Re-defining Secondary Scoring
by Becca H on Oct 27, 2009 11:00 AM EDT
129 comments
[Ed. note: The newest member of our Rink family needs no introduction, but if we didn't give her one, you wouldn't know how happy we are to have her aboard. So please welcome CapsChick (you know her from A View From the Cheap Seats) and make her feel at home.]
We're about a month into the 2009-10 season and the Caps are sitting at or near the top of both the Southeast Division and the Eastern Conference standings. Yet despite a start that looks great on paper, the Caps have some holes to fill and some flaws to fix before anyone – Caps fans included – will believe that they’re a true contender.
One area of potential concern is the seeming lack of secondary scoring. Reasonable minds may differ on what secondary scoring means (Pepper yesterday defined it as scoring from other than the Big Four -- Alex Ovechkin, Alexander Semin, Nicklas Backstrom and Mike Green -- and Mike Knuble). Here, we'll take a bit more critical and demanding view of balanced team scoring and define it as goals from people other than those Big Four, Knuble, Brooks Laich, and Brendan Morrison. Through ten games this year the Caps have scored 36 goals, a mark which puts them in fourth in the League in goals per game. Of those 36 goals, only 8 have come from someone besides the top two lines and Green (and five of those came last Thursday in Atlanta).
Secondary scoring is absolutely a key to success, and the lack thereof can be cause for some concern. And yes, there are some players who need to pick up the offense as the season goes on – no team gets very far if they don't have help from throughout their lineup, and it's often the workhorses who make the difference in the postseason.
But are we perhaps getting a little carried away.
Right now the Caps have two very talented scoring lines, each of which can provide a different style of attack (and even a different look from the day before, depending on which side of the bed Coach Boudreau wakes up).
In the five years since the lockout we have gradually broadened our definition of "primary" scoring. First primary scoring was Ovechkin and secondary scoring was everyone else. Then Alexander Semin threw his hat in the ring as the "two" of a dominant one-two punch, while Ovechkin boosted the numbers of his linemates Chris Clark and Dainius Zubrus and that was considered primary scoring.
Ergo, what has been considered "primary" has expanded year by year until eventually we reached the place we find ourselves in today, where "primary" has come to mean the entire top two lines and a defenseman - seven different players, almost a third of the team.
Over the last three years we’ve seen trades and free agents bring more talent to the lineup while prospects evolved into true scoring threats. With each year, the team has grown and presented a more diversified attack - while still centered around Ovechkin, he's no longer the only one lighting the lamp.
2007-08 - 23 goals scored through 10 games, with a combined 64 goals and assists
Ovechkin dominated early on in the 2007-08 season, going 6-7-13 in his first 10 games - good enough for over 25% of the teams goals and over a fifth of their points. But beyond Ovechkin, it was still all "secondary" scoring, with the next highest forward registering the same number of goals and just two more assists than defenseman Mike Green, and Chris Clark's 4 points putting him among the team leaders.
Keep in mind that this was in the dying days of the Hanlon era, a defensively tight system with emphasis on playing it safe and less on being offensively creative.
Moving on down the timeline...
2008-09 - 29 goals scored through 10 games, with a combined 78 goals and assists
Last season's slow start for Ovechkin opened the door for Semin to step in as the dominant scorer, picking up right where #8 had left off the year before. His goal and point totals were markedly higher than Ovechkin's early on, but they still represent about the same portion of the team's total offense. This time it was #28, not #8, who carried the load for the team as he doubled up on his next highest-scoring teammate.
Still, there was a bit more of a scoring spark throughout the rest of the team, as Tomas Fleischmann and Laich began contributing with more regularity alongside a young-at-heart Sergei Fedorov.
Which brings us to...
2009-10 - 36 goals scored through 10 games, with a combined 98 goals and assists
A couple of things stand out so far. The top six forwards are still providing the bulk of the offense, but they're doing so at a much more even pace than they have in recent years. Ovechkin is one of the league leaders in points and yet his percentage of the team's total points is way down – that's not a knock on him, of course, but a sign that the rest of the team is starting to chip in more.
Even if it's true, that consistent scoring from "only" a third of the team is somehow bad, is it accurate to say that it's all we've got? A certain professor might take exception to that.
So often this year complaints regarding a lack of secondary scoring have been accompanied by "except for Matt Bradley", thrown in almost as an afterthought. But Bradley's three goals shouldn't be overlooked, nor should the fact that he's been on quite a tear that dates back to the playoffs. It's a bit far-fetched to think he'll continue at this pace and finish with a projected 25 goals – but it is not out of the realm of possibility that he hits the 10-15 goal plateau, and that's nothing to sneeze at. Especially for a guy who has never scored more than nine.
Also not to be overlooked is the performance of the third and fourth lines against Atlanta last week, when the top two lines experienced a rare, synchronized off night. The whole underlying fear of not having secondary scoring is that all another team has to do is shut down your primary scorers and the game is over. But as the Thrashers meticulously shut down Ovechkin, Backstrom and the rest, others were stepping forward to make sure two points wouldn't get away.
Of course, the fact that the Young Guns and their new friends have been shut down just once in ten games, particularly considering some of the teams the Caps have played thus far, is a perfect example of just how hard it can be to stop six or seven talented scorers in the same game. It's incredibly tricky for opponents. If they shut down Ovechkin, there's Semin. Neutralize Laich, Mike Knuble can play the role. Backstrom and Morrison are a two-pronged attack of pure, playmaking skill; if the opponents take away passing lanes, there's always someone with a vicious shot waiting and vice versa.
And there's always Mike Green patrolling the blue line, waiting to strike.
At the end of the day we know that Ovechkin is going to score. We also know that because of him, others are going to put up points. What we're starting to see this year, though, is a more balanced distribution of points among those top six forwards and beyond. Mike Green is starting to chip in. Bradley, Laich and Fehr all have the potential to chip in, as does a healthy Tomas Fleischmann.
This team has for so long been Ovechkin and Friends, a tale of a high-octane, high-tempo, high-scoring superstar and his little sidekicks who chip in with a goal here or there.
So to complain about scoring from any one of six or seven guys when there finally are six or seven guys around to help out, to ignore the contributions of others whether they show up on paper or not, is to ignore the evolution this team continues to undertake.
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I thought this place could use a woman’s touch
"And next year it will be ours."
by Ovechwin on Oct 27, 2009 11:01 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Agreed – these boys need female supervision, you have no idea…
by Becca H on Oct 27, 2009 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Welcome! And hooray!!!!
IS PAЯTY NOW
by Your Nation's Capital on Oct 27, 2009 11:05 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
(Post just got a “welcome” rec)
IS PAЯTY NOW
by Your Nation's Capital on Oct 27, 2009 11:19 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
tl;dr
Just kidding.
Or am I?
Maybe play with an edge, be a little more physical -- maybe be more of a prick out there.
by jordanDC on Oct 27, 2009 11:05 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Still waiting on the exciting news…
I kid. It’s always good to add jobs in this economy.
"I'm just doing karate and trying to get females pregnant."
by Bald Pollack on Oct 27, 2009 11:06 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I liked this analysis. I hadn’t thought about how the definition of our “primary scoring” has evolved so much.
by MisterBungle on Oct 27, 2009 11:07 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Welcome!
Loved your Open Letter To Penguins Fans on your other site…great stuff
Ron and Fez 11 to 3
by YvonLabresMoustache on Oct 27, 2009 11:09 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Thank you – glad someone liked it! For some reason a lot of Pens fans weren’t too thrilled with it. Weird.
But no, in all seriousness that was a fun post for me because I actually did get a lot of great responses from Pens fans. And Caps fans. And fans from other teams.
by Becca H on Oct 27, 2009 11:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
can you give a direct line to that?
by RedBirdie on Oct 27, 2009 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It’s here: http://www.dccheapseats.com/?p=2210
Wade through the comments at your own risk…
by Becca H on Oct 27, 2009 11:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well…once it got called out on ThePensblog, it was only a matter of time before those savages showed up.
Ron and Fez 11 to 3
by YvonLabresMoustache on Oct 27, 2009 1:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yup. To be fair that was kind of my fault. I suggested it, thinking…well, I’m not really sure what I was thinking but it certainly brought out the knuckle-draggers en masse.
by Becca H on Oct 27, 2009 1:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Its not your fault. The comments section on Puck Daddy and CI alone remind me of the old George Carlin quote:
Just think of how stupid the average person is, and then realize half of them are even stupider
Ron and Fez 11 to 3
by YvonLabresMoustache on Oct 27, 2009 1:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wooo! Congrats and welcome aboard – does this mean that By The Numbers is coming here?
Also a true post. You didn’t mention Jeff Schultz – who ever heard of Jeff Schultz getting points in two consecutive games? If he keeps killing it the way he is, we might just get some extra offense from the blueline that isn’t named Mike Green, and THAT would be really nice.
Never lie, steal, cheat, or drink. But, if you must lie, lie in the arms of the one you love. If you must steal, steal away from bad company. If you must cheat, cheat death. If you must drink, drink in the moments that take your breath away.
by gotsparkly on Oct 27, 2009 11:10 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
She mentioned Schultz but, um, it may have been left on the cutting room floor at someone’s suggestion. But this is mostly a look at the forwards anyhoo.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
by J.P. on Oct 27, 2009 11:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Spot on, J.P.
Maybe play with an edge, be a little more physical -- maybe be more of a prick out there.
by jordanDC on Oct 27, 2009 11:12 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Yup, you all should know this – J.P. is a harsh, cruel dictator.
…er…I mean…crap. I’m getting sent back to the Cheap Seats, aren’t I?
by Becca H on Oct 27, 2009 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
worse, he’s going to send you to CI!
by RedBirdie on Oct 27, 2009 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Gah! Don’t even joke about that ;)
By the way, it’s funny because there is someone that posts on CI as “CapsChick” who is actually not me…luckily she’s always come across as fairly intelligent so it’s fine, but just in case there was any confusion…
by Becca H on Oct 27, 2009 2:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Perhaps this is her.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
by J.P. on Oct 27, 2009 2:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That’s too confusing. One of them has to leave town.
Maybe play with an edge, be a little more physical -- maybe be more of a prick out there.
by jordanDC on Oct 27, 2009 2:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I vote…not me.
Or maybe I’ll just change my posting name to my REAL name and be done with it…
by Becca H on Oct 27, 2009 2:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ok, but you have to include a middle initial.
"Let the rest be scared of us." - Sasha Semin
by Scott in Shaw on Oct 27, 2009 2:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Or just use your first name and where you live.
I actually live in VA, fuck I suck at this.
Maybe play with an edge, be a little more physical -- maybe be more of a prick out there.
by jordanDC on Oct 27, 2009 2:56 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Nah, it counts. I was born and raised in VA but when I went away to school, I still referred to myself as a Washingtonian.
Of course my Canadian friends would get confused about where VA was located, so it was also just easier to say “I’m from DC”.
by Becca H on Oct 27, 2009 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah. In other parts of the country, Virginia is thought of as backwoods. That’s actually West Virginia, as I found out during my several years there.
Maybe play with an edge, be a little more physical -- maybe be more of a prick out there.
by jordanDC on Oct 27, 2009 3:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It’s part of our overall blog toughness conditioning program. He gonna have you skate out a few bag posts now, just you watch.
IS PAЯTY NOW
by Your Nation's Capital on Oct 27, 2009 11:17 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
To prepare you. We need a new enforcer. We’ll loan ours to the Caps for a negative cap hit.
by red army line on Oct 27, 2009 5:23 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t know, but I’ve been told
That J.P. can be so bold
If you've read this far...seek help.
by ThePeerless on Oct 27, 2009 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I see what you’re saying, but how do you have a complete and fair look at secondary scoring without considering scoring from the blueline?
Never lie, steal, cheat, or drink. But, if you must lie, lie in the arms of the one you love. If you must steal, steal away from bad company. If you must cheat, cheat death. If you must drink, drink in the moments that take your breath away.
by gotsparkly on Oct 27, 2009 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Because we’re looking at the forwards. The dismal lack of production from the blueline (with the obvious exception) is another topic for another day. In other words, it’s fair to be critical of David Steckel for not scoring, but to be critical of Shaone Morrisonn for not doing so doesn’t make as much sense since, well, it’s to be expected.
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
by J.P. on Oct 27, 2009 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
I don’t know. I think it’s part of the same discussion, but hey, I don’t run this blog. No big, mon capitan.
Never lie, steal, cheat, or drink. But, if you must lie, lie in the arms of the one you love. If you must steal, steal away from bad company. If you must cheat, cheat death. If you must drink, drink in the moments that take your breath away.
by gotsparkly on Oct 27, 2009 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
In other words, it’s fair to be critical of David Steckel for not scoring, but to be critical of Shaone Morrisonn for not doing so doesn’t make as much sense since, well, it’s to be expected.
Testify!
"I'm just doing karate and trying to get females pregnant."
by Bald Pollack on Oct 27, 2009 11:44 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Poor Mo. There’s a 30-goal season just waiting to bust out of him, I can feel it.
by Becca H on Oct 27, 2009 12:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
AO must have five or six ready to claw their way out just tonight. Two whole games without even a sniff at the net.
IS PAЯTY NOW
by Your Nation's Capital on Oct 27, 2009 12:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
buy your hats early to avoid long lines, people!
by RedBirdie on Oct 27, 2009 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I heard you can buy them for $5 from the gent in front of the Verizon Center.
Maybe play with an edge, be a little more physical -- maybe be more of a prick out there.
by jordanDC on Oct 27, 2009 12:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I have one of those hats!
When Hell freezes over, I'll play hockey there, too.
by Steck It Out on Oct 27, 2009 1:58 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
Terrible embroidery.
Maybe play with an edge, be a little more physical -- maybe be more of a prick out there.
by jordanDC on Oct 27, 2009 2:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The beak is lopsided like who-knows-what.
When Hell freezes over, I'll play hockey there, too.
by Steck It Out on Oct 27, 2009 2:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Clearly pirated. You should feel great shame.
Maybe play with an edge, be a little more physical -- maybe be more of a prick out there.
by jordanDC on Oct 27, 2009 2:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That I do. Sniff I AM a bargain hunter Sniff
When Hell freezes over, I'll play hockey there, too.
by Steck It Out on Oct 27, 2009 3:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think I will refrain from bringing a hat, because that’ll jinx it, every time :)
Never lie, steal, cheat, or drink. But, if you must lie, lie in the arms of the one you love. If you must steal, steal away from bad company. If you must cheat, cheat death. If you must drink, drink in the moments that take your breath away.
by gotsparkly on Oct 27, 2009 1:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
From where I sit, it wouldn’t matter. I don’t know if my hat would even make it to the first row of the 400’s, never mind to someone in the 100’s who could actually throw it over the netting.
by gfcaps fan on Oct 27, 2009 2:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Mine would probably land in the zamboni tunnel :)
Never lie, steal, cheat, or drink. But, if you must lie, lie in the arms of the one you love. If you must steal, steal away from bad company. If you must cheat, cheat death. If you must drink, drink in the moments that take your breath away.
by gotsparkly on Oct 27, 2009 3:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Poor Mo. There’s a 30-goal season just waiting to bust out of him, I can feel it.
Only during the playoffs, then people will say he can do no wrong.
"I'm just doing karate and trying to get females pregnant."
by Bald Pollack on Oct 27, 2009 1:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I’d love to bring By the Numbers over, but I’ll have to ask Il Duce ;)
Maybe I can cajole these guys into letting me add it to the recap or something, we’ll see how it goes.
by Becca H on Oct 27, 2009 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
What do we want?
By the Numbers!
Where do we want it?
Here!
(And it should get its own tag. :: ahem ::)
IS PAЯTY NOW
by Your Nation's Capital on Oct 27, 2009 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Schultz had 5 goals in the 07-08 season, and between 12/8 and 12/17 (a span of 6 games) he had goals in three straight and 4 in 6. So it’s not unheard of.
by TJA on Oct 27, 2009 1:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Broken clock
Blind squirrel
Atta dinnin stick a who!
by Gould Old Days on Oct 27, 2009 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, yeah, of course. But the question was “who ever heard of Schultz getting points in two consecutive games?” Just pointing out that not only had he had points in two consecutive games, he had goals in three consecutive games. Just because it was a fluke, doesn’t mean it didn’t happen.
Interesting side note – that streak occurred shortly after Boudreau arrived, and I do remember some people speculating that maybe he had more offensive ability than he’d shown that was unlocked under Bruce’s system (ala Mike Green). That may have been the dark days when I was still reading the message board on the official, though.
by TJA on Oct 27, 2009 4:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Two of those goals were incredibly fluky, as I recall.
Maybe play with an edge, be a little more physical -- maybe be more of a prick out there.
by jordanDC on Oct 27, 2009 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Undoubtedly – we are talking about Jeff Schultz. But two of them were little half-slapshots from near the top of the circles.
by TJA on Oct 27, 2009 4:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Welcome!
And a great post!
Let's go Caps!
by MikeL-Caps on Oct 27, 2009 11:13 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
yay! Welcome aboard CapsChick! Awesome job.
by RedBirdie on Oct 27, 2009 11:13 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Yikes – thanks for all the welcomes, guys! I was trying to respond to all of you but I’m too slow…girly e-hug to all of you, I’m excited to join this crazy little community full time :)
by Becca H on Oct 27, 2009 11:24 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
We’re glad to have you here. Makes it easier to just bookmark one site. ;)
"Camaraderie, that's what the Washington Capitals are all about."
by CapitalCentre on Oct 27, 2009 11:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
and a girly e-hug back at ya! As head of the Sloan and Steckel Lobbies, as well as the “Female Caps Fans Who Kick Ass, and Who Are You Calling ’Fat,” Rookie?" club, we’re excited to see you at our little arugula-eating community full time!
by RedBirdie on Oct 27, 2009 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
wooo girly e-hugs all around :)
It really is a fantastic post. It’s nice to know that our third and fourth lines are really, doing what they’re supposed to and this whole secondary scoring business is coming around just fine.
On the other hand, you know what they say – always look up right? :D
by Vinn on Oct 27, 2009 11:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
our third and fourth lines are really, doing what they’re supposed to
I’m not sure that’s the takeaway here (b/c in my view, they’re not), but rather that “primary” scoring has gone from AO to AO and linemates to Young Guns to two lines and a defenseman.
The Caps still need some more offense from their bottom six forwards and all D who weren’t Norris finalists in 2009 or 2010 (i.e. Green and Schultz).
Japers' Rink: Hockey blogging from the most powerful city in the world
by J.P. on Oct 27, 2009 11:50 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Schutz for Norris!!
by mechanicsville on Oct 27, 2009 12:32 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
Schultz for green!
"And next year it will be ours."
by Ovechwin on Oct 27, 2009 12:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Schultz for Schultz!
"My face is my mask."
by jakeshapiro on Oct 27, 2009 12:49 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
true dat. Not saying that’s the takeaway so much as saying that it’s nice to know secondary scoring isn’t as a huge a deficiency as it’s being made out to be :) It’ll be nice (and necessary, methinks, come playoff time) to get more offense from the bottom six forwards, I was merely saying it’s nice at least we have “secondary” scoring in the sense that we know we don’t have to always look to AO to shoulder that gorilla of a burden. If we follow that evolutionary path – the offense will come :)
by Vinn on Oct 27, 2009 12:59 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Does anybody have numbers on what you can expect a year in scoring from your 3rd and 4th lines (on playoff and cup final teams)?
It seems to me that there’s a chance that our secondary scoring is just experiencing one of the numerous gaps in consistent scoring that defines why they are in fact… secondary. I would think every team, even good/great teams, has a (probably several) 10 game gap where their secondary scoring leaves a little to be desired.
God kills a kitten every time Sidney whines.
by Chris meet Alex on Oct 27, 2009 1:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
oh and, good post CC, welcome!
God kills a kitten every time Sidney whines.
by Chris meet Alex on Oct 27, 2009 1:19 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Take a look at the secondary scoring for the penguins so far this season… that’s what I’d like to see!
by JustJeff on Oct 27, 2009 1:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes, but back to my question… does the season-long story of good secondary scoring consist of periods of not much and other periods of excess? Or do good teams get consistent secondary scoring throughout the year.
Perhaps the good start by the Pens 3rd and 4th lines is one of the hot stretches and maybe they’ll soon go into a similar lull as to the one the Caps are in…
Seems like we aren’t asking what is a good benchmark, and thus I don’t know whether it’s time to start panicking. (And it’s ALWAYS good to know when it’s time to start panicking).
God kills a kitten every time Sidney whines.
by Chris meet Alex on Oct 27, 2009 2:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You know, it’s something we can definitely revisit as the season goes on. Because it’s true, I’m not sure what a good benchmark is for this kind of thing – the 10-game mark was all I had to work with this season but it’s subject to change, for sure.
If you judge good secondary scoring as 10-15 goals out of 3rd and 4th line guys, then on average they’d be scoring in one out of every eight games or so. And some guys are actually hitting that mark, some are ahead, some are behind (hence the average :P) – that makes it hard to pin down a benchmark.
And I don’t know about you, but I’m always panicking! I come off all cool and calm, sure, but come on – I’m a Caps fan. Panic is like oxygen to me.
by Becca H on Oct 27, 2009 2:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If you judge good secondary scoring as 10-15 goals out of 3rd and 4th line guys, then on average they’d be scoring in one out of every eight games or so.
But with 6 secondary scorers (bottom two lines) that’s about one secondary goal a game, which is something the Caps haven’t really seen.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
by Fehr and Balanced on Oct 27, 2009 3:15 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think because BB shuffles the lines around so much, we may not get that sort of stability on the 3rd and 4th lines. I’m not sure what Bylsma does with the Pens, but assuming he doesn’t shuffle the lines, he’s finding success with them, in part because the players there have gotten accustomed to each other’s style of play. Not saying that the Caps are inconsistent on the last two lines, but they’ll get used to both overachieving and underperforming.
When Hell freezes over, I'll play hockey there, too.
by Steck It Out on Oct 27, 2009 2:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Boudreau just seems to panic after a loss sometimes with regard to the lineup.
Maybe play with an edge, be a little more physical -- maybe be more of a prick out there.
by jordanDC on Oct 27, 2009 2:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Don't push the button
When Hell freezes over, I'll play hockey there, too.
by Steck It Out on Oct 27, 2009 3:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Hearty welcome to you, Chick.
This analysis lends a critical perspective in understanding in how Stanley Cup winners evolve: the contributions come from everywhere, and there are no shortcuts. The manner in which the goals are coming, i.e., from within 7 or 8 feet from the net, exemplifies that the guys are paying attention now. Who wouldn’t rather watch Aucoin bank one in off a defender’s shinpad than watch Semin majestically deke 3 players, curl and drag to infinity, then roof a screaming wrister that sends the water bottle flying? Ok – bad example.
The difference is now they expect to win.
Evolution, indeed.
by S h a g g y on Oct 27, 2009 11:50 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Well, I’ll cheerfully take ’em how they come. The 190-foot clear that Pavelec probably still sees in his nightmares, the Mike Green roofer and the dirty goals all count for one point each.
Never lie, steal, cheat, or drink. But, if you must lie, lie in the arms of the one you love. If you must steal, steal away from bad company. If you must cheat, cheat death. If you must drink, drink in the moments that take your breath away.
by gotsparkly on Oct 27, 2009 11:53 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I know I’m a bit late, but was up until around 4 this morning arguing with a Flyers fan. Anywho, to be a giant echo of a commenter, welcome aboard CapsChick!
"My face is my mask."
by jakeshapiro on Oct 27, 2009 11:51 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Nice work and welcome CapsChick.
Its nice to know that the wealth is being spread around but comparing this Caps team to the 07-08 team rings a bit hollow to me. Considering that the Caps are among the elite in the league, I wonder how Steckel and friends stack up against Staal and his linemates, or role players from Philly/San Jose/Detroit etc.
by Sct112 on Oct 27, 2009 11:57 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
It’s funny you should mention that, because this post was supposed to be a lot longer and instead might just be a multiple-parter…I really want to look at how this team compares to the others when you talk about goals from stars and goals from everyone else.
by Becca H on Oct 27, 2009 12:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Even longer than it is now? Jesus Christ.
Maybe play with an edge, be a little more physical -- maybe be more of a prick out there.
by jordanDC on Oct 27, 2009 12:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ha! Um…yes. I tend to get a little wordy.
But okay, point taken – I’ll try to shave a couple thousand words off my future posts, I promise!
by Becca H on Oct 27, 2009 12:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Substantial topics require substantial space to examine thoroughly. No one’s making anyone read anything. If people want shorter or less thoughtful stuff, there are places for that. So keep it up.
by TylerG on Oct 27, 2009 2:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
No one’s making anyone read anything.
All I can say is I sincerely hope you remember this statement in the future.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
by Fehr and Balanced on Oct 27, 2009 3:17 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
I’m only kidding. We need a sarcasm font.
Maybe play with an edge, be a little more physical -- maybe be more of a prick out there.
by jordanDC on Oct 27, 2009 3:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
There is.
"Baseball is drama with an endless run and an ever-changing cast." - Joe Garagiola
Chowdah Chatter - an outlet for my random thoughts and such.
by crabchowdah on Oct 27, 2009 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Awesome. Thats an even better tease that J.P.‘s this morning… I’m looking forward to it.
by Sct112 on Oct 27, 2009 12:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
well struck CC, and welcome aboard. It’s noteworthy that our alleged top six RW’s contributed a mere 4 goals out of 23 in 07-08 and zero out of 29 in 08-09 through this point…and this year it’s 11 out of 36. While I still feel Semin is better on the left side—particularly on the PP—his smooth transition to the right side has given Bruce a ton of flexibility.
from the house that Red Jesus built
by bigonetimer on Oct 27, 2009 11:59 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Three different ways to break apart this issue:
1. We’re only having a “lack of secondary scoring” discussion because Fehr and Flash started off the season injured
2. (with limited sample) Aucoin and Giroux also seem able to provide it, with some consequence at our own end
3. Much of the angst leading to this topic is around David Steckel, not fulfilling hopes from last postseason, and not even creating great chances (to then call him snake-bitten)
We wouldn’t be having this discussion if F/F weren’t injured, A/G had been up all year, or Stecks had two goals.
by six hole on Oct 27, 2009 12:09 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I disagree, because whoever is going on the ice in any given game should be expected to attend to their responsibilities, up to and including scoring. Especially on a championship-caliber team.
IS PAЯTY NOW
by Your Nation's Capital on Oct 27, 2009 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Fair point, but then we’ll always have a salary cap and implications thereof. And we’ve skated Quintin Lang every game, Boyd Kane, Tyler Sloan, and Boyd Gordon, and not kept Aucoin/Giroux up because of waiver management. And lost Chris Bourque to salary cap / waiver chances / GM fail depending on your take. Granted we should expect some player-games to be lost to injury during the season and still compete but there has to be some graded curve based on the personnel.
I’m more concerned that overall the Caps aren’t dominating Shots On Goal like they should be; Brooks Laich has looked pretty meh at best after the opening two games; and Chris Clark isn’t getting it done. The rest just feels like statistical variation.
by six hole on Oct 27, 2009 12:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I disagree, because we’re Caps fans and there’s always something to fret about :)
Never lie, steal, cheat, or drink. But, if you must lie, lie in the arms of the one you love. If you must steal, steal away from bad company. If you must cheat, cheat death. If you must drink, drink in the moments that take your breath away.
by gotsparkly on Oct 27, 2009 1:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
1) Welcome! Sorry if this has been addressed but we wonder how the Caps ‘secondary scoring’ (or lack there of) compares with their Conference rivals?
2) Most fans of their team only look at the prism though their team’s lense Perhaps the Caps are not alone in having a team top heavy in scoring, or are infact not as bad off as some others?
I find sometimes it's easy to be myself
sometimes I find it's better to be somebody else
by Fauxrumors on Oct 27, 2009 12:21 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
There is a plan afoot for a sequel of sorts, looking at the Caps as they compare to other teams in the division, conference and league in general. I totally agree that, as much as we worry about lack of secondary scoring, other teams may be just as bad off if not worse. Atlanta comes to mind…
by Becca H on Oct 27, 2009 12:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
poor Atlanta. Ilya out for 4-6 weeks, sigh. You start to wonder if the hockey god just hate them, or really hate them.
by RedBirdie on Oct 27, 2009 12:38 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think it’s that they really, really hate them. I never thought I’d feel sorry for the Thrashers, but this really is a tough blow for that team.
And for Kovalchuk, who is admittedly starting to grow on me. Being out for at least a month is going to put a damper on what has been a great start for him.
by Becca H on Oct 27, 2009 12:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I really like Kovy actually (as an aside, I think AO could really stand to take a few pointers esp regarding when to shoot)… and I think it’s his contract year right?
I guess it’s time for Little and Kane to step up again then. Chin up Thrashers, at least you aren’t the Islanders yeah? :D
by Vinn on Oct 27, 2009 1:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah, its a contract year.
I like Kovy because he quietly goes about his business, doesn’t whine about being in Atlanta, and seems like a real stand-up sort of guy.
by RedBirdie on Oct 27, 2009 1:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Redirect
I wanted to reply here but it got long so I made a fanpost in response.
My definitions are simmplified but in ‘08-’09 the Caps were definitely the most unbalanced in terms of scoring, compared to their peers (top nine in the league). But I didn’t try to define secondary scoring the way you have here …
by six hole on Oct 27, 2009 6:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Welcome CapsChick. You can now include AP photos in your posts. That’s gotta be pretty cool, no?
"If you're gonna die after 24, might as well jump out at 23:59, no?"
by Laich It Or Lump It on Oct 27, 2009 12:27 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Actually, that’s the main reason I joined up with Japers’ Rink!
But yes, it’s very cool :) And if you’ve ever seen the sad, pathetic, grainy little pictures I’ve tried to take and post myself you’d know just how cool.
by Becca H on Oct 27, 2009 12:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t mean to suggest this should have been in the post, but I think it’s interesting to consider the subject within the context of the salary cap. If anything, secondary scoring is extra-important now because, well, the league/PA have effectively tried to spread out scorers amongst the teams. It’s almost impossible to have a 20G veteran on a third line these days…
by TylerG on Oct 27, 2009 1:01 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
The importance of this, getting production from everywhere, cannot be overstated. And eventually, your Laichs, Flashes, Nyla- er, strike that, become trade bait as you tighten up for the playoffs.
by S h a g g y on Oct 27, 2009 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It really can’t be. Tyler brings up a great point – one that I unceremoniously hid by accident, sorry about that Tyler – that with the cap (in theory) spreading talent around equally it’s the guys who chip in 10-15 goals a year that become the most important.
And hey, that NMC expires after this season…so you never know.
by Becca H on Oct 27, 2009 1:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
From Caps Insider: talk about spreading it around -
"hope that Acoin will be skating on Ovie’s line – he did a great job last game.
Given the guys out, how ’bout these lines:
Ovechkin/Backstrom/Acoin
Giroux/Morrison/Semin
Clark/Laich/Knuble
Sloan/Steckel/Bradley".
I know, Clark on LW, but he’s a veteran, he can do it.
by S h a g g y on Oct 27, 2009 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ooof. No chance. Look at Giroux’s GAON, etc. (Clark’s too.) That line would be a disaster. He’s not a guy you want getting second-line time.
by TylerG on Oct 27, 2009 2:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He’s not a guy you want getting NHL time.
Fixed that for you…
by Becca H on Oct 27, 2009 2:05 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Yeah. Amen. The BehindtheNet.ca data (down as of this typing, of I’d link) on Rooster in 2009-10 is… gasp-worthy.
by TylerG on Oct 27, 2009 2:24 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Put Aucoin on a line with Giroux – they seemed to have good chemistry in the Atlanta game (probably via Chocolatetown).
When Hell freezes over, I'll play hockey there, too.
by Steck It Out on Oct 27, 2009 2:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I get that you don’t like his defense, but what else are you trying to say? He’s been on the ice for 14:39, for one goal against (Aucoin assisting Kovy), and two for. Really small sample.
by six hole on Oct 27, 2009 2:41 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Corsi?
ah
http://www.behindthenet.ca/2009/new_5_on_5.php?sort=6§ion=corsi&mingp=&mintoi=&team=WSH&pos=
Shots for / against? 4.6:41.4 per 60
Looks like he’s had the only shot for us while he’s been on the ice. In his defense, he did score :-)
by six hole on Oct 27, 2009 2:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That’s awesome stuff, Becca and JP! Congrats!
by Rob Yunich on Oct 27, 2009 1:33 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Awesome stuff, Rebecca. JP is lucky to have you aboard.
tictactoehockey.blogspot.com
myunjustifiedego.blogspot.com
by turnituptoeleven on Oct 27, 2009 1:45 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I’m not sure he’d agree, but thanks ;)
(And love the user name…why don’t you just make ten louder?)
by Becca H on Oct 27, 2009 2:36 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Because eleven is louder than ten.
Never lie, steal, cheat, or drink. But, if you must lie, lie in the arms of the one you love. If you must steal, steal away from bad company. If you must cheat, cheat death. If you must drink, drink in the moments that take your breath away.
by gotsparkly on Oct 27, 2009 3:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
… these go to eleven.
"If you're gonna die after 24, might as well jump out at 23:59, no?"
by Laich It Or Lump It on Oct 27, 2009 4:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Excellent news! Welcome. I loved your site so much I bought Briere’s Hockey Reference page just so I could sponsor it with the magical spearing midget. Alas, it expired…
"Let the rest be scared of us." - Sasha Semin
by Scott in Shaw on Oct 27, 2009 2:04 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Ah, so that was you! I remember that – that was awesome, I remember cracking up when I saw it. What a great tribute :)
And it may have expired, but let the memory of the magical spearing midget live on in all our hearts…or something.
by Becca H on Oct 27, 2009 2:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
the memory of the magical spearing midget getting destroyed by Ovie lives on in my heart……..my cold, shrunken black heart.
by RedBirdie on Oct 27, 2009 2:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Welcome aboard CC
Nice to break up the sausage party.
If consequences dictate the course of action, then it doesn't matter what's right, it's only wrong if you get caught. If consequences dictate the course of action, then I should play God...
by Fehr and Balanced on Oct 27, 2009 3:24 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Great stuff. I always kind of mean to head over to the cheap seats, but then I forget and end up just cruising over here unless someone links over there, and then I remember how much I like it (and promptly forget again). I also missed a lot of Pepper’s and DMG’s and Tuvan’s great posts before they joined for the same reasons. This is great for lazy fools like me.
Agree 100% with the post, by the way. There aren’t many teams who count 7 gentlemen among their “primary” scoring.
Atta dinnin stick a who!
by Gould Old Days on Oct 27, 2009 4:30 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Yes but...
RE: " Of those 36 goals, only 8 have come from someone besides the top two lines and Green (and five of those came last Thursday in Atlanta)."
I would ask how many other teams have 8 or more goals from their “secondary scoring” in the first 10 games of this season?
by markbona-capsfan99 on Oct 27, 2009 4:46 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I’ll venture the Rags do.
from the house that Red Jesus built
by bigonetimer on Oct 27, 2009 6:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yup, the Rags do indeed – but they might be one of the few. I think we’ll be revisiting this soon to talk about how the Caps compare to the rest of the league, don’t you worry!
by Becca H on Oct 28, 2009 9:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
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Southeast Standings
| GP | W | L | OTL | PT | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
Washington
|
22 | 13 | 5 | 4 | 30 |
|
Tampa Bay
|
19 | 8 | 4 | 7 | 23 |
|
Atlanta
|
18 | 10 | 6 | 2 | 22 |
|
Florida
|
20 | 9 | 9 | 2 | 20 |
|
Carolina
|
21 | 4 | 12 | 5 | 13 |
(updated 11.21.2009 at 8:36 AM EST)
Certain photos copyright © 2009 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
