fine partly because he wasn’t a repeat offender; of all his hits, that’s the one where a suspension seemed justified. To me, anyway.
That hit deserved a suspension. If you nail a guy in the numbers, you should be suspended. Those hits go unpunished all the time (couch Slava Kozlov cough), but they deserve to be suspended.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
Completely agree. I was actually surprised he didn’t get one; most Caps fans I talked to at the time were also surprised by it and thought he deserved at least a game.
By the way, nice job responding to the folks @ Hockey Wilderness. Interesting that your comments, all of which were well thought out and rational, were basically ignored. I guess it’s more fun just to hate or make accusations about a leaguewide bias than to engage in logical debate. But way to rep Caps fans over there nonetheless :)
We’ll see. The Wild are playing right now so I’ll give them the benefit of the doubt that they are just watching the game and will respond later. I wouldn’t be shocked to be ignored, though. I commented at Die by the Blade and they just ignored it.
(And I thought AO was suspended for the hit on Briere, am I wrong on that?)
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
Ah – right, forgot about that. None of the people who left comments responded, though, that was mostly what I was looking at. Sabres fans ignored you, too, huh?
(And nope, he wasn’t. $1000 fine.)
Yeah I’m not shocked the Sabers fans ignored me. I’m still being ignored on HW but now DMG is in there representing the Rink’s team toughness.
(OT, but I commented in the OT Hockey thread about Nate Thompson getting into another team toughness situation with the Penguins. Interesting situation for those that were involved in the “win games or defend your teammates” debate.)
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
I'm bored ...
and feel like venturing over to the Hockey Wilderness … @Becca H and @F n’ B … where did you post your comments?
"wanna go, pretty boy?" -Mr. Carl Racki
I haven’t commented on anything (yet) – waiting to see whether it’s even worth it, but F n’ B and DMG have both weighed in here. Rink unity, y’all! Go forth and comment (nicely).
Make sure your avatars are tied down if you decide to drop the gloves.
SO FЯIENDS, IS BATTLE NOW.
by EmilyB on Nov 27, 2009 5:21 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
that was a failed
attempt on sarcasm … @ Your Nation’s Capital. I get an F. Sorry.
"wanna go, pretty boy?" -Mr. Carl Racki
ok
thanks Becca H. i was being lazy there and should’ve searched out on my own. i’ll be nice …
"wanna go, pretty boy?" -Mr. Carl Racki
worth pointing out:
notice how the author only ventures into the debate once (and doesn’t follow up, except to point out how his prediction had magically come true). and how none of the blog co-authors make an appearance in the comments. now you know why the japers’ rink comment section is so inviting. everyone here, blogfather included, is willing to stick out an argument and defend his/her position.
by Natty Bumppo on Nov 27, 2009 7:33 PM EST up reply actions
Well it’s only inviting if you aren’t an idiot. And you want stimulating hockey discussion. If you want to us we’re stupid and don’t know what we’re talking about, well….
[insert shark or alligator pic]
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
acknowledged, but i should clarify that i meant inviting to the reader, not inviting to the commenter. as much as i comment here now, i still come more to read and learn than i do to debate (and that includes the comment section). you’re right, other blogs are probably more inviting to the average internet commenter.
by Natty Bumppo on Nov 27, 2009 7:51 PM EST up reply actions
i used the correlation <> causation comic in a presentation the other day…still unsure if the prof. appreciated.
by Natty Bumppo on Nov 27, 2009 7:59 PM EST up reply actions
Pay the man Shirley.
DC, where Hockey is a baffling ordeal.
by Chris meet Alex on Nov 28, 2009 2:39 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Guess you spoke too soon. He jumped back in and responded to our arguments and was genuinely appreciative of our involvement in the discussion.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
This hit pales in comparison to what Handzus did to Hemsky..
Editor of The Copper & Blue, and leader of The Cult Of Hartikainen.
Handzus/Hemsky just doesn’t make sense to me. I’ve watched it several times and can’t figure out what’s going on. Why is Hemsky already so low when the hit comes? Why is he so far from the boards?
We see that kind of play 10 times a game. A guy goes behind the net and gets squashed on the boards. His feet are normally right against the boards, so there’s no “down” for him to go. They normally just get stood up. But here, Hemsky is far from the boards and is bending down, and then Handzus pushes him down further before driving his head into the boards. I honestly can’t tell whose fault that is. The whole play is just so strange.
Atta dinnin stick a who!
by Gould Old Days on Nov 27, 2009 5:08 PM EST up reply actions
Hemsky passes Handzus so that’s why he’s still far from the boards. He wasn’t set up against the glass when he got hit; a type of hit that is normal and usually acceptable to me. The problem was that Hemsky passed Handzus and thus was vulnerable until he gets to the boards. Handzus takes advantage and gives a little cross check putting Hemsky face first into the glass. The reason Hemsky was hunched so much, I’m guessing, is to brace himself for potential contact and keep his center of gravity low. It really helps to get “low in your stance” when you are battling along the boards. This hit reminds me a lot of Slava Kozlov on Gomez, a hit that I’ve already spent enough time bitching about on this site. I’m with Derek, this is much more dangerous of a hit.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
Can Hemsky protect himself better and still make the pass? And what should Hanzus have done? Is it possible to make a legal check on Hemsky in that situation? It’s hard to hit Hemsky anywhere but high, since Hemsky’s already down low.
Atta dinnin stick a who!
by Gould Old Days on Nov 27, 2009 5:17 PM EST up reply actions
I’d say Handzus at that point, having already lost the body position battle, needs to just shadow Hemsky along the boards and try to pinch him off. At some point Hemsky is going to have to turn his hips and then you can lay into him. Even if he doesn’t if you do it less aggressively you can apply pressure to the back to angle him to the boards and glass without sending him face first into the glass. Handzus really needed to cut off Hemsky before Hemsky got in front of him and then take the puck.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
btw
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cIXcGOr4-04&feature=player_embedded
don’t mean to beat a dead horse, but am I the only one who thinks this christmas present by MR isn’t dirty and if even considered so … it’s not THAT dirty. ok, there goes my gloves …
"wanna go, pretty boy?" -Mr. Carl Racki
My verdict is “legal but ugly.” At that moment, Richards potentially holds Booth’s career in his hands. Out of respect for an opponent, he should lay up a bit instead of pressing every bit of advantage he had. But I am very concerned about the NHL passing a rule meant to cover this situation, given the trouble they have enforcing the rules they already have.
Atta dinnin stick a who!
by Gould Old Days on Nov 27, 2009 6:01 PM EST up reply actions
The problem is definitely enforcement, but the existing rules already allow punishment for that hit. They don’t need to add a new rule; they can just change the enforcement standard. I’m more concerned with the Ontario Angel’s hit on Booth than either AO’s hit or Kaleta’s hit. When a guy doesn’t see you coming and you still target the head with full force… well, then you’re just an asshole. I think blindside hits to the head should be punished with extreme prejudice. If you are going to smoke a guy blindside it should be strict liability to make contact with center mass, not the head.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
So Richards is the “Ontario Angel”? Gee, isn’t he the very same guy who “pronged” Ovi at the World Junior Games in late 2004-early 2005. Note: I coined the word in honor of Chris Pronger for his injury causing hit to Mike Green last year. You can just hear the sound “prong” for such a hit. So onomotopeaic.
Rocking the Red since 1975
Yeah it’s the same guy. But I haven’t actually seen the hit Richards laid on AO so I have no idea if it was clean or dirty.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
I didn’t see the hit either. All I know is that Ovi was injured as a resulf and was out for a while after that. There were reports that the Canadians were “pronging” Ovi on purpose.
Rocking the Red since 1975
AO v. Richards 10/27/2009 (4-2 Caps) Mike’s dad was in the stands to fully appreciate:
SO FЯIENDS, IS BATTLE NOW.
No, payback time was when he destroyed Mike Richards in the dying seconds of game 1 v. PHI when the Caps were protecting the lead. He cleaned Richards out along the boards and then got the final clear of the game. Such a sweet play.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
Yeah. As the clip YNC posted shows, there’s plenty left in this battle. The last laugh won’t be had for years.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
Surprizingly
That GIF pops up all the time on Pension Plan Puppets
Space Weed Says Telling it like it is without a care about the mainstream's feelings
"DO NOT get stuck behind Kyle Wellwood in the buffet line. This isn't really etiquette, but it will prevent you from starving to death"- Down Goes Brown on Etiquette for Jason Spezza's wedding
by Kevin Sellathamby on Nov 28, 2009 4:14 PM EST up reply actions
Mike’s dad was in the stands to fully appreciate.
mike’s dad could’ve caught him he stayed in the air so long.
by Natty Bumppo on Nov 27, 2009 7:37 PM EST up reply actions
the more I see this ...
not only do I love the hit itself, but how quickly Richards recovered from being tossed like a rag doll. pretty impressive stuff between the two. this rivalry has to be up there in my top 3 … (Ovi vs Chara, etc.)
"wanna go, pretty boy?" -Mr. Carl Racki
I know someone will want to collapse this...
That clip mesmerizes me like the ’hof gif.
One guy just drove his semi as a float. I guess semis are cool.
Of course they were, he’s the best player on the biggest rival. They always target those guys. Team Canada’s WJC team always has guys out there simply to fuck with the opposition’s best players. It’s what SDR did to JVR this last year.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
Agree. Every time I see that hit by Richards, I’m stunned that he didn’t get 1, 3, or 5 game suspension from a league that decries hits to the head and promises greater enforcement this season.
Booth was blind, the pass was gone, MR targeted the head. It’s not like Richards is so large (Pronger/Chara large) that he can’t help but hit guys with an elbow to the forehead. Legal by the book, maybe, but that’s why there’s so much room for judgment in terms of suspension and punishment by Colin Campbell et. al.
KO'd by Tryptophan in the 12th round ...
didn’t mean to throw out that Richard’s hit on Booth and then take off, but there’s a little slugfest I’m having with Thanksgiving leftovers! brb …
"wanna go, pretty boy?" -Mr. Carl Racki
well ...
turns out the power outtage KO’d me there for a bit at my folks house … anyone else in the Springfield/Lorton area of NoVA? catch me up. Any good discourse happening in the Hockey Wildnerness or nary a single peep more from our Minnesota brethen? so many questions …
"wanna go, pretty boy?" -Mr. Carl Racki
I may be way off base here, but if the hit was in open ice, this is a non issue and no penalty, IDK if an open ice hit on the numbers is charging or not, but even that would not count in this case (maybe on Kalita’stoday?). AO clearly hit him on the shoulder. The penalty comes in because Kalita hit the boards. He saw the hit coming (the replay shows it) and took one for the team. Good on him. It should have been a 4 minute minor. 2 for boarding/charging (take your pick) and the automatic 2 for drawing blood, nothing more.
If you don't wanna get hit, KEEP YOUR HEAD UP!
Kaleta boards Jared Ross in Philly game 11/27/09
Same situation, 5 minute major, and game misconduct.
Lindy Ruff on the incident:
“[Ross] knew he was coming,” Ruff said. “He took a quick look right before, and then he turned. The difference there is it was a young player called up, he knows he’s going to get hit on a heavy forecheck, and at the last second you’re asking our player to hit the brakes.”
Sound a little like Ovechkin and BB’s subsequent defense of Ov’s hit on Kaleta??
It was amazing he did it — so soon after being Ovi’s “victim”. When Ovi had done it to him, someone on the Buffalo blog even had said that he was on the receivng end of the type of hit he normally gives. And Caps fans were saying they were pleased that Ovi had done it to him.
Rocking the Red since 1975
It's hard to get churned up about rough play and the Flyers in the same sentence
But Ruff is wrong in this regard: The Flyers player did look up…to see #22 coming from his right, but Ross did not see Kaleta, who was coming from the left side and slightly behind. Ross sees #22, spins counterclockwise to brace for the anticipated hit from the right, but Kaleta gets to him first and hits him from behind…hard to fault Kaleta really, and an unlucky turn for the rook will be a teaching moment.
Support your local bakery!
by bigonetimer on Nov 28, 2009 10:44 AM EST up reply actions
Are you suggesting Ross didn’t see Kaleta coming? Or is that what Ruff said?
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
Ross didn’t see Kaleta the same way Kaleta saw Ovie, I think. Ross looked like he saw the guy to his right, might’ve glimpsed Kaleta at the edge of his peripheral vision, but hardly saw him, it looked like to be on the replay.
by red army line on Nov 28, 2009 3:30 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah I watched it a couple more times and I’m not as positive Ross saw it coming. On the link posted by Kukla’s Korner it’s much less clear whether Ross saw him or not. The link that SME posted first seemed like he did.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
Will Kaleta eventually join the Philadelphia Flyers? It seems that many personal nemeses of Caps end up there. (Richards, Pronger, Briere)
For that matter, will David Backes end up there, too?
Rocking the Red since 1975
If Backes somehow became available, I would snatch that kid up in a second.
Support your local bakery!
by bigonetimer on Nov 28, 2009 10:47 AM EST up reply actions
i’m not giving him away for cheap in the JRHL, though! even if he’s not putting up points, he rounds out my ATOI, PIMs and SOGs pretty nicely. and he did score in each of his last two games..
by Natty Bumppo on Nov 28, 2009 11:47 AM EST up reply actions
Can’t give anyone away for cheap in that league because there’s not much depth in the FA pool. Tkachuk has sucked since the second week of the season but there still aren’t many upgrades available.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
I gave him away for cheap…
Of all our iniquities ignorance may be the worst
by Killer_Carlson on Nov 28, 2009 1:52 PM EST up reply actions
the team i’d want to look at as a GM would be columbus. inexplicable to me how hitchcock buries his talented young players. the TOI for brassard and voracek is way too low (and everyone knows the fate of filatov, who is now talking about staying over in the KHL for another year after scoring game-winning goals in three straight games). if hitchcock is convinced those guys will never be fits in his system, then the GM might be forced to move them while they still have value.
by Natty Bumppo on Nov 28, 2009 11:54 AM EST up reply actions
Hitch has always buried his young players. He doesn’t trust them defensively (and I think he may be part of that old school “earn your minutes with years of service” types). I think Andy Murray is actually the same way, which speaks well of the STL young guys.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
NHL RULES? WHAT RULES?
The way I see it, if every third line player will choose not to brace himself for the hit of the opposing team top player, and instead will turn his back to the hit and take one for the team and perhaps will end up with the bloody nose it MAY become a smart STRATEGICAL play, pretty much like challenging the same top player for a fight for matching majors. If this practice will continue and every drop of the blood will cause ejection from the game, then what – hockey will become no-contact sport? I am not advocating for dangerous violent hits and certainly want to see players having long and healthy careers in hockey, however, the way NHL is handling this seems ridiculous to me.
Aaaaaaaand here comes the circus…
Of all our iniquities ignorance may be the worst
by Killer_Carlson on Nov 28, 2009 4:41 PM EST up reply actions
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|
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|
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